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Old December 4, 2012, 01:48 AM   #26
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Important note to High altitude and dessert use of them, they require both oxygen and moisture to work.

Had to show my brother this, 7500 feet + New Mexico means thin air and next to no humidity.

Mildly wetting the warmer made it work.
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Old December 4, 2012, 02:28 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Brian Pfleuger
Yeah, well... lots of things can have an MSDS
Non-hazardous in case of inhalation. Non-irritant for lungs. Non-sensitizer for lungs.
I think they're full of malarkey. If you inhale water it's definitely hazardous and an irritant for your lungs. They usually feel pretty sensitive afterwards too.

Last edited by BigRick; December 4, 2012 at 10:04 AM.
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Old December 4, 2012, 08:01 AM   #28
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NOt sure, but I think vermiculite has an MSDS sheet. Doesn't necessarily mean it is bad for the environment, but it probably isn't good.
LOL, from Wikipedia...

Soilless growing media: exfoliated vermiculite is combined with other materials such as peat or composted pine bark compost to produce soilless growing media for the professional horticulturalist and for the home gardener. These mixes promote faster root growth and gives quick anchorage to young roots. The mixture helps retain air, plant food and moisture, releasing them as the plant requires them. These mixes were pioneered by Boodley and Sheldrake

Seed germination: either used alone or mixed with soil or peat, vermiculite is used to germinate seeds. Very little watering is required. When vermiculite is used alone, seedlings should be fed with a weak fertilizer solution when the first true leaves appear. A tablespoon of soluble fertilizer per one imperial gallon (3.78 : 1) of water is the recommended mix

Storing bulbs and root crops: pour vermiculite around bulbs placed in container. If clumps are dug, allow to dry for a few hours in the sun and then place in cartons or bushel baskets and cover with vermiculite. The absorptive power of vermiculite acts as a regulator that prevents mildew and moisture fluctuation during the storage period. It will not absorb moisture from the inside of stored tubers, but it does take up free water from the outside, preventing storage rot.

As a soil conditioner: Where the native soil is heavy or sticky, gentle mixing of vermiculite up to one-half the volume of the soil is recommended. This creates air channels and allows the soil mix to breathe. Mixing vermiculite in flower and vegetable gardens or in potted plants will provide the necessary air to maintain vigorous plant growth. Where soils are sandy, mixing of vermiculite into the soil will allow the soil to hold water and air needed for growth.

As a carrier for dry handling and slow release of agricultural chemicals

As a growing medium for hydroponics.

Used as part of a substrate for fungi cultivation

Vermiculite is also used for a variety of industrial purposes and is found in a variety of products.
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Old December 4, 2012, 09:27 AM   #29
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Zorro, good point. I've had trouble with them in NM without any moisture.
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Old December 4, 2012, 11:58 AM   #30
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"If you inhale water it's definitely hazardous and an irritant for your lungs."

You inhale water with every breath you take.

It's called humidity.
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Old December 5, 2012, 03:28 PM   #31
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Take a look at some of the chemicals used in hydroponic gardening. There are a whole lot of them I am not real interested in having around. Since everyone wanted to claim it was safe and didn't give what I considered a solid argument about it I decided to look it up. It seems in many vermiculite mines asbestos is also present. This issue has been resolved for the most part with those mines being idled since the early 90s, so it shouldn't be an issue for any newly produced items. There seem to be no other known health risks.

Of course, I think asbestos was held in high regard as a naturally occurring silicates with desirable properties and no health risk for about 75 years. Oops. How old are MSDS sheets? Can we dig up an old one for asbestos?

I have a small yard that is surrounded by concrete on all sides. I started pouring out the hand warmers there. I will see if there is any appreciable difference over time.
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Old December 5, 2012, 09:03 PM   #32
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I use vermiculite often, it's in every potted plant. So look out its everywhere. Basically harmless, could have a remote possibly of have a trace amount of asbestos. Higher concentrations in more of your household items than in vermiculite. It's natural and it won't hurt to throw away.

Great high temp insulation for outdoor ovens and small back yard forges.
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Old December 5, 2012, 09:17 PM   #33
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I've tried different brands. For several years I've used only Hot Hands in gloves, socks and rarely in a waist band or pockets. They definitely help me tolerate colder weather when hunting from a tree stand.
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Old December 5, 2012, 10:26 PM   #34
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When its real cold I use the hot hands in my gloves and the toasty toes are attached to the bottom of my toes. I think they do help for sure.

Wal-Mart sells them of course.
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Old December 6, 2012, 08:15 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by Mike Irwin
"If you inhale water it's definitely hazardous and an irritant for your lungs."

You inhale water with every breath you take.

It's called humidity.
My lungs are pretty irritated. Lots of humidity here in Afghanistan and back in Kansas. lol
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