black powder shells a no go

Swampman1 · October 13, 2017, 03:47 PM

OK guys, after making several trips squirrel hunting, I've come to realize these black powder shells have even less knockdown power than I thought they might. I'm using Buffalo Arms 12 ga 1 1/8 oz of 7 1/2 shot with 3 drams of powder. After the hunt this morning, I set up a test comparing these shells vs regular high power shells against a piece of corrugated tin, at about 25 yards. The bp knocked the tin down, but barely dented the tin sheet. When I tried the regular nitro powdered shell, the difference was astounding to say the least. Both these shells were loaded with 7 1/2 shot, but the nitro shot pierced clean through the tin. Now I know this isn't anything new to some here, but I was surprised. Now here's my question. If I start reloading BP shells (2F powder) is there a way to increase the powder load to at least resemble what the nitro powder can do? Would 3F powder come closer to match the nitro powder velocity?

noelf2 · October 13, 2017, 08:00 PM

I tend to use heavier shot. #6 at the least for squirrels. You will need to experiment to get the results you are looking for, but putting holes in tin isn't the best comparison. What you are loading now would probably still be good for birds, but you can try to use more powder, or less shot, and see what happens. As long as you don't blow a hole in your pattern, you will find the sweet spot for what you are hunting.

Generally, you will not get the same results comparing black powder loads and modern loads. I have a 10 gauge that will almost get modern 12 gauge performance.

**4V50 Gary** · October 13, 2017, 09:20 PM

Don't forget to pattern it.

Hellgate · October 13, 2017, 10:51 PM

Swampman,
The Buffalo Arms shells probably aren't loaded with real BP. They probably use a volume equivalent of APP or some other sub. Tear one apart and see what kind of volume of powder is in the shell. Three drams of BP is ~82 grs. I can get 80grs into a Remington or AA compression formed case but I need to use a very short wad like a red AA wad with the "legs" cut out of it: i.e. just the over powder wad and the shot cup. It makes a helluva BOOM! Now, you can get more power from 777 and a volume equivalent would actually by more like a 3 1/4 or 3 1/2 dram equivalent load. I'd say 60-65 grs of FFg 777 would be a better load than the buffalo arms stuff. Also Buffalo Arms shot could be softer (wild guess). As was stated before, pattern the load:
Get a cardboard box, roll of butcher paper, stapler, sharpie marker to make an aiming point, stand off about 15 yards away and blast it. Remove/replace paper and blast with the other barrel if you have a SXS. If the pattern is center dense or evenly spaced you should be good to go. If the pattern is thin in the center, either add shot or reduce powder.

Here's a pic of a 3 dram load from a prior post:
https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...=438629&page=2

October 13, 2017, 03:47 PM	#1
Swampman1 Senior Member Join Date: February 17, 2013 Location: South Louisiana Posts: 432	black powder shells a no go OK guys, after making several trips squirrel hunting, I've come to realize these black powder shells have even less knockdown power than I thought they might. I'm using Buffalo Arms 12 ga 1 1/8 oz of 7 1/2 shot with 3 drams of powder. After the hunt this morning, I set up a test comparing these shells vs regular high power shells against a piece of corrugated tin, at about 25 yards. The bp knocked the tin down, but barely dented the tin sheet. When I tried the regular nitro powdered shell, the difference was astounding to say the least. Both these shells were loaded with 7 1/2 shot, but the nitro shot pierced clean through the tin. Now I know this isn't anything new to some here, but I was surprised. Now here's my question. If I start reloading BP shells (2F powder) is there a way to increase the powder load to at least resemble what the nitro powder can do? Would 3F powder come closer to match the nitro powder velocity? Last edited by Swampman1; October 13, 2017 at 03:53 PM.

October 13, 2017, 08:00 PM	#2
noelf2 Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2008 Location: Stuart, VA Posts: 2,473	I tend to use heavier shot. #6 at the least for squirrels. You will need to experiment to get the results you are looking for, but putting holes in tin isn't the best comparison. What you are loading now would probably still be good for birds, but you can try to use more powder, or less shot, and see what happens. As long as you don't blow a hole in your pattern, you will find the sweet spot for what you are hunting. Generally, you will not get the same results comparing black powder loads and modern loads. I have a 10 gauge that will almost get modern 12 gauge performance. __________________ Liberty and freedom often offends those who understand neither. Last edited by noelf2; October 13, 2017 at 08:05 PM.

October 13, 2017, 09:20 PM	#3
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,832	Don't forget to pattern it. __________________ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt. *Molon Labe!*

October 13, 2017, 10:51 PM	#4
Hellgate Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2010 Location: Orygun Posts: 869	Swampman, The Buffalo Arms shells probably aren't loaded with real BP. They probably use a volume equivalent of APP or some other sub. Tear one apart and see what kind of volume of powder is in the shell. Three drams of BP is ~82 grs. I can get 80grs into a Remington or AA compression formed case but I need to use a very short wad like a red AA wad with the "legs" cut out of it: i.e. just the over powder wad and the shot cup. It makes a helluva BOOM! Now, you can get more power from 777 and a volume equivalent would actually by more like a 3 1/4 or 3 1/2 dram equivalent load. I'd say 60-65 grs of FFg 777 would be a better load than the buffalo arms stuff. Also Buffalo Arms shot could be softer (wild guess). As was stated before, pattern the load: Get a cardboard box, roll of butcher paper, stapler, sharpie marker to make an aiming point, stand off about 15 yards away and blast it. Remove/replace paper and blast with the other barrel if you have a SXS. If the pattern is center dense or evenly spaced you should be good to go. If the pattern is thin in the center, either add shot or reduce powder. Here's a pic of a 3 dram load from a prior post: https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...=438629&page=2 __________________ With over 15 perCUSSIN' revolvers, I've been called the Imelda Marcos of cap & ball. SASS#3302 (Life), SASS Regulator, NRA (Life), Dirty Gamey Bastards #129 Wolverton Mtn. Peacekeepers (WA), former Orygun Cowboy (Ranger, Posse from Hell)