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Old December 4, 2006, 01:24 PM   #26
Samurai
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I knew a guy once who inadvertently placed his hand on the eye of a stove. He quickly realized that remaining where he was at the time was going to be a painful experience that would surely lead to irreparable injury to himself. (Translation: He burned his hand.) Know what he did? He MOVED HIS HAND!

Bruce Lee said that the best way to block a punch is to not be there when it is thrown. If this is the kind of place that this person lives in (gang wars "spill" over into the neighborhood), then I would move. Move to a more defensible location in a quieter part of town.

Sure, you have the right to defend your home if you want to, but a home like that would NOT be worth defending.
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Old December 6, 2006, 07:40 PM   #27
stephen426
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I think you guys are jumping the gun by telling him to move. Would you leave a house and neighborhood you liked because some punks wanted to take over?? That doesn't sound like TFL guys at all. I would organize a neighborhood crime watch and involve the police. Let these jerks know that they are not wanted and that they will be met with "strong" resistance.

One of the most important things in fighting neighborhood crime is having neighbors that give a crap about each other and are willing to do something about it. This may be as simple as reporting suspicious behavior to going out an actually confronting the perpetrators. I'm sure there are neighborhood kids that live there. Do you want them to be victims of these thugs or worse, fall under their influence? I say fight back and bring in the calvary with you.

For the guy who got robbed at gun point at 1 a.m., I say he needs to vary his schedule a bit and have someone waiting for him when he gets home. My mother-in-law got robbed a few months back when she came home from closing their restaurant. These punks stalk their victims and they monitor their comings and goings. I would not be suprised if they even had someone tailing her when she left. If a family member were to be at the door waiting for her and come out a few minutes before she got home, it might be enough to scare them off. It could also lead to hostage situations where the bad guys get inside the house, but that could happen regardless.

I say get a good guard dog, maybe even a pair of them to give you some early warning. Keep your property well lit and trim back trees and shrubbery that will give bad guys a place to hide. Vary your schedule, or better yet, don't bring money home with you. Leave it in a drop safe in the business and take it to the bank the next day. My-mother-in law is very fortunate that she was not seriously injured. My father-in-law has a gun, but he never practices and he might be even more of a liability.

It is your house and your neighborhood. You need to fight for what is yours. I say don't let these jerks win by scaring you off. Most importantly, bring your neighbors in on this and set up a watch. Maybe even conduct "safety evaluations" for your neighbors such as property lighting and concealing shrubbery. Good luck and I hope you have some good news for us in the near future.
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Last edited by stephen426; December 8, 2006 at 01:02 AM.
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Old December 7, 2006, 01:53 AM   #28
gvf
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Thanks Again All:

Great thanks for all the advice. I gave you a number of very violent incidents - and we are concerned here. However, the neighborhood is evolving with this recent "bleed" from gang wars in one area to another a big exception. The usual measure of disintegrration: robbery, rape, abadandoned homes etc. is LESS. No abandonded homes. Property values up over the last couple of years.

But: youth gang activity, including murder - frequently seen in drive-by shootings in a very problematic area away from us but still relatively close - has jumped. It seems recent and devastating. The cops do their best - they are good. But they aren't God, especially with these random incidents. They were hear in a prayer when I called the night I mentioned. I even called up their supervisor after to tell him how fast and professional they were. But cops can't read the future, only the past.

We do have block associations and many have auto lights (and the person downstairs has a guard dog, a Bouivier de Flanders, that has THE most frightening bark I have ever heard from any dog-breed anywhere in my life. A BG would have to be out of his mind to get near it, or even in the back, once this bark is heard. The deepest bark on any dog imaginable - The 45 Colt Auto of dog-barks, and he is BIG.)

So, a very odd situation, sudden danger appearing, then it's back to normal.
Jarring.

Hopefully I'll get the CCW. It's NY, so you need more than random danger of death. But I have other factors that I hope will let them see light on this. And this should give me a bit greater sense of security IF......

If not, there's always: THE DOG!

