S & W King Super Target 38 Special engravings

jeffj377 · March 12, 2013, 07:13 PM

I was curious if anyone could help me? I'm trying to find more information on the engravings. I have mailed out a history form to S & W to see what info they have. Thanks, Jeff.

Jim Watson · March 12, 2013, 09:31 PM

Very handsome, but not a style I have seen from the factory.

It apparently had target grips fitted when engraved, note the unengraved area revealed by the Magnas that would have been covered by targets.

jeffj377 · March 12, 2013, 09:58 PM

I was thinking maybe Kings did the engraving. The original Kings Armory, I guess was sold. They stilll have a web site, but there is no useful information from it.

**Mike Irwin** · March 13, 2013, 06:36 AM

Definitely not S&W factory engraving.

I'm not familiar with any engraving that K.A. might have done in the past, though.

PetahW · March 13, 2013, 07:30 AM

It looks like it was engraved for/when it had a larger set of combat/target grips on it, instead of the smaller ones now mouted.

.

Winchester_73 · March 13, 2013, 09:34 AM

First, Kings Gun Sight company (not Kings Armory) did not engrave guns, AFAIK. I never heard of them engraving a gun. They customized the guns but not in that way. They commonly replaced hammers and front sights, and added barrel ribs, etc. King modified guns are fairly scarce today.

While the engraving may not look factory, no one here can say that for sure. I doubt any of us have any true factory engraved guns, and of course, you would have to compare guns from that period, to analyze the engraving. The gun is a post war K frame, likely a K-38, and if the hammer is original (its a speed hammer aka fish hook hammer), its likely a 5 screw as well, so you would have to compare it to post war engraved S&Ws. Alvin White and Russell Smith were two of S&Ws more famous post war engravers.

The target grips or lack thereof have nothing to do with the lack of engraving pattern near the grips. The person who ordered the engraving would have specified which type of grips. Since the grips were removable, there was no point in accommodating the grip type with the engraving UNLESS the engraving was ordered that way. I have saw many engraved 44 mags, which never had magnas as standard, have the inner aspect (which was covered by target grips) engraved. The owner then just put on magnas to show the engraving.

James K · March 13, 2013, 10:06 AM

I don't claim to be an expert, but S&W factory engraving has one definite characteristic, the engraver will always leave a clear area around the cylinder so the cylinder stop "drag" does not cut over the engraving.

Jim

**Mike Irwin** · March 13, 2013, 11:05 AM

Agreed.

Also, S&W, at any time, has employed very few engravers, and none had a style such as the engraving on that gun. It appears to be more sculpted than engraved, a style no engraver at S&W ever employed.

I'm also more than familiar enough with the work of S&W's in house engravers to feel confident in saying that no, that gun is NOT factory engraved. It's aftermarket.

jeffj377 · March 13, 2013, 07:31 PM

Thank you all for looking and giving any advice it is appreciated.

March 13, 2013, 06:36 AM	#4
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,381	Definitely not S&W factory engraving. I'm not familiar with any engraving that K.A. might have done in the past, though. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

March 13, 2013, 09:34 AM	#6
Winchester_73 Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2008 Location: Pittsburgh PA Posts: 2,863	First, Kings Gun Sight company (not Kings Armory) did not engrave guns, AFAIK. I never heard of them engraving a gun. They customized the guns but not in that way. They commonly replaced hammers and front sights, and added barrel ribs, etc. King modified guns are fairly scarce today. While the engraving may not look factory, no one here can say that for sure. I doubt any of us have any true factory engraved guns, and of course, you would have to compare guns from that period, to analyze the engraving. The gun is a post war K frame, likely a K-38, and if the hammer is original (its a speed hammer aka fish hook hammer), its likely a 5 screw as well, so you would have to compare it to post war engraved S&Ws. Alvin White and Russell Smith were two of S&Ws more famous post war engravers. The target grips or lack thereof have nothing to do with the lack of engraving pattern near the grips. The person who ordered the engraving would have specified which type of grips. Since the grips were removable, there was no point in accommodating the grip type with the engraving UNLESS the engraving was ordered that way. I have saw many engraved 44 mags, which never had magnas as standard, have the inner aspect (which was covered by target grips) engraved. The owner then just put on magnas to show the engraving. __________________ Winchester 73, the TFL user that won the west

March 13, 2013, 11:05 AM	#8
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,381	Agreed. Also, S&W, at any time, has employed very few engravers, and none had a style such as the engraving on that gun. It appears to be more sculpted than engraved, a style no engraver at S&W ever employed. I'm also more than familiar enough with the work of S&W's in house engravers to feel confident in saying that no, that gun is NOT factory engraved. It's aftermarket. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

March 12, 2013, 09:31 PM	#2
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,539	Very handsome, but not a style I have seen from the factory. It apparently had target grips fitted when engraved, note the unengraved area revealed by the Magnas that would have been covered by targets.

March 12, 2013, 09:58 PM	#3
jeffj377 Junior Member Join Date: March 11, 2013 Location: Lake Stevens, Washington Posts: 4	I was thinking maybe Kings did the engraving. The original Kings Armory, I guess was sold. They stilll have a web site, but there is no useful information from it.

March 13, 2013, 07:30 AM	#5
PetahW Senior Member Join Date: September 19, 2008 Posts: 4,678	It looks like it was engraved for/when it had a larger set of combat/target grips on it, instead of the smaller ones now mouted. .

March 13, 2013, 10:06 AM	#7
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	I don't claim to be an expert, but S&W factory engraving has one definite characteristic, the engraver will always leave a clear area around the cylinder so the cylinder stop "drag" does not cut over the engraving. Jim

March 13, 2013, 07:31 PM	#9
jeffj377 Junior Member Join Date: March 11, 2013 Location: Lake Stevens, Washington Posts: 4	Thank you all for looking and giving any advice it is appreciated.