Saw This At A Local Gun Shop Saturday - Page 2

chadwimc · July 30, 2009, 07:16 AM

I "helped" my hunting buddy fill out the forms for a gun purchase once. We stopped at a gunshop after deer hunting one day. He spotted an AR15 for a good price. He could not find his glasses and cant read a stop sign without them. He yells across the store "Come over here and help me fill out this form"! I yelled back "I ain't gonna. The guvmint thugs'll get me"!!!
He tried three pair if glasses from staff and customers.

I read the question on the form and put my finger on the line where he should answer. If "they" were watching, I'm sure they got a laugh more than a technical violation of the law...

Tennessee Gentleman · July 30, 2009, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NavyLT

What good would that do?

Well, if it were a CCW license it would show he is not prohibited from owning a firearm or if just an ID you could run a background check on him. Which might prevent:

Quote:

Originally Posted by divemedic

IIRC, that is exactly how NYC got the dealers in those stings they were doing- they hired a man and a woman to pose as a married couple. The man filled out the papers, the woman paid, then NYC sued the dealer.

But hey, just stick it to the Man, be tough and don't take those precautions and then when your store gets closed, you are bankrupt and maybe facing criminal charges from the "Sting" you can shout: "What part of shall not be infringed do you not understand!"

flight954 · July 30, 2009, 10:22 AM

Yes I would have sold it to the woman. What she does with it after it leaves the store is her business.

Tennessee Gentleman · July 30, 2009, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flight954

What she does with it after it leaves the store is her business.

I can't argue with that. However, as one who is not a gun absolutist but a pragmatist I must tell you that that argument will not "Play in Peoria" as one politico once said. Those individuals who will not take precautions when selling their guns privately to strangers will only feed the antigun agenda and eventually cause laws to be further passed (they are already there in some states) restricting private sales. As another famous person said I cannot remember who

"If we don't police ourselves others will police us."

I don't want private sales restricted but I would never sell to a stranger without a background check. I like it that it is voluntary but I fear others not so scrupulous may cause it to become mandatory.

markj · July 30, 2009, 04:47 PM

Some folks are waaay too uptight, wife and I went to a gun show, I saw a shotgun I really liked, she went back and got it then gave it to me as a present. We broke no laws as I have a permit. How do you know that guy didnt have one? He looked the weapon over told her to get it she did with lawful documentation, to disallow her the sale well I would call a lawyer right off and go from there.

To assume,

well you know the rest...... she broke no laws in that purchase Mrs. Cravits

rshanneck2002 · July 30, 2009, 05:02 PM

Shotguns and rifles are in a total different catagory than handguns., pistols are registered and rifles and shotguns usually are not, although they still run a check. at least they are in my state, MI

MLeake · July 30, 2009, 05:16 PM

but BATFE still requires FFL to record the transaction, and the required form asks directly if the buyer is purchasing for his own use.

Dragon55 · July 30, 2009, 05:18 PM

I've never been asked to present a driver's license when I've bought a vehicle...... ever!

If the lady has all the necessary paperwork sell her the gun.

If I was in a store with someone(and not buying anything) and the clerk asked me for ID I'd tell him/her to stuff their self.

..... yes and if I was buying a gun to do bad things it wouldn't be a handgun anyway.

hogdogs · July 30, 2009, 05:22 PM

Quote:

if the buyer is purchasing for his own use.

So how do I answer that question as a father of a 19 year old if I am buying him a gun?
Brent

NavyLT · July 30, 2009, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hogdogs

So how do I answer that question as a father of a 19 year old if I am buying him a gun?
Brent

If your intention is to give that gun to your son as a gift, then you answer "YES" I am the actual purchaser of this firearm. Your intended "use" of that firearm is to give it as a gift. Gifts of firearms to any person who is eligible to POSSESS that firearm are legal, regardless of who the giver is.

NavyLT · July 30, 2009, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by markj

Some folks are waaay too uptight, wife and I went to a gun show, I saw a shotgun I really liked, she went back and got it then gave it to me as a present. We broke no laws as I have a permit. How do you know that guy didnt have one? He looked the weapon over told her to get it she did with lawful documentation, to disallow her the sale well I would call a lawyer right off and go from there.

I am just curious. Call a lawyer for what?!?

MLeake · July 30, 2009, 08:29 PM

because you don't have to have a driver's license to own a vehicle. You have to have one to drive it, but that's not up to the dealer to enforce.

OTOH, BATFE requires the FFL dealer to establish that you are a state resident of the state in which you are receiving the transferred firearm. Standard way to establish that is via DL. Your CCW/CHL won't cut it, because so many states have out-of-state permits; my FL permit started as in-state, but is now out-of-state. I notified FL as required, but they didn't ask for my old permit or mail me a new one, they just said "ok, we'll update the database" and that was that. Nowhere on my FL CCW does it indicate that I am not a FL resident.

