Walther PPQ Sub Compact

Areoflyer09 · January 24, 2018, 09:06 AM

Walther has finally released a sub compact version of the PPQ.

http://www.waltherarms.com/handguns/ppq-sub-compact/

Barrel: 3.5”
Length: 6.6”
Height: 4.4”
Weight: 21.2oz
Capacity: 10/15 rounds

Looks like about a half inch smaller in length than a standard PPQ and an inch in height when using the flush mag. About an inch smaller in both measurements when compared to the PPQ Navy.

Overall just a touch smaller than a VP9 SK and just a bit bigger than a Glock 26.

I’m a fan of the PPQ line with having a Navy model myself and my wife has the standard model. I’ve been wanting something smaller than the Navy and the ability to have the control all be the same makes this a likely choice.

doofus47 · January 24, 2018, 11:18 AM

Not swapping my p99 AS compact.
For people already on the M2 bandwagon, I see the point.

JDBerg · January 24, 2018, 11:46 AM

It’s probably no coincidence that Walther released this PPQ subcompact within a day of Glock’s release of the Gen5 26. I really like my PPS-M2 and I see that they got the weight of this PPQ subcompact within 0.1 oz. of my gun, but with a longer barrel length (3.5” vs. 3.18”). I’d like to check one out!

Areoflyer09 · January 24, 2018, 12:11 PM

Comparing to the PPS is interesting.

Both have the same height with the lowest capacity mags, but the PPQ SC holds 4 more rounds than the PPS. Walther has released the height with 15-round magazine in the PPQ yet, but I’d bet it’s roughly an inch more and inline with a compact PPQ.

Length & width is .3” more on the PPQ SC, but with almost identical weights.

carguychris · January 24, 2018, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doofus47

Not swapping my p99 AS compact.

Understood, and IMHO it's actually kinda funny that they're taking a pistol that's effectively the exact same size as the P99c AS, which they've previously marketed as a compact, and they're calling it a "subcompact."

(Correspondingly, references to the P99c being a "compact" seem to have been strategically pruned from the Walther website.)

Of course, given the current popularity of subcompacts, it's unsurprising that their marketing department would want to call it that.

sigarms228 · January 24, 2018, 01:13 PM

Glad to see it being a Walther fan but I already got my HK P30SK LEM so I probably won't be getting the PPQ SC. Still I CCW my Walther PPS with 7 round magazine the most because for be the thinness of the PPS makes it ideal for longer term CCW comfort yet I can shoot my PPS very well.

I was hoping Walther had a third magazine option such as 12/13 rounds like HK has with the P30SK with 13 rounds. I usually CCW my P30SK with 13 round magazine as it gives me full grip but still very easy to conceal.

Curious watching a video that shows that the PPQ SC has an internal extractor unlike the PPQ and P99C that have external extractor.

My LGS has their annual factory shoot in March and I hope Walther has the PPQ SC with the so I can try it out.

Picture of PPQ SC.

VoodooMountain · January 24, 2018, 01:24 PM

For ppq guys this should be perfect.
But it will be hard for me to part with my 26 and pps

JDBerg · January 24, 2018, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sigarms228:

Still I CCW my Walther PPS with 7 round magazine the most because for be the thinness of the PPS makes it ideal for longer term CCW comfort yet I can shoot my PPS very well.

Agree 100%, although I CCW my own PPS-M2 with the 2 - 8 rd. accessory mags I have. I definitely wouldn’t replace a P30SK LEM for one of these, my own P30 V3 is one of my best & favorites, for whatever I want to use it for.

But I’m very interested in that PPQ SC, and if I find one with a nice trigger break like my PPS-M2, I’ll definitely make room for another Walther product!

Fishbed77 · January 25, 2018, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Not swapping my p99 AS compact.

I don't blame you.

Frankly, the AS trigger is much better suited for defensive use than the PPQ trigger (unless it's been changed for this compact model).

carguychris · January 25, 2018, 09:33 AM

^^^ I'd argue the same, but a lot of U.S. shooters don't understand paddle mags, and unfortunately, I believe the P99 AS suffers from being neither fish nor fowl; a lot of buyers don't know what to make of a DA/SA striker pistol with a peculiar third trigger mode.

