Bad Decision! - Page 4

RsqVet · August 4, 2011, 12:56 PM

To clear up one issue. Some have said that they would not shoot for a property crime. I agree. Property crime is I see someone stealing my car. I call PD and am a good witness. Armed robbery implies threat of death and thus one is 100% justified in use of deadly force to cease thus threat to you or others.

This is a very important point sone in this thread have blurred.

I also think the idea of sizing up the situation to see if the bg is "really" homocidal before deciding to act may be fatal. There are tons if folks dead and burried who complied with armed robbers, only to be eliminated from the witness pool or shot for bragging rights. Personally I think the biggest question is tactical. How can I best end this threat to my life, hoping it will go away is not an option.

Alaska444 · August 4, 2011, 01:19 PM

Quote:

RsqVet
Senior Member

Join Date: February 20, 2005
Posts: 1,953
To clear up one issue. Some have said that they would not shoot for a property crime. I agree. Property crime is I see someone stealing my car. I call PD and am a good witness. Armed robbery implies threat of death and thus one is 100% justified in use of deadly force to cease thus threat to you or others.

This is a very important point sone in this thread have blurred.

I also think the idea of sizing up the situation to see if the bg is "really" homocidal before deciding to act may be fatal. There are tons if folks dead and burried who complied with armed robbers, only to be eliminated from the witness pool or shot for bragging rights. Personally I think the biggest question is tactical. How can I best end this threat to my life, hoping it will go away is not an option.

+1, if the bad guy has threatened you with death or serious bodily harm, they have chosen their own course and their own destiny if they have accosted an armed CCW holder. You do have the right to self defense in almost every territory of this country, some more than others, but self defense is a legitimate legal standard in every state. Some have a higher level of proof than others, some have excellent castle doctrines that apply to a person's car as well, many don't.

45Gunner · August 4, 2011, 04:43 PM

I have carried for well over 40 years, both professionally and personally. Drawing my gun has and always will be a last resort. To use a gun to prevent a theft off a few bucks or even a car is not a viable option for me. It is why I pay for insurance. If someone draws a gun on me, however, my life is in immediate danger. I don't know if the other guy will never shoot or if he is a hopped up junkie who will pull the trigger without provocation.

I say kudos to the clerk for being fast and accurate. I think I would have done the same thing. Not only was the child out of the line of fire but think if the BG decided to open up for no other reason other than to leave no witnesses, the child would have been a goner.

The only thing I may have done different would have been to go out the door and get the BG. Once someone pulls a gun on me, I go from defensive to offensive. I want to eliminate the threat. In this particular scenario, the
BG could have gone outside to his car, reloaded and come back in. I would have stopped that from happening. That is not to say I fault the clerk for what he did, which in this case was be at the ready to protect the people behind the counter.

Brit · August 5, 2011, 05:40 AM

45 gunner/

Going from a well lit inside Office, to poorer lighting, outside? And maybe a partner/getaway driver, not me.

B/G outside, lying, dieing, me back lit, no Sir!

August 4, 2011, 04:43 PM	#78
45Gunner Senior Member Join Date: August 8, 2009 Location: Boca Raton, FL Posts: 1,902	I have carried for well over 40 years, both professionally and personally. Drawing my gun has and always will be a last resort. To use a gun to prevent a theft off a few bucks or even a car is not a viable option for me. It is why I pay for insurance. If someone draws a gun on me, however, my life is in immediate danger. I don't know if the other guy will never shoot or if he is a hopped up junkie who will pull the trigger without provocation. I say kudos to the clerk for being fast and accurate. I think I would have done the same thing. Not only was the child out of the line of fire but think if the BG decided to open up for no other reason other than to leave no witnesses, the child would have been a goner. The only thing I may have done different would have been to go out the door and get the BG. Once someone pulls a gun on me, I go from defensive to offensive. I want to eliminate the threat. In this particular scenario, the BG could have gone outside to his car, reloaded and come back in. I would have stopped that from happening. That is not to say I fault the clerk for what he did, which in this case was be at the ready to protect the people behind the counter. __________________ 45Gunner May the Schwartz Be With You. NRA Instructor NRA Life Member

August 4, 2011, 12:56 PM	#76
RsqVet Senior Member Join Date: February 20, 2005 Posts: 2,474	To clear up one issue. Some have said that they would not shoot for a property crime. I agree. Property crime is I see someone stealing my car. I call PD and am a good witness. Armed robbery implies threat of death and thus one is 100% justified in use of deadly force to cease thus threat to you or others. This is a very important point sone in this thread have blurred. I also think the idea of sizing up the situation to see if the bg is "really" homocidal before deciding to act may be fatal. There are tons if folks dead and burried who complied with armed robbers, only to be eliminated from the witness pool or shot for bragging rights. Personally I think the biggest question is tactical. How can I best end this threat to my life, hoping it will go away is not an option.

August 5, 2011, 05:40 AM	#79
Brit Senior Member Join Date: January 29, 2005 Location: Orlando FL Posts: 1,934	45 gunner/ Going from a well lit inside Office, to poorer lighting, outside? And maybe a partner/getaway driver, not me. B/G outside, lying, dieing, me back lit, no Sir!