So, the dealer will want to see your DL, to establish state residency. Depending on where you live, there may be additional requirements (handgun purchase permit in NC, for example). If you have a CCW/CHL etc, showing that can eliminate the waiting period for purchase.

In other words, don't blame the dealer. Blame BATFE and Congress, if you want, for limiting handgun sales to state residents only.

B.N.Real · July 30, 2009, 09:25 PM

You guys make me real nervous for all the gun sellers out there.

The sting operations mentioned do indeed use the endless resources of the governement to just close down any store tagged doing a sale they thought was legal.

So what do you do?

Not sell to anyone that has a person with them that handles the gun first?

How do you protect yourself from something like this if all of her paperwork and i.d. are valid and she never says that she is giving the gun to someone else?

July 30, 2009, 05:16 PM	#32
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	None of them are registered in FL or GA but BATFE still requires FFL to record the transaction, and the required form asks directly if the buyer is purchasing for his own use.

July 30, 2009, 05:18 PM	#33
Dragon55 Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2009 Location: East Tennessee Posts: 811	I've never been asked to present a driver's license when I've bought a vehicle...... ever! If the lady has all the necessary paperwork sell her the gun. If I was in a store with someone(and not buying anything) and the clerk asked me for ID I'd tell him/her to stuff their self. ..... yes and if I was buying a gun to do bad things it wouldn't be a handgun anyway. __________________ sailing ... A way to spend lots of money and go real S L O W

July 30, 2009, 08:29 PM	#37
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	showing a driver's license when buying a vehicle isn't required because you don't have to have a driver's license to own a vehicle. You have to have one to drive it, but that's not up to the dealer to enforce. OTOH, BATFE requires the FFL dealer to establish that you are a state resident of the state in which you are receiving the transferred firearm. Standard way to establish that is via DL. Your CCW/CHL won't cut it, because so many states have out-of-state permits; my FL permit started as in-state, but is now out-of-state. I notified FL as required, but they didn't ask for my old permit or mail me a new one, they just said "ok, we'll update the database" and that was that. Nowhere on my FL CCW does it indicate that I am not a FL resident. So, the dealer will want to see your DL, to establish state residency. Depending on where you live, there may be additional requirements (handgun purchase permit in NC, for example). If you have a CCW/CHL etc, showing that can eliminate the waiting period for purchase. In other words, don't blame the dealer. Blame BATFE and Congress, if you want, for limiting handgun sales to state residents only.

July 30, 2009, 07:16 AM	#26
chadwimc Senior Member Join Date: July 15, 2005 Posts: 155	I "helped" my hunting buddy fill out the forms for a gun purchase once. We stopped at a gunshop after deer hunting one day. He spotted an AR15 for a good price. He could not find his glasses and cant read a stop sign without them. He yells across the store "Come over here and help me fill out this form"! I yelled back "I ain't gonna. The guvmint thugs'll get me"!!! He tried three pair if glasses from staff and customers. I read the question on the form and put my finger on the line where he should answer. If "they" were watching, I'm sure they got a laugh more than a technical violation of the law...

July 30, 2009, 10:22 AM	#28
flight954 Senior Member Join Date: November 1, 2006 Location: Cypress, Texas Posts: 933	Yes I would have sold it to the woman. What she does with it after it leaves the store is her business.

July 30, 2009, 04:47 PM	#30
markj Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2005 Location: Crescent Iowa Posts: 2,971	Some folks are waaay too uptight, wife and I went to a gun show, I saw a shotgun I really liked, she went back and got it then gave it to me as a present. We broke no laws as I have a permit. How do you know that guy didnt have one? He looked the weapon over told her to get it she did with lawful documentation, to disallow her the sale well I would call a lawyer right off and go from there. To assume, well you know the rest...... she broke no laws in that purchase Mrs. Cravits

July 30, 2009, 05:02 PM	#31
rshanneck2002 Senior Member Join Date: December 14, 2008 Posts: 194	Shotguns and rifles are in a total different catagory than handguns., pistols are registered and rifles and shotguns usually are not, although they still run a check. at least they are in my state, MI

July 30, 2009, 09:25 PM	#38
B.N.Real Senior Member Join Date: February 22, 2008 Posts: 4,092	You guys make me real nervous for all the gun sellers out there. The sting operations mentioned do indeed use the endless resources of the governement to just close down any store tagged doing a sale they thought was legal. So what do you do? Not sell to anyone that has a person with them that handles the gun first? How do you protect yourself from something like this if all of her paperwork and i.d. are valid and she never says that she is giving the gun to someone else?