Areoflyer09 · January 25, 2018, 11:33 AM

Fishbed77 - trigger is the same according to Walther’s website. What is that you don’t like about the PPQ trigger for defensive use?

The trigger is a selling point for me. The trigger would be more or less the same as the trigger in my Navy (range use/HD) and my wife’s compact. The same trigger & controls do make for an easy sell. Though I’m aware not everyone loves the PPQ trigger, I’ve gotten used to it as it’s my only striker fired and only 9mm. It’s become the new normal

I’d like to try the P99C AS trigger but I don’t know anyone that has a standard P99 let alone a P99C AS. I think if I wanted to stray from the PPQs, I’d end up with a HK P30 V3, I’ve gotten to try one of those and enjoyed it.

Fishbed77 · January 25, 2018, 11:34 AM

Quote:

^^^ I'd argue the same, but a lot of U.S. shooters don't understand paddle mags, and unfortunately, I believe the P99 AS suffers from being neither fish nor fowl; a lot of buyers don't know what to make of a DA/SA striker pistol with a peculiar third trigger mode.

HK manages to sell pistols with paddle mag releases, and the P99c AS manual of arms is the basically the same as any other DA/SA pistol.

The P99c AS's real problem is marketing. In that there was none. Either by S&W in years past or Walther America currently.

RobertSB701 · February 7, 2018, 07:34 AM

Hope Walther bridges gap between 10 & 15 rounds. A 12 round magazine would give a very nice range of choices.

wild cat mccane · February 7, 2018, 07:57 AM

The pin at the rear is holding together a new area made of plastic. This new area in the PPQ sc is steel in the PPQ and the P99c. Walther says it is to reduce weight, but the PPQ sc is the same weight as the P99c...so weight reduction is more likely a cost reduction.

All the guts are moved rearward.

A PPQ mag does NOT work with the PPQ sc without changing springs. The PPQ sc reciprocates the slide much faster and the mags springs are different. Not true with the P99 and the P99c.

Waltherforum shows so hesitation on this one.

I love the Walthers, but I am thinking this might not be kink free.

Fishbed77 · February 7, 2018, 09:07 AM

Quote:

A PPQ mag does NOT work with the PPQ sc without changing springs. The PPQ sc reciprocates the slide much faster and the mags springs are different. Not true with the P99 and the P99c.

If this is true, this puppy is DOA.

One of the beauties of the Glock and the P99 is the mag compatibly across the line.

Reminds me that I need to pick up a P99c AS one day.

Siggy-06 · February 7, 2018, 09:22 AM

I bought a P99c AS just last week and I like the trigger much better(in SA mode) than the full size PPQ's. Only paid $349 too. I'm considering a full size P99 now too. I'm sure a lot of PPQ owners will buy and enjoy the PPQsc.

Fishbed77 · February 8, 2018, 11:02 AM

Yikes. After seeing how Walther (or more likely Umarex in this case) bastardized the P99/PPQ design with the PPQsc, there is no way I will buy one:

http://www.waltherforums.com/forum/p...al-photos.html

All Walther had to do was chop some length off the barrel and grip and be done with it, but instead they essentially redesigned the entire pistol for reasons that can only be attributed to production cost-cutting (modular 9mm/.40 slide, plastic slide components, slide roll pin, two-part barrel, and mag incompatibility).

This thing is a total loser.

At one point, it seemed like Walther could do no wrong, but it seems like every choice or product they've made since the original PPQ has been a dumpster fire. This includes dropping the superior paddle release from the PPQ and PPS (and making the originals hard-to-find new), the hot steaming garbage that was the potmetal PPK/22 and the CCP, and the clunky PPX/Creed.

What has happened to the Walther we once knew and loved? At least the P99AS and P99cAS are still out there if you look hard enough.

.

Louca · February 8, 2018, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Yikes. After seeing how Walther (or more likely Umarex in this case) bastardized the P99/PPQ design with the PPQsc, there is no way I will buy one ...

