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Old May 27, 2024, 09:16 AM   #1
taylorce1
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Interesting Concept, straight pull light rifle

Based on the AR-15 platform. I was crusing another forum and came across this topic. There was a link to Rockslide forum, as this is where it was originally discussed. Pretty impressive builds around 3.5 lbs with light weight BCG, no buffer, or buffer spring needed.

A lot of the guys were interested in it as a straightwall platform for deer hunting in restricted states. The OP on Rockslide used the rifles in .300 Ham'r and .223 Wylde. The only thing that concerned me was the short bolt levers on the side charging BCG. I was more concerned about the bolt lock up with so little leverage and no buffer and spring to assist. However, it seemed like the people with these builds were not having issues.

I like the AR platform, but have pretty much resigned myself to 7+ lbs in an affordable semi-auto. I know there are builds down in the 4lbs range as a semi-auto, but they quickly become more than I want to spend. I know they discussed build price as a straight pull rifles, and I'm sure they were more than the average AR-15 costs. I just didn't get that far into the discussion, as I was more focused on the build.
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Old May 27, 2024, 09:54 AM   #2
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Fascinating--but I personally have never understood the obsession with super-light rifles; that recoil has to go somewhere and be compensated for somehow.
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Old May 27, 2024, 01:48 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stagpanther
I personally have never understood the obsession with super-light rifles
I'm sure that a 3lb .223 or .300 Ham'r isn't going to leave you with a bruised shoulder. I'll admit I'm fascinated within reason. However, my experience is diferent from yours more than likely.

My military experience as light infantry and having to walk everywhere with everything on my back has made me appreciate lighter gear. So has hunting wilderness areas where all wheeled traffic is banned for the last 20 years. I'm perfectly happy carrying a 7-8.5 lbs rifle, start getting closer to the 10 lbs or heavier it's probably going to stay home in the safe.

However, you're correct recoil has to go somewhere. I bought the Howa Superlite in .308 and that thing is a beast to handle with heavy bullets. It weighs in at 7 lbs with a full mag, scope, and suppressor. Take the suppressor off and it tips the scales at 6 lbs 2 oz.
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Old May 27, 2024, 04:11 PM   #4
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I was going to add--"unless you have to hump it far"--but even then there are still tradeoffs. It amazes me how folks shell out thousands of dollars to shave a pound or two off their rifles. I've shot some of the new carbon wonders--and they are truly a wonder how light they can be made--and they can also be very accurate. But if you're humping it far--you're probably out west and/or in the mountains and likely going to need something bigger than 223 to reach out far--so I've found your technique had better be close to impeccable to hold the thing steady, especially if you need a quick follow-up. I know my handling probably wouldn't be if a quick follow-up were needed.
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Old May 27, 2024, 06:34 PM   #5
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Unless you're in love with the AR, and already have the parts, I don't see the point of making an ultra light straight pull rifle on an AR platform.

Might be worth getting the parts and just having them so you can still use your AR when the misguided moron of modern gun control ban your semi auto, but watch how they do it. IF it gets banned because its a "semiautomatic assault rifle" and yours is a straight pull bolt action, you're ok (for now) but if the language of the law bans it by name, if your straight pull says AR-15 on it, it might become illegal.
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Old May 27, 2024, 08:24 PM   #6
taylorce1
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Originally Posted by 44 AMP
Might be worth getting the parts and just having them so you can still use your AR when the misguided moron of modern gun control ban your semi auto
That's kind of another reason I posted it. I've seen some pump and bolt action uppers, but this was a first just seeing a side charging bolt being used. I do know if they hadn't killed the AW ban here in CO any AR-15 that wasn't grandfathered including parts would be illegal.

I was hoping that SCOTUS was going to make a decision on the Maryland AWB this year, but now I hope they take one if the cases out of Illinois. That's the only thing that will stop Colorado from marching towards an AWB. This is the second year in a row that our Republican legislators have been able to stop it, but that won't hold forever.
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Old May 31, 2024, 01:33 PM   #7
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I've taken a look at Savage's straight-pull, looks interesting and I may try it out one day. The only question I have is how robust it is if eventually you got whack that handle to get a stuck case or round out. You shoot enough, it's going to happen sooner or later, whatever the reason.
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Old May 31, 2024, 02:07 PM   #8
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IF it is made as a turnbolt action, the straight pull has the same camming action as other bolt guns, however the straight pull lacks the mechanical leverage afforded by the 90 degree bolt handle offset of conventional bolt actions.

SO, you have less leverage to pry out a stuck case with the bolt handle.

If the case is stuck badly enough, your rifle is going to the gunsmith, no matter what kind of action it has.
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Old May 31, 2024, 05:56 PM   #9
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I can see the merits of a kit to retro a semi auto to a manual repeater mostly as a workaround for ridiculous laws.
Maybe a pump/slide action would have better ergos but it would likely be heavier.
But I digres..
If the end goal is to start with a clean sheet of paper and design a lightweight rifle suitable for hunting up through elk size non-dangerous game
Think about the principle "The shortest distance between two points is a straight line"

Back in the 1890's Paul Mauser figured out a pretty darn good system that after 125 years or so is hard to beat.

We can spend a LOT of money on exotic metals and composites ,graphite wound barrels ,etc.
Its hard for me to imagine a more elegant and efficient package than a turnbolt repeater.

Insert molding technology in handguns allows hard metal parts to be strategically located in polymer frames.

Maybe that will be expanded to include an AR type barrel extension with locking lugs molded into a poly receiver but we still need a foundation to attach optics,a stock,and a barrel.

Savage,Remington,etc developed receiver designs based on a piece of tubing.

Titanium alloys have become relatively mainstream. Backpackers use titanium Coffee mugs.

Graphite wound barrels are a thing.

Someone may figure out a Unistrut like extrusion to modularize chassis construction.

And it may have a recoil absorbitron unit.

But I forsee a bolt with a protruding handle a lot like a Mauser. I don't know of a better way to get great primary extraction and reliable ease of use.

As far as light weight..I've lived in Northern Colorado since 1966 . I've done a fair amount of hunting up to 10,000 feet elevation. Its a fact the air carries less oxygen up there. My mode of transportation was ordinarily some RedWing boots. Whatever I needed for food and shelter would be on my back. Terrain would ordinarily be up,down,or sidehilling ,often coated with some form of snow.
We spent way more time carrying a rifle than the few seconds of shooting it.
Part of the plan would be to use cover and concealment (a rock or tree) to rest and steady the rifle. We don't do the fantasy 600 yd plus shots. I don't have a 4 lb rifle but that would be OK for a 200 yd shot with a .308.

No,I don't want a scope over 6x. (Well,OK. That 2.5 to 8X has a place!) No,I don't want an 9 lb rifle. I focus on a good first shot. I'm fallible,a follow up might be necessary...but a bolt is fast enough and three rounds is plenty.

I build about any rifle I want. Part of my fun. My idea of a rifle to hunt Colorado is a turnbolt ,probably under 8 lbs ,likely a 2.5 to 8x (or a 4X or 6X)Leupold scope max and between a .257 and a 30-06 for cartridge.

It might not be your choice, thats OK. Its not the WRONG choice. Its all I want.
Stuck cases can mostly be avoided by moderating pressure and segregating brass loaded more than a few times.
Chase 3400 fps, yeah,you might beat the bolt open.

Last edited by HiBC; May 31, 2024 at 06:07 PM.
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