New reloader, stage 2

[jp229g17]

I'm fairly new to reloading, just picked up a Loadmaster with a 4 die set in both 9mm and .40 s&w.

My question to other experienced reloaders - how critical is it to have a resizing die with the depriming pin removed at station 2? I was under the impression that depriming and re-sizing was done at station 1 with the depriming die.

My setup is as follows:

Station 1: Deprime and size
Station 2: Empty
Station 3: Powder measure / charge
Station 4: Bullet seating
Station 5: Crimp

Would I benefit to having a resizing die at station 2, so it centers the brass before a primer is inserted? Is this the key benefit?

Thank you

[jwrowland77]

I have mine setup as follows and it works for me:

Station 1: Decap/resize
Station 2: Expander
Station 3: Powder drop
Station 4: Empty
Station 5: Seater/crimp.

This is how I setup for all my pistol rounds.

[Brian Pfleuger]

If you're using a typical set-up with Lee dies, you'd have:

1)Size/deprime
2)Expand/Powder
3)Bullet Seat
4)Crimp
5)Empty

I don't see any obvious reason to leave an empty station in the middle stages. If anything, one of the various "Powder Cop" dies would be a good choice for the extra spot.

1)Size/deprime
2)Expand/Powder
3)Powder Cop
4)Bullet
5)Crimp

[jp229g17]

Excellent - this all makes sense.

Why do people add the additional resizing die after depriming? What purpose does it serve?

I should also mention I'm using the auto primer at station 2

[Brian Pfleuger]

This press primes at the top of the ram stroke, yes? I would assume that having a sizing die in the station where you prime might be to hold the case centered.

Good luck with that press, it is notoriously bad tempered. I hope it doesn't give you too many problems. If it does, you might look into the Lee Classic turret as an inexpensive alternative. It's not as fast as a progressive but you can load 200+ rounds an hour and it is a solid, dependable, reliable, well-built press.

[Outlaw75]

Excellent - this all makes sense.

Why do people add the additional resizing die after depriming? What purpose does it serve?

I should also mention I'm using the auto primer at station 2

They aren't, they're locating the expander die in station 2.

Resize/deprime die makes the case a uniform size and punches out the old primer. The expander die slightly expands the mouth of the resized case so that the bullet can be started before seating.

[jp229g17]

Thank you all! Your feedback is appreciated. Going to load up some .40 this evening and document, range time Saturday to see how they run.

[Wrangler5]

As Brian noted, the Loadmaster primes at the top of the ram stroke at position 2 on the turret. Their "standard" setup has you deprime and size in position 1, and then hole 2 can be left empty. I've made my handgun rounds on a Loadmaster for ~20 years, and find it seats primers a bit more consistently if I use a universal deprimer in position 1 and the sizing die (with decap pin removed) in position 2. Lee mentions this setup as an acceptable alternative arrangement.

The Lee powder measures have an expander function as well as dropping powder, so you don't need to expand cases before they get to the powder stage in position 3. If you're sizing in position 1, position 2 can just be left empty.

The Loadmaster has a reputation for being a finicky bitch, but in my experience most of the "problems" come from the primer feed system. It's simple, and made out of plastic, with parts that seem to get bunged up fairly easily. But replacements are cheap, especially the sliders, and readily available (I get 'em from Midway) so just keep a spare or two on hand.

[jp229g17]

Thank you! Great info. I've spent hours reading, watching videos on Loadmaster setups, and studied 4 different load manuals to make sure I have a full understanding of the entire process. My cousin also spent a few hours with me to make sure everything was setup correctly.

You're right, most of the "problems" I've had come from the priming system - once I made adjustments to seat the primers correctly, the rest was a breeze. The finnicky part is when the primers want to rush their way through before I can fully seat the disc in place - but I found placing a finger there first somewhat solves that problem.

I spent an hour or so adjusting the bullet seater for proper OAL. I'm using H-700X (I found some locally) and I'm not a big fan of how it meters.

The one aspect of the powder measure that doesn't quite add up to me was this:

The .57 auto disk should provide me with 4.3gr of IMR H-700X. I zeroed out my Lee scale, and after running the powder measure a few times, it kept metering at 4.0gr. It wasn't until I went up to .61 until I metered the grains at 4.4. Max load for this 180gr plated flat top is 4.7, so I guess that will do!

I didn't want to start at 4.0 because the minimum load is 4.2.

According to Lee, the .57 auto disk should yield 4.2 grains, but it was still under. I went up to .61 and found a good charge - this is strange because .61 should yield 4.5. I now understand the importance of having a scale, a cartridge gauge, and an electronic caliper.

I should also add **knock on wood** that I only had one primer insert upside down. The bigger problem I had were primers that didn't insert all the way, which I've resolved.

I will be hitting the range tomorrow to test these loads!

[Brian Pfleuger]

The Lee disks always dispense less than the chart predicts.

Today, I was loading .357sig with IMR 800-X. The chart says 1.07 will dispense 10gr. 1.09 only dispenses 9.2 or so. It took 1.14 to get 10gr.

By the way, there's no "H" in your 700-X. It's just IMR 700-X

[jp229g17]

Yep you're right...I kept confusing Hi-Skor with H.

Central NY? I'm up in rochester. Thanks for the auto disk info. I thought I was going crazy

[Wrangler5]

You can get a fully adjustable bar for the powder measure if you're extra fussy about a specific charge. I have several of the adjustable bars that I've tried in various turrets over the years, but except for the finest ball powders I think I get better consistency with the fixed holes.

And like you, I have never had a fixed hole in a Lee disk throw the exact charge that the chart says it will. I'm sure the factory assumes that some of their customers use the Auto Disk measure without checking the actual charges on a scale, and print the chart with overstated charge weights as a safety precaution.

[Lost Sheep]

jp,

Thanks for asking our advice. I assume (in addition to watching the videos, you also read carefully the descriptions of the reloading process (and by your questions, it appears you have). There are some excellent videos on the web and also some hare-brained advice that could get you and innocent bystanders injured as well. The printed descriptions from established and respected sources (e.g. established manufacturers of equipment and components, such as Lyman's manual or Lee's manual) help novices distinguish the good videos from the bad.

My contribution to your thread is this: The .40 S&W is not a forgiving cartridge. Being a small volume cartridge its performance envelope is slim and passingly high. A bit of an undercharge or overcharge of powder may give you problems you do not need now.

Bottom line. Mete your powder charges VERY CAREFULLY and weigh them all until you are fully confident that your charges are what you intend.

Lost Sheep

[jp229g17]

I'm happy to report, after careful metering and several hours of instruction from my cousin, as well as from some other reloading sources here locally, I had absolutely zero problems at the range yesterday. Both 9mm and .40 batches ran great.

9mm loads seemed a bit light (115gr)

Only issue I had was with 1 primer that didn't fire when the firing pin struck it. I loaded it back into my P229's chamber, and tried firing it again, it went bang.

I feel that taking the time to carefully meter and check OAL using both my digital caliper and cartridge gauge was worth the extra time spent.

I ran the Bayou Bullets in the .40 and I was quite pleased with how little smoke there was. Not to mention the barrel was barely dirty afterwards. I had some lead rounds that I didn't bother to run through the gun yet - but those are sure to make a mess.

Thanks again for everyone's input.

[Brian Pfleuger]

Glad to hear it!

A primer that fails to fire on the first try but goes off on the second is the result of incomplete seating. The first firing pin strike finished seating it, the second ignite it.

Be sure to give it a good, hard push when seating primers.