I have a PPQ (M1) now and like it a lot. As a companion to the PPQ, I am looking for a somewhat more compact version of essentially the same thing. But for some reason, I am finding myself looking at the P99C instead of the PPQsc.

wild cat mccane · February 8, 2018, 01:10 PM

PPQ M1, P99, and P99c mags are interchangeable.

PPQ sc mags are PPQ sc spring specific.

Yeah. Walther is really trying, successfully, to be stupid.

carguychris · February 8, 2018, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishbed77

All Walther had to do was chop some length off the barrel and grip and be done with it, but instead they essentially redesigned the entire pistol for reasons that can only be attributed to production cost-cutting (modular 9mm/.40 slide, plastic slide components, slide roll pin, two-part barrel, and mag incompatibility).

What the hey who?!!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishbed77

...it seems like every choice or product they've made since the original PPQ has been a dumpster fire.

I'd argue that the Creed isn't that bad if you take the price point into account.

However, with the PPQsc, I must sadly presume that they're cutting costs to stay competitive on the U.S. commercial market.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishbed77

At least the P99AS and P99cAS are still out there if you look hard enough.

Amen!

I've been seriously contemplating the purchase of a P99c AS (I like the AS trigger). I was thinking that the PPQsc looks like an interesting alternative, but any chance that I would choose it over the P99c has just evaporated; I don't care how much lower the street price is.

Fishbed77 · February 8, 2018, 01:59 PM

Quote:

However, with the PPQsc, I must sadly presume that they're cutting costs to stay competitive on the U.S. commercial market.

I don't think this is the case at all, and here's why:

The basic P99/PPQ design dates back to 1997. Over 20 years. If they haven't amortized the cost of design/development/tooling/etc. on this design, they never will. The P99 was once a pricy pistol, but today P99s and PPQs sell for similar (or lower) prices than most competitors.

No - this is clearly a case of corporate greed on Umarex's part and nothing else. They are simply looking for higher profit margins on each pistol sold, to the point that they put the effort in to redesign the pistol (and severely compromise the design as a result) in a way that can only be meant to lower production costs. They are banking on a great name for sales, but in reality, are dragging that name through the mud.

carguychris · February 8, 2018, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carguychris

However, with the PPQsc, I must sadly presume that they're cutting costs to stay competitive on the U.S. commercial market.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fishbed77

I don't think this is the case at all, and here's why... The P99 was once a pricy pistol, but today P99s and PPQs sell for similar (or lower) prices than most competitors... this is clearly a case of corporate greed on Umarex's part and nothing else.

I think we're driving at the same point but just expressing it differently.

When I say that Walther is trying to stay competitive, I think their goal is to be able to sell the PPQsc for a lower price than the P99 and PPQ without having to slash profit margins to the bone.

I suspect that margins on the P99 and PPQ are already slim, particularly when you factor in recent movement in the Euro exchange rate, since Walther imports these pistols from Germany while many competitors make similar pistols in the United States. You're right that the P99 and PPQ are cheaper than they used to be; in my area, what was previously a $650 pistol is now a $550 pistol. My point is, their aim may be to sell the PPQsc for $500 or even $450 without losing money.

Call it greed, call it staying competitive. Same difference.

Fishbed77 · February 8, 2018, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Call it greed, call it staying competitive. Same difference.

It's just a shame to see Walther being dragged down the same road that has essentially destroyed Remington and other gunmakers that once made high-quality products.

Maybe I'll go shoot my AC43 P38 and P99 tomorrow afternoon and wistfully reflect on the Walther of old.

mrdaputer · February 11, 2018, 05:36 AM

Please why all the hate for the mag

. It would not stop me from buying a pistol that I loved and shot well

When you conceal and carry How many mags do you take with you anyway

wild cat mccane · February 11, 2018, 08:30 AM

Welp, the PPQ/P99 design is proven. Walther removed a piece and made it more modular for them to do 9mm/40. They also increased the slide speed.

Considering this gun was basically done with the P99c, any cheapening on their side for their own gain? It does raise questions for us on the reliability-ie, this is like a new gun that has to proven reliable.

