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Old March 5, 2015, 09:49 PM   #26
James K
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Just one more comment. In my time, I have met a few private investigators. I suppose there are exceptions, but the guys I knew bent over backwards to get along with the police. Not only did their licenses depend on good relations with the cops, but they had found that mutual help worked to everyone's advantage. In spite of TV and old fiction stories, PI's don't break the law, conceal evidence, help suspects evade the cops, antagonize police, perjure themselves, or play vigilante. The relationship might not always be friendly, but generally it is not overtly hostile. PI's recognize that the police have the real power and the authority of the state and the law behind them. I can't imagine the PI in that video rousing anything but hostility in police officers, and that would not be good for any client of his that might be involved with the police.

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Old March 5, 2015, 10:16 PM   #27
Frank Ettin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James K
... In my time, I have met a few private investigators. I suppose there are exceptions, but the guys I knew bent over backwards to get along with the police. Not only did their licenses depend on good relations with the cops, but they had found that mutual help worked to everyone's advantage. In spite of TV and old fiction stories, PI's don't break the law, conceal evidence, help suspects evade the cops, antagonize police, perjure themselves, or play vigilante....
Also, in my experience the bulk of a PI's work is in connection with civil litigation -- not criminal matters.
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Old March 6, 2015, 01:56 AM   #28
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Someone said unload the weapon and place it on the ground...
BAD IDEA!

What if one of the assailants friends decides to poke his nose in?
Then you are unarmed and screwed.

Once you see Blue Lights on that street, THEN you could feel somewhat more
secure in unloading & placing the weapon on the ground.
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Old March 6, 2015, 10:59 AM   #29
TimSr
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Someone said unload the weapon and place it on the ground...
BAD IDEA!

Absoluetly! You are responsible for being in control of your weapon until it is surrendered. This does raise an important point for discussion about what to do with your weapon until and when police arrive. You obviously don't want it where it is out of your control, nor do you want it in your hands when police arrive. I've thought about this myself, and decided I would reholster, and be sure to have my hands in the air when police arrive.
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Old March 6, 2015, 12:02 PM   #30
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...This does raise an important point for discussion about what to do with your weapon until and when police arrive. You obviously don't want it where it is out of your control, nor do you want it in your hands when police arrive. I've thought about this myself, and decided I would reholster, and be sure to have my hands in the air when police arrive.
This is a good reason to use a holster which allows you to re-holster with one hand and without looking.

When things have settled down, re-holster while keeping your hand on your gun ready to draw if necessary. As the police appear, take your hand off the gun and raise your hands.
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Old March 6, 2015, 02:30 PM   #31
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How exactly would you hang yourself by calling 911, the police etc...
Everything you say is being recorded and can and will be used against you in a court of law.

Calling 911 as soon as practicable after a gunfight is essential to establish in the police record that you are the victim, feared for your life (or for the life of another), and acted accordingly. This is especially important if the person you shot survives, as if he calls first he can establish himself as the victim. If the person you shot is incapacitated or dead, a prompt call to 911 can prevent a witness from denoting you as the perpetrator. Even if your call gets logged first, your actions will be thoroughly scrutinized, but if you are tagged as the perp from the outset in the eyes of the police, you will experience a lot more anxiety and will likely spend more on attorney's fees.

Don't say anything more than is necessary. Tell the responding officer you'll be happy to talk further after consulting your attorney.

One of the last things you want to do is behave in a guilty manner, and leaving the scene of the shooting is guilty behavior, unless it is necessary for safety reasons (eg, there is another assailant around). I would not unload my gun and place it on the ground, as the perp might have a partner interested in revenge, or some misinformed vigilante might decide to play the hero ala the recent Walmart incident. When the siren of the responding police cruiser is heard, you can safe and holster your weapon.
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Old March 6, 2015, 02:47 PM   #32
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It's more advantageous to call 911 before the defensive shooting happens --- and meanwhile --- still have the phone connected to 911 during the whole confrontation --- telling the 911 operator the address first and also telling the operator that you are armed.
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Old March 7, 2015, 02:03 PM   #33
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Does a PI giving legal advice on YouTube not ring a giant bell? Don't know about where you are, but up here, anybody can call themselves a PI. There's no formal training, experie4nce or anything else required.
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Old March 9, 2015, 11:24 PM   #34
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Quote:
How exactly would you hang yourself by calling 911, the police etc...

Everything you say is being recorded and can and will be used against you in a court of law.
I don't know... I never understood this.

If I act in self defense, and my motives are pure, and I know in my heart that I am justified... what exactly might I say that could be used against me?

"hello 911 operator? my wife and I were just attacked by two men. I think it was two, maybe it was three. they hit me in the head with a brick, and when I got up, they were trying to stab my wife. I shot at them. I am a legal concealed carrier. one ran off, but the other is bleeding badly in the street. my wife is trying to stop the bleeding, but this guy needs an ambulance fast..."

I don't see how anything I honestly say in a fully justified state of mind could be incriminating (barring stupidity, and I am seldom stupid).

Help me out here...

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Old March 10, 2015, 08:34 AM   #35
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Posted by btmj:
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I don't see how anything I honestly say in a fully justified state of mind could be incriminating (barring stupidity, and I am seldom stupid).

Help me out here...
Discrepancies and contradictions between your first statements made under stress and forensic evidence and you3 later memories could seriously damage your credibility and you self defense case.

That is why you should avoid saying anything about what happened, but it does not substantiate the ridiculous advice to not call 911--first.
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Old March 10, 2015, 08:37 AM   #36
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btmj, ANYTHING can be used against you that may come out wrong, or be worded incorrectly. Even factual statements that are PC taboo can be twisted against you. Stick to the basic script and never give an opinion as an opinion. For example, "He was going to stab my wife" not "I thought he was going to stab my wife". We all know about the case where the 911 operator asked for a description, asked about the suspect's race, where the CCW was depicted as a racist for answering the operator's question. " I was attacked by two men" is good. Saying "I was attacked by two green men speaking Klingon" could be twisted to make you a racist and anti-immigrant.
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Old March 22, 2015, 10:46 AM   #37
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Also consider that the 911 call can be used against you in the "court of public opinion", and possibly only a portion of the call will be on the network news.

They will, of course, claim it was an "editing mistake", but meanwhile, they still air it, 24/7.

The 911 operator doesn't need to know how you got in the situation, or who did what to whom. They may ask, but its irrelevant to their function. That kind of information matters to the investigators, not the dispatcher.

They might ask, they might even tell you they need to know to ensure a proper response. They can tell you ANYTHING, part of their job is to keep you on the line if they can, until the response does arrive.

EVERYTHING said is public record. And that 911 operator isn't the one facing criminal charges / defending yourself in court.

You are.
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