Double Duty Pump with Ghost Ring Sights

TheKlawMan · December 22, 2010, 11:15 PM

I have been thinking about getting an 18" pump primarily for HD, but, of course, for some target shooting. As I am retiring I may try my hand at huniting, in which case it may be nice to have the option of slapping on a second barrel.

I have read about the pros and cons of ghost rings on an HD gun and do not want to discuss the subject as my mind is pretty well made up on that. My question is whether the same GRS HD gun can be used for fowling with a swapped barrrel. Would removing the sites from the receiver in order to mount a ribbed bead barrel be a PITA? Would that depend on how frequently I decide to turn it into a hunter (a couple vs. several times a year). I imagine if it turns out to be several times a year I will be picking up a dedicated fowling piece.

TIA

zippy13 · December 23, 2010, 04:45 AM

Good question. Glad you have the GRS vs no-GRS issued settled up front. I think it basically comes down to, what is your PITA threshold? From our previous exchanges, I don't think you're the kind of shooter who's reluctant to touch a screwdriver.

I'd avoid the tacti-cool Remingtons and Mossbergs with the P-rail mounts for the GRS -- they'll just complicate things. Stick with a standard screw anchored sight. The popular GRS's require you to drill and tap your receiver for the 2-screw mounting. You could use allen head or torx screws to minimize the possibility of screwdriver slips. When you swap to the rib barrel, it will take only a moment to remove the GRS to clear the receiver.

Another option is the Williams-type GRS. They divorce the sight from the base, so you could use a side mounted base and avoid drilling the receiver top.

TheKlawMan · December 23, 2010, 03:26 PM

Thanks, zippy13. I am not sure what you mean by a Williams type GRS divorced from the base. Do you mean the FP type sights that appear to mount on the side of the receiver? It would seem that a p rail mounted sight may be a lot simpler, especially if I were to get something like a mossberg which comes with the top of the receiver drilled. Of course if I get lucky I may be able to find something with sights.

BTW, I see where Prado rents shotguns by the day. I will get out there. The only place neared for shooting SG is the sherriff's range in Anaheim.

oneounceload · December 23, 2010, 06:47 PM

Williams is a long-established company that makes excellent (what us old folks called) Peep sights........now aka ghost ring

Depending on your hunting, like turkey or deer where you are using the shotgun as a rifle, then GR may help......if you are talking about upland birds on the wing, the simple bead will be all you need.

zippy13 · December 23, 2010, 07:08 PM

When I checked out the Williams site, I came up with their GR aperture:

Other GRS sets may be gun specific, but Williams has a separate aperture that fits a number of bases. I thought they had a base unit that was a generic side mount for applications like shotguns and lever rifles. But, now I've learned, the ghost ring aperture fits existing WGRS receiver sights.

TheKlawMan · December 23, 2010, 08:29 PM

Oneounceload. That was my understanding; that hunting deer and turkey, and pernaps hogs, would all GRS would be good for and the basic bead does for fowling. For HD they seem to be a toss up.

Zippy13. Those were all I saw from Williams. While I want GRS, if I can't find a deal with them that is something to later ad. Its just a shame what you might end up paying for sights and gunsmithing

rigby06 · December 24, 2010, 05:54 PM

Hawk 982, I believe it is made by Norinco, it is basically a Remington 870, built like a tank, I bought one a while back, 5+ 1 magazine tube, 20' barrel and ghost rings $210 brand new. That is not bad

here is a basic picture of one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Norinco_HP9-1.jpg

TheKlawMan · December 24, 2010, 08:56 PM

rigby06. Actually, I have been looking pretty closely at the Hawk, even though it bugs me that it is Chines made. Supposedly it thrives on cheap WalMart loads, which causes me to wonder why any pump would have a problem with any kind of ammo. A semi, yes, but why a pump. Is it that some catch on high brass shells?

Dave McC · December 26, 2010, 10:26 AM

Some generic ammo has dimensions off spec, Klawman. Other stuff uses steel bases,which expand when fired like brass heads do but stay expanded rather than return to original dimensions like brass does.

Two of my WMs choke on Gun Clubs that run well through everything else here but run fine on the generic Walmart stuff that gives lots of pumps conniptions. Go figure.....

As for the Chinese stuff, with used 870s being neither uncommon nor expensive, that's the better option.

TheKlawMan · December 26, 2010, 01:25 PM

Dave MCC. Yeah, the Chinese stuff is a quick fix but I want something for a keeper that I may build on or leave to my son. I may actually enjoy cleaning up an old PD gun and have been reading about how to select one. One guy seeming to have some experience with them warns against buying them unseen since department armorers may salvage the better parts of the guns being surplused (like taking new tires off your trade in). The flip side of the coin being that other than training guns they don't get used much and most wear and tear is cosmetic (unless the armorer strips the good parts). Heck, mayber what I want is real POS department wreck for the right price that I can rebuild from the bottom up.

Dave McC · December 27, 2010, 08:18 AM

Two of mine started as agency weapons. Number Two was a cruiser gun and most of Frankenstein started off at the MD Pen. Both had some cosmetic issues,very minor on Two and not so minor on Frank, but work perfectly. Both are also WMs, not Expresses,FWIW.

LE turnins are almost all screaming deals. Some look rough, but work.

