.270 Win vs 6.5 CM for Hunting

[Sure Shot Mc Gee]

I would suggest spreading out the calibers. And which of the two bolt throws you prefer.

You already own one of the most accurate cartridges made. 270 Win (non-belted.)

Everything else close to it (270) is a want-a-be. (6mm-1/4 bore-6.5 anything-7mm_all are hoping to garner the 270s reputation)

[stagpanther]

Looking at my collection, albeit small, i noticed something.
I have 3 rifles in 7mm. 284 Win, 280 