Best

Last edited by gvf; December 7, 2006 at 02:30 AM.
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Old December 7, 2006, 10:17 AM   #29
newerguy
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As far as the carry permit, if you are in NYS, it depends on what county you are in. Some counties have judges that still issue unrestricted permits right off the bat, and some judges require you to jump through a few extra hoops, but eventually issue you a permit (common ones are extra training, staying out of trouble for so many months or years, getting a certain ammout of range time in, etc.)
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Old December 7, 2006, 11:55 AM   #30
threegun
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I would probably comply. If they shoot me anyway they better not give me their backs. If they do they better hope the shot incapacitated me.
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Old December 7, 2006, 12:14 PM   #31
zzirg
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what to do with situation

I would run and draw at the same time running creates a moving target which is harder to hit ,if they have guns drawn they have already used them to manipulate you and you must turn the situation around because the likelyhood of them shooting you is already present. If you are at a stage where your asking yourself what would you do?thats a good thing but you need to get to a stage where you know beforehand what you will do.Gun in the hands of bg's, means no matter what you must draw down on them at some point as soon as possible.... period.(assuming your possitive it's a bad guy).
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Old December 7, 2006, 12:32 PM   #32
raggededge
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Here in the fine state of Illinois we are not permitted to possess firearms on our person on in our vehicles. If I were greeted by multiple armed assailants upon exiting my car, I would have little recourse.
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Old December 7, 2006, 12:45 PM   #33
buzz_knox
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Quote:
If this is the kind of place that this person lives in (gang wars "spill" over into the neighborhood), then I would move. Move to a more defensible location in a quieter part of town.
The problem is . . . where is a quieter part of town? Many people don't realize how much crime occurs near the quieter parts, nor do they realize that as long as one remains in/around cities, how close they are to the rough areas.
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Old December 8, 2006, 01:54 AM   #34
King_chin0
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I have read a few of the post, I think this is a situation you should just count as a L, because the odds are all against you. "They had guns drawn against you" the keyword there is they, which means multiple barrels are drawn on you, lets say each guy only had a 9mm of 13 rds and no extra mags, thats 39rds altogether, and you might have a .45acp or whatever the hell you got, doesn't matter, they win. Yes, there are multiple incidents that after the surrendering of $ still leads to violent act or death. Most of those cases, there is a story behind it, a guy demanding money would rather go to jail over a robbery, then for murder.

My cousin living in Boston was recently robbed of his cell phone and a few dollars of cash. Three male approached him, asked him whether or not he has any money on him, my cousin forked over the money and the guy took his cell, and just walked away and said thank you. This incident tells me that if you don't try anything "stupid" you have a chance to avoid getting hurt.

Likewise, someone on here said run and take a chance, most likely, by the third or second step, they would've shot you for any sudden movements.

AS far as the Bouivier de Flanders, I don't know too much about them, I do know one thing, although many people dislike pitbulls, but they are one hell of a guard dog, and it will shred your @$$ to pieces.

One of the ways I can think of right now is in a situation as you have mentioned, multiple bad guys. One shall be very close to you with gun drawn, and the other two will be further away, maybe around 6 to 7 feet away. Cause a distraction which doesn't include you in it, like setting off the alarm on your car with the panic button in your hand, when they look over, push the gun's muzzle away from your body, use the closer BG as human shield, and turn his gun on his two buddies, then snap the BG in your arms neck, James Bond style.
but to be serious, after causing the diversion, lets say the BG is facing you, push his gun above his left shoulder quickly with both arms, with your right hand on his gun, chop him in the neck hard with your left hand, this will cause him to be disable for about 10-20 seconds most, losing the grip of his gun, now his gun is in your hand(no need to draw your weapon, use what is available and already there) fire shots at his pals, and shoot at the BG you just disabled, run while firing and duck behind your car, after ducking for cover, you have your weapon and the BG's weapon, giving you a better chance of survival, then everything else is up to you, whether you live or die, think smart, and stratigically. And you might have a chance to live and tell the tale
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Old December 10, 2006, 09:22 PM   #35
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