December 22, 2010, 11:15 PM	#1
TheKlawMan Junior member Join Date: June 23, 2009 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 2,149	Double Duty Pump with Ghost Ring Sights I have been thinking about getting an 18" pump primarily for HD, but, of course, for some target shooting. As I am retiring I may try my hand at huniting, in which case it may be nice to have the option of slapping on a second barrel. I have read about the pros and cons of ghost rings on an HD gun and do not want to discuss the subject as my mind is pretty well made up on that. My question is whether the same GRS HD gun can be used for fowling with a swapped barrrel. Would removing the sites from the receiver in order to mount a ribbed bead barrel be a PITA? Would that depend on how frequently I decide to turn it into a hunter (a couple vs. several times a year). I imagine if it turns out to be several times a year I will be picking up a dedicated fowling piece. TIA

December 24, 2010, 05:54 PM	#7
rigby06 Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2010 Location: Richmond VA Posts: 370	another one to consider Hawk 982, I believe it is made by Norinco, it is basically a Remington 870, built like a tank, I bought one a while back, 5+ 1 magazine tube, 20' barrel and ghost rings $210 brand new. That is not bad here is a basic picture of one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Norinco_HP9-1.jpg

December 23, 2010, 04:45 AM	#2
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	Good question. Glad you have the GRS vs no-GRS issued settled up front. I think it basically comes down to, what is your PITA threshold? From our previous exchanges, I don't think you're the kind of shooter who's reluctant to touch a screwdriver. I'd avoid the tacti-cool Remingtons and Mossbergs with the P-rail mounts for the GRS -- they'll just complicate things. Stick with a standard screw anchored sight. The popular GRS's require you to drill and tap your receiver for the 2-screw mounting. You could use allen head or torx screws to minimize the possibility of screwdriver slips. When you swap to the rib barrel, it will take only a moment to remove the GRS to clear the receiver. Another option is the Williams-type GRS. They divorce the sight from the base, so you could use a side mounted base and avoid drilling the receiver top.

December 23, 2010, 03:26 PM	#3
TheKlawMan Junior member Join Date: June 23, 2009 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 2,149	Thanks, zippy13. I am not sure what you mean by a Williams type GRS divorced from the base. Do you mean the FP type sights that appear to mount on the side of the receiver? It would seem that a p rail mounted sight may be a lot simpler, especially if I were to get something like a mossberg which comes with the top of the receiver drilled. Of course if I get lucky I may be able to find something with sights. BTW, I see where Prado rents shotguns by the day. I will get out there. The only place neared for shooting SG is the sherriff's range in Anaheim.

December 23, 2010, 06:47 PM	#4
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	Williams is a long-established company that makes excellent (what us old folks called) Peep sights........now aka ghost ring Depending on your hunting, like turkey or deer where you are using the shotgun as a rifle, then GR may help......if you are talking about upland birds on the wing, the simple bead will be all you need.

December 23, 2010, 07:08 PM	#5
zippy13 Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2008 Location: SoCal Posts: 6,442	When I checked out the Williams site, I came up with their GR aperture: Other GRS sets may be gun specific, but Williams has a separate aperture that fits a number of bases. I thought they had a base unit that was a generic side mount for applications like shotguns and lever rifles. But, now I've learned, the ghost ring aperture fits existing WGRS receiver sights.

December 23, 2010, 08:29 PM	#6
TheKlawMan Junior member Join Date: June 23, 2009 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 2,149	Oneounceload. That was my understanding; that hunting deer and turkey, and pernaps hogs, would all GRS would be good for and the basic bead does for fowling. For HD they seem to be a toss up. Zippy13. Those were all I saw from Williams. While I want GRS, if I can't find a deal with them that is something to later ad. Its just a shame what you might end up paying for sights and gunsmithing

December 24, 2010, 08:56 PM	#8
TheKlawMan Junior member Join Date: June 23, 2009 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 2,149	rigby06. Actually, I have been looking pretty closely at the Hawk, even though it bugs me that it is Chines made. Supposedly it thrives on cheap WalMart loads, which causes me to wonder why any pump would have a problem with any kind of ammo. A semi, yes, but why a pump. Is it that some catch on high brass shells?

December 26, 2010, 10:26 AM	#9
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Some generic ammo has dimensions off spec, Klawman. Other stuff uses steel bases,which expand when fired like brass heads do but stay expanded rather than return to original dimensions like brass does. Two of my WMs choke on Gun Clubs that run well through everything else here but run fine on the generic Walmart stuff that gives lots of pumps conniptions. Go figure..... As for the Chinese stuff, with used 870s being neither uncommon nor expensive, that's the better option.

December 26, 2010, 01:25 PM	#10
TheKlawMan Junior member Join Date: June 23, 2009 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 2,149	Dave MCC. Yeah, the Chinese stuff is a quick fix but I want something for a keeper that I may build on or leave to my son. I may actually enjoy cleaning up an old PD gun and have been reading about how to select one. One guy seeming to have some experience with them warns against buying them unseen since department armorers may salvage the better parts of the guns being surplused (like taking new tires off your trade in). The flip side of the coin being that other than training guns they don't get used much and most wear and tear is cosmetic (unless the armorer strips the good parts). Heck, mayber what I want is real POS department wreck for the right price that I can rebuild from the bottom up.

December 27, 2010, 08:18 AM	#11
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Two of mine started as agency weapons. Number Two was a cruiser gun and most of Frankenstein started off at the MD Pen. Both had some cosmetic issues,very minor on Two and not so minor on Frank, but work perfectly. Both are also WMs, not Expresses,FWIW. LE turnins are almost all screaming deals. Some look rough, but work.