OK!, I caught the HS2000 bug?? Convince me to buy it!

Alright, tell me about this weapon. Is it good? Is it reliable? Is it a good carry gun? If any problems arise, will i have a recourse to get it repaired or replaced? I have found one for $279 plus shipping. I know thats a good deal. I just need some of you HS2000 owners to convince me to shell out the dough... Tell me no lies, lol, is it a good gun??????

[Son of HK]

If you are unsure, do you really think it's a good idea?
Save the money for an HK.

[rblack]

Gun has a good trigger, is combat accurate, and hasn't malfunctioned in over a thousand rnds using all kinds of ammo. What more could you want?

[Cyric13]

The address is

http://www.hs2000talk.com/

Lots of info and get the gun.

Cyric

[David Scott]

Usually, when something new comes out, there's a few people who slam it. I have heard no slams on the HS2000, and much praise. So what? There are a lot of good guns out there. How's this for a reason:

The HS2000 comes from Croatia, formerly a part of Yugoslavia. These folks are out from under the repressive rule of the Soviet Bloc and they need to make a go of it. They make a good product at a good price, so buying an HS2000 is a good way to help the Croatian economy get and stay healthy. Countries with healthy economies, profitable industries, and good paying jobs are less likely to be trouble, internally or to the rest of the world.

So, by buying an HS2000, you are contributing to peace.

[bastiat]

I plan on making a purchase for peace tomorrow when the HS2000 comes into my dealer. As soon as they add more calibers, I will further contribute to the peace movement.

[jtduncan]

Have you guys handled or shot one of these? Combat accuracy means being able to hit a man-sized target. Even a Jennings is "combat accurate."

I carefully inspected a HS2000. My findings . . .

Sights like an EAA Witness.

Fit and finish like an Intratec CAT-9 or a HiPoint compact 9mm.

Manufactured in a country with political unrest. Could parts and service be a problem? Think so. Look at what happened to Star Firearms of Spain? Fit and finish exceeding Glock/HK/Sig standards but parts and a dimished attraction for big guns with lo-cap killed their fine pistols.

Kind of like the situation with the Tressitu TZ-99, the Sig P226 knock-off that came in with a roar but left with a whimper back to South Africa.

I don't know about you, but I'm worth an HK P7. If you want to be cheap with your life, go ahead. But I'm going with the tried and true guns.

If you're looking for a reliable and proven 9mm, buy a new Ruger P95 or a used Glock, Sig, HK, or Beretta. But I won't be throw my money at it. If it stinks, you have little resale value.

But if you'd like the support Crotia or you just HAVE to spend the money, the "Habeaus Sucker" 2000 is a great gun.

[Mr986]

To counter jtduncan's less than glowing remarks, I offer the following remarks after having fired about 250 rounds through mine:
1--about the size and weight of a G19; very similar trigger and points like a glock. Short trigger pull, very quick reset--nice gun for IDPA. The sights work for me--after market sights available--ashley, mepr--for those that want alternatives.

2- Good finish,appearance wise, not sure of the longevity of whatever cote is applied.

3-Reliable to this point; only time will tell how long it will function with a lot of use.

I'd suggest anyone considering it to visit the HS chat board; a lot of Glock owners are buying them--that in of itself should say that it has impressed some very particular gun owners. For roughly $259, I thought it was a real buy. Your mileage may vary...

[jtduncan]

Reliability is determined by numbers in the 100s.

I prefer products made by ISO 2001 certified companies. Crotia probably doesn't even know about that.

One positive singular experience is insufficent.

Present 100 + good reports on the HS2000 after 50K rounds and I will juggle rat turds for you.

Look no gun is perfect. Well maybe the HKP7s. But the rest have mechanical and engineering challenges.

But a couple of good reports mean little statistically.

[jtduncan]

A couple of guys on GlockTalk is NOT a lot. Most have said they'll look at it. But they're not posting BUY messages on GT.

[bastiat]

What does ISO 9001 mean? It means you have a documented process. You may make a complete piece of junk, but as long as you have a well documented procedure for making said junk, we'll give you ISO 9001 certification.

By your estimation, you should never buy an unproven product. Therefore, a product is never purchased until it is proven. And it will never be able to be proven, because of the previous prohibition on buying unproven products.

What we are doing (my dealer should be getting a shipment in tomorrow so I include myself in the 'we') is buying what has shown to be from many reports, not just a few, is a very reasonably priced, well made pistol. What you are doing is badmouthing anyone who dares to buy it, because we don't value our life (as determined by how much we spend on another gun) as much as you do. From most posts, many people have picked it up as an additional gun. Since it's not sized for ccw, most people probably won't be 'trusting their life' with it. Rather, they'll be shooting it at the range. So the main complaint you have seems to boil down to 'you're not spending enough for a gun'.

We are the ones who will be putting thousands of rounds through these new pistols and testing them out. Sure, we won't have the satisfaction of spending as much money as you do, but we'll make up for it with extra ammo. We'll be kind enough to keep reporting back about our progress.

[rblack]

Fit and finish on mine is as good as any Glock, and combat accuracy is much smaller than a man size target

[jtduncan]

Enjoy them then. You've been warned. All that glitters is not gold.

But ask a gunsmith for his opinion on them.

I'll look for your posts in the Gunsmithing forum shortly.

[TonyPoulos]

I agree with Bastiat regards ISO. Just a paper pushing exercise fueled by consultants. Doesn't mean diddly. The Goodrich plant that produced those self-peeling wonder tires had a big sign out front - ISO Certified.

Tony

[bastiat]

jtduncan, I see you're a glock owner. When the glock first came out, did you say not to buy one because it hasn't been proven? Or was it fine to buy one since it costs an acceptably high amount of money?