January 24, 2018, 09:06 AM	#1
Areoflyer09 Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2017 Posts: 300	Walther PPQ Sub Compact Walther has finally released a sub compact version of the PPQ. http://www.waltherarms.com/handguns/ppq-sub-compact/ Barrel: 3.5” Length: 6.6” Height: 4.4” Weight: 21.2oz Capacity: 10/15 rounds Looks like about a half inch smaller in length than a standard PPQ and an inch in height when using the flush mag. About an inch smaller in both measurements when compared to the PPQ Navy. Overall just a touch smaller than a VP9 SK and just a bit bigger than a Glock 26. I’m a fan of the PPQ line with having a Navy model myself and my wife has the standard model. I’ve been wanting something smaller than the Navy and the ability to have the control all be the same makes this a likely choice.

January 24, 2018, 11:18 AM	#2
doofus47 Senior Member Join Date: June 9, 2010 Location: live in a in a house when i'm not in a tent Posts: 2,483	Not swapping my p99 AS compact. For people already on the M2 bandwagon, I see the point. __________________ I'm right about the metric system 3/4 of the time.

January 24, 2018, 11:46 AM	#3
JDBerg Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2015 Location: PA Posts: 1,835	It’s probably no coincidence that Walther released this PPQ subcompact within a day of Glock’s release of the Gen5 26. I really like my PPS-M2 and I see that they got the weight of this PPQ subcompact within 0.1 oz. of my gun, but with a longer barrel length (3.5” vs. 3.18”). I’d like to check one out! __________________ Words to Live By: Before You Pray - Believe; Before You Speak - Listen; Before You Spend - Earn; Before You Write - Think; Before You Quit - Try; Before You Die - Live

January 24, 2018, 01:13 PM	#6
sigarms228 Senior Member Join Date: October 29, 2011 Posts: 1,768	Glad to see it being a Walther fan but I already got my HK P30SK LEM so I probably won't be getting the PPQ SC. Still I CCW my Walther PPS with 7 round magazine the most because for be the thinness of the PPS makes it ideal for longer term CCW comfort yet I can shoot my PPS very well. I was hoping Walther had a third magazine option such as 12/13 rounds like HK has with the P30SK with 13 rounds. I usually CCW my P30SK with 13 round magazine as it gives me full grip but still very easy to conceal. Curious watching a video that shows that the PPQ SC has an internal extractor unlike the PPQ and P99C that have external extractor. My LGS has their annual factory shoot in March and I hope Walther has the PPQ SC with the so I can try it out. Picture of PPQ SC. __________________ “When the people find that they can vote themselves money that will herald the end of the republic.” ― Benjamin Franklin Last edited by sigarms228; January 24, 2018 at 02:05 PM.

January 25, 2018, 09:33 AM	#10
carguychris Senior Member Join Date: October 20, 2007 Location: Richardson, TX Posts: 7,523	^^^ I'd argue the same, but a lot of U.S. shooters don't understand paddle mags, and unfortunately, I believe the P99 AS suffers from being neither fish nor fowl; a lot of buyers don't know what to make of a DA/SA striker pistol with a peculiar third trigger mode. __________________ "Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules... MARK IT ZERO!!" - Walter Sobchak

January 24, 2018, 12:11 PM	#4
Areoflyer09 Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2017 Posts: 300	Comparing to the PPS is interesting. Both have the same height with the lowest capacity mags, but the PPQ SC holds 4 more rounds than the PPS. Walther has released the height with 15-round magazine in the PPQ yet, but I’d bet it’s roughly an inch more and inline with a compact PPQ. Length & width is .3” more on the PPQ SC, but with almost identical weights.

January 24, 2018, 01:24 PM	#7
VoodooMountain Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2014 Posts: 179	For ppq guys this should be perfect. But it will be hard for me to part with my 26 and pps

January 25, 2018, 11:33 AM	#11
Areoflyer09 Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2017 Posts: 300	Fishbed77 - trigger is the same according to Walther’s website. What is that you don’t like about the PPQ trigger for defensive use? The trigger is a selling point for me. The trigger would be more or less the same as the trigger in my Navy (range use/HD) and my wife’s compact. The same trigger & controls do make for an easy sell. Though I’m aware not everyone loves the PPQ trigger, I’ve gotten used to it as it’s my only striker fired and only 9mm. It’s become the new normal I’d like to try the P99C AS trigger but I don’t know anyone that has a standard P99 let alone a P99C AS. I think if I wanted to stray from the PPQs, I’d end up with a HK P30 V3, I’ve gotten to try one of those and enjoyed it.

