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June 18, 2009, 05:05 AM | #1 |
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Protection from Civil Suits?
Ok, my google-fu is rather weak and I did not happen across a thread that answers my question directly. In an SD scenario, even if cleared of any wrongdoing, a shooter can still be held liable in civil court. Because, of course, the BG was getting his/her life together and was a great kid who would never do the horrible things that he/she has been accused of, yada yada yada. Is there any statute that allows immunity for the shooter in this case? I have heard that some states do have a provision that basically states that the shooter who is cleared of criminal wrongdoing is shielded from civil backlash. I am specifically interested in Texas.
ETA: If you have a link to the statute, that would be great. I am coming up with a bunch of nothing useful on teh interwebz so far... Thanks!
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June 18, 2009, 05:11 AM | #2 |
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Castle Doctrine specifically protects you in a justified SD shooting, but that only applies under CD rules. If you are at Wal-Mart, you are not protected, for example.
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June 18, 2009, 05:15 AM | #3 |
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The best protection against civil suits.....
Is don't get caught
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June 18, 2009, 06:34 AM | #4 | |
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If you were to go to trial with it and found not-guilty then you would have a very strong case even in civil court. If the family still decides to sue and the jury decides in your favor you can be awarded legal fees from the family. Since most lawyers normally take such cases on a contingency basis depending on how much they win, seeing that it is unlikely that they will win the case they probably will require their fee up front. Seeing as how it is unlikely that the family (being non-PC here) probably have little to pay for a lawyer if he refuses to take the case on a contingency basis, it is unlikely that you will be sued. Your mileage may vary and IANAL. |
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June 18, 2009, 09:30 AM | #5 | ||
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June 18, 2009, 12:12 PM | #6 | ||
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June 18, 2009, 12:33 PM | #7 |
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The Castle Doctrine will sheild you against criminal suits - legal action by the state - if the DA and courts agree the shooting meets the thresholds of the law. It will not protect you from civil lawsuits by anyone you shoot or their heirs.
Might not be the same in all states, but that's the way I understand it in Arizona and the way it was explained in the Arizona CCW course. Last edited by JWT; June 18, 2009 at 03:51 PM. |
June 18, 2009, 12:45 PM | #8 |
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I'm not a lawyer but his is how I understand things.
There is nothing that can prevent BG or his relatives from filing a law suit. Unlike a criminal trial where there must be proof beyond a reasonable doubt, in civil court there must be a preponderance of evidence to win. Technically it is possible to be found not guilty in a criminal trial only to be held liable in a civil trial. OJ Simpson is an example of this. |
June 18, 2009, 01:50 PM | #9 |
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IANAL, but it really depends on your state's laws and whether or not they make allowances in their Castle Doctrine laws. Check YOUR state's stautes to determine the answer for yourself.
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June 18, 2009, 03:23 PM | #10 | |
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As an example, here is the link for the SC law which prevents prosecution.
http://www.sled.sc.gov/ProtectionOfP...spx?MenuID=CWP Quote:
Last edited by madmag; June 18, 2009 at 03:30 PM. |
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June 18, 2009, 04:12 PM | #11 | |
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The Texas law that grants civil immunity in a justified self-defense situation applies whether it occurs in the home or in public. Here is the specific law (Texas Civil Practice and Remedies Code 83.001):
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June 18, 2009, 04:33 PM | #12 |
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Same law in Florida. If the shooting is justifiable, you cannot be sued in civil court.
Of course, as in Texas, you can still be sued. In Florida, once you win the civil verdict or the case is thrown out, the person suing you gets to pay all of your expenses incurred during the case, including pay from missing work.
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June 18, 2009, 04:48 PM | #13 |
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Either consult an attorney or learn to read your state's laws and cases.
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June 18, 2009, 07:32 PM | #14 |
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Lots of incorrect advice in this thread. Each state's laws regarding the civil liability for shooting another person (whether justified under the criminal laws of that state or not) varies, and there is no blanket advice whatsoever which can be given nor accepted. While some states do offer immunity from civil litigation in certain shooting scenarios, there are always limitations and exceptions.
Bottom line is you should expect to get sued if you are involved in a shooting - regardless of the circumstances and justifications you may have. |
June 18, 2009, 07:42 PM | #15 |
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IF you own a house and want to CCW....get an umbrella policy...about $ 125 year for a million dollars in coverage. DONE IF you shoot..you will be sued.
Remember: You shoot to stop They choose...you survived. The use of deadly force when somebody survives means you did it wrong ! IF you must shoot...do it well. Be the survivor so YOU get to tell the only side of what happened as you HAD to defend yourself. Better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6 ! The best feature of an autoloader: The slide locks back when it's time to evaluate ! |
June 18, 2009, 08:13 PM | #16 | |
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Quote:
thank you to everyone who has provided advice, except this guy^. Totally useless.
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June 18, 2009, 08:55 PM | #17 |
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Be sure to read the fine print in those umbrella policies.
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June 18, 2009, 09:27 PM | #18 |
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How is that useless? Do you mean to tell me you would stake your liberty and all you own on the so-called expert advice proffered by strangers and laymen on an internet site?
That was the soundest advice posted here, in addition to Mr. Roberts' posting of the relevant Texas statute. Consult someone in your area who actually knows the law. You might just thank the gentleman and go your way.
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June 18, 2009, 09:57 PM | #19 |
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Texas code
The OP was in Texas, and BR posted the relevant statute. In Texas if the shoot is deemed a legitimate self defense shoot, then the citizen is immune from civil damages. He might, or might not, have to actually go to civil court in response to the suit to plead the case and get it dismissed. The usual practice in Texas is to send a SD shoot to a grand jury for disposition. If no-billed, then it is very unlikely that a civil suit would see the court docket. If the DA simply decides to not file charges without submitting to a grand jury, then there is the possibility that some stupid dead guy's relatives might try their luck at the craps table that is the Texas civil courts.
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June 18, 2009, 10:15 PM | #20 | |
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You can show up and hope the judge tosses the case, but if he doesn't, for whatever reason, and you haven't paid an attorney, who is banking on the judge throwing the case out as the case is a loser if it goes to trial, you are screwed b/c no one worth a darn is taking the case at that point. Just the discovery documents are going to run you a tidy sum and I am pretty sure every court is going to require discovery before the judge will throw it out(I believe this is where you officially introduce the criminal outcome and point to the statute offering protection). It has been a while since I took a law class though, and it wasn't all that in depth to begin with.. |
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June 19, 2009, 05:55 AM | #21 | |
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June 19, 2009, 08:55 AM | #22 |
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The Oklahoma "Make My Day Law" was signed into law over 20 years ago. No person who has done a righteous shooting under this law has had a civil lawsuit successfully filed against him/her.
Matter of fact that OK law is retroactive to cover one specific case that spawned the OK "Make My Day Law". In OK the prosecutor is not required to take take a righteous shooting case to the grand jury. The wounded perp or his family can take up a petition for a grand jury hearing but that never happens. Okies are not moved to sign petitions on behalf of folks who get shot while committing a crime. |
June 19, 2009, 09:30 AM | #23 |
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Just to clarify: The way they will determine whether or not you are immune from civil suit is by going to court and starting the civil suit process. So you could still require a lawyer.
What these laws do is make it less likely that this scenario ever happens in the first place by making these cases so unattractive that few lawyers would take one. |
June 19, 2009, 11:01 AM | #24 | ||
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June 19, 2009, 12:32 PM | #25 |
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How complete is the standard your ground coverage in general? I was thinking about if you engage in a legit self-defense shooting but go into spray and pray mode or your bullet passes through the BG and you nail a good person?
Are you protected in those situations in the states that have such laws? Should you be?
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