And if you frequent glocktalk, you'll know that they're currently doing a group purchase - at least 20 so far and I see there's talk of another purchase in the near future.

While I appreciate your warnings, I also appreciate that sometimes you have to take chances on somewhat 'unproven' technologies. That's the only way technology moves forward - people with guts take calculated risks by using their brains to determine if the risk is worth the cost. In this instance, $260 for a pistol that many report to be reliable and accurate. I'm willing to take that risk, as many others have been. Please excuse us for daring to think the earth isn't flat.

If people followed your attitude, we'd still be shooting only muzzleloaders.

[Gumbo]

Ignore JT's hot air and lack of insight. He obviously has more money than scrupples. I have put over 1000 rounds through my HS in the 6 weeks that I have owned it. I had 2 failure to fires the first time out. Being a DAO pistol, I was trying to shoot it like a DA/SA and did not let the trigger fully reset after each shot. I corrected my technique and trained the proper manual of arms and have not had a single burp since. All parts of this firearm seem to not only be well engineered but engineered to be abused and used for a long time. the guide rails are beefier than the SIGPros. Accuracy is as good as I have seen from a stock pistol not including the SIG sport models. Yes, it does not cost the gross national product of a small Pacific Rim country, but that is not an indication of the quality of the firearm. Sometimes you get more than what you pay for...case in point...CZ's in all flavors. To put it simply, if the HS looks like it is something that you could enjoy...BUY IT AND LAUGH THE WHOLE WHILE YOU JUST ENJOY THE SNOT OUT OF IT AND THE LIKES OF JT SIT LOOKING AT YOU LIKE A CONSTIPATED MONKEY ON A PAY TOILET WITH A BENT NICKLE...some people will just not get it =)

PS:
No personal offense intended jt but your post was a little elitest and condenscending...neither of which make for good company.

[Mylhouse]

ROTFLMAO!!! If you don't mind, I'm going to use that monkey line!

Duncan,

Your comments and attitude resemble the turds you're going to juggle. Oh, and your old signature line about rat turds and rat farts was so cute and mature! You are a big time blowhard that sounds like a (I'll do Gumbo one better on the 'elitist' comment) freaking LIBERAL! I find many of your posts to be helpful in the least, you down guns that aren't on your personal inventory list, and in general, you are full of it (especially regarding your shooting abilities).

[ATeaM]

I heard this gun has an unusual safety system, can anyone verify this ?

How would it compare to a Witness polymer compact or a CZ PCR ?

BTW, I don't know about Croatia man...How long has this manufacturer been around ?

[denfoote]

It looks like an interesting pistol, but I own to many 9MM pistols as it is. I just don't need another one. I think I'll wait for the .45ACP version, thank you.

[BB]

jtduncan, on Star Firearms:
Fit and finish exceeding Glock/HK/Sig standards..

Hahahaha! Oh, gotta stop reading this board....I'm gonna bust something one of these days...

[Grapeshot]

As for the HS2000:

"But ask a gunsmith for his opinion on them."

JT, my gunsmith hates Glocks. Should I avoid them because of that?

The gunsmiths I have dealt with have in general been very opinionated and arbitrary about what they want to work on, and I'm sure parts availability, ease of repair, and personal experience with the firearms in question are all factors. Most of all, they hate guns that don't need/can't receive 'smithing, since they can't make any money off of them.

As for the Croatians not knowing how to build a 9 mm, well, I don't think building a good 9mm these days is rocket science, is it? If EAA can do it, surely they can.

As for the fabulous HS2000 itself, you guys will probably get what you pay for where this is concerned. Everyone says it's such a bargain, but for a measly $50 more you could get a used S&W 6906, which has a proven track record of reliability and has beaucoup parts availbility and accessories. Heck, for the same price as an HS you could get a P95. So what's all the fuss about?

[bastiat]

"As for the fabulous HS2000 itself, you guys will probably get what you pay for where this is concerned. Everyone says it's such a bargain, but for a measly $50 more you could get a used S&W 6906, which has a proven track record of reliability and has beaucoup parts availbility and accessories. Heck, for the same price as an HS you could get a P95. So what's all the fuss about? "

1. Because it is $50 less for a brand new gun. Not a used one.
2. Someone has to be the first to try a new product before it become widely used. Chicken-and-the-egg comes to mind.

'I don't know why you want to buy one of those fancy automobiles. You can get a horse and buggy for less. There's a lot more buggy whip makers than car part makers. And how do you plan on getting gas wherever you go?????'

[TonyPoulos]

Some people make things happen, some people let things happen, and some people... buy a used S&W 6906 instead of a slick new HS2000. Isn't more choice a good thing?

Tony

[Cyric13]

Go over to the HS2000 forum address in the 2nd post. Out of all the people there I've heard two bad things, most about the Generation 1 guns and there not about FTF. If you don't want or like the HS2000 then don't knock it until you've tried it. I couldn't aford a brand new high end or used brand name 1911 so I bought a $335 Charles Daly A1 and it shot perfectly absolutely nothing wrong with it what-so-ever.m When GLock first came out a lot of people said they wouldn't last. Ignorance must be bliss.


Cyric

[jtduncan]

As I swallow deeply. . . maybe the HS200 is a nice gun.

But for $395, you buy a factory refurbished 9mm or 40SW Glock with a pair of hi caps. Now that's a deal.

But I don't buy unproven guns. Guns are different than PalmPilots. They can blow up and send schrapnel into your body.

The BCA Glock hi cap mags group purchase is a mess. The mags still aren't in the US after what . . . almost a year? I think they bought vaporzines.

Anway, I've got enough 9mm pitsols. But enjoy your HS2000.

Now I need a stiff drink. Pass the vodka . . .