February 7, 2018, 07:34 AM	#13
RobertSB701 Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2008 Location: Chicagoland Posts: 125	Hope Walther bridges gap between 10 & 15 rounds. A 12 round magazine would give a very nice range of choices. __________________ NRA MEMBER, ISRA MEMBER, IL CCL, LOCAL 701 MEMBER (United We Stand...Divided We Fall) Glock 21SF \| FNH FNP-45 \| S&W 686 \| Taurus PT1911SS \| CZ75 SP01 Tactical 9mm \| Buck Mark Stainless Camper \| Ruger LCP \| Springfield Armory TRP \| Springfield Armory XDS-9 \| Springfield Armory XDM Compact 9MM \| S&W M&P15X \| Ruger Mini-14 \| Mossberg 500 20ga

February 7, 2018, 07:57 AM	#14
wild cat mccane Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2011 Posts: 3,626	The pin at the rear is holding together a new area made of plastic. This new area in the PPQ sc is steel in the PPQ and the P99c. Walther says it is to reduce weight, but the PPQ sc is the same weight as the P99c...so weight reduction is more likely a cost reduction. All the guts are moved rearward. A PPQ mag does NOT work with the PPQ sc without changing springs. The PPQ sc reciprocates the slide much faster and the mags springs are different. Not true with the P99 and the P99c. Waltherforum shows so hesitation on this one. I love the Walthers, but I am thinking this might not be kink free.

February 7, 2018, 09:22 AM	#16
Siggy-06 Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2014 Location: Florida Posts: 1,148	I bought a P99c AS just last week and I like the trigger much better(in SA mode) than the full size PPQ's. Only paid $349 too. I'm considering a full size P99 now too. I'm sure a lot of PPQ owners will buy and enjoy the PPQsc. __________________ Flicks just like a lighter, just a different kind of fire.

February 8, 2018, 11:02 AM	#17
Fishbed77 Senior Member Join Date: November 23, 2010 Posts: 4,862	Yikes. After seeing how Walther (or more likely Umarex in this case) bastardized the P99/PPQ design with the PPQsc, there is no way I will buy one: http://www.waltherforums.com/forum/p...al-photos.html All Walther had to do was chop some length off the barrel and grip and be done with it, but instead they essentially redesigned the entire pistol for reasons that can only be attributed to production cost-cutting (modular 9mm/.40 slide, plastic slide components, slide roll pin, two-part barrel, and mag incompatibility). This thing is a total loser. At one point, it seemed like Walther could do no wrong, but it seems like every choice or product they've made since the original PPQ has been a dumpster fire. This includes dropping the superior paddle release from the PPQ and PPS (and making the originals hard-to-find new), the hot steaming garbage that was the potmetal PPK/22 and the CCP, and the clunky PPX/Creed. What has happened to the Walther we once knew and loved? At least the P99AS and P99cAS are still out there if you look hard enough. . Last edited by Fishbed77; February 8, 2018 at 11:08 AM.

February 8, 2018, 01:10 PM	#19
wild cat mccane Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2011 Posts: 3,626	PPQ M1, P99, and P99c mags are interchangeable. PPQ sc mags are PPQ sc spring specific. Yeah. Walther is really trying, successfully, to be stupid.

February 11, 2018, 05:36 AM	#24
mrdaputer Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2013 Posts: 493	Please why all the hate for the mag. It would not stop me from buying a pistol that I loved and shot well When you conceal and carry How many mags do you take with you anyway

February 11, 2018, 08:30 AM	#25
wild cat mccane Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2011 Posts: 3,626	Welp, the PPQ/P99 design is proven. Walther removed a piece and made it more modular for them to do 9mm/40. They also increased the slide speed. Considering this gun was basically done with the P99c, any cheapening on their side for their own gain? It does raise questions for us on the reliability-ie, this is like a new gun that has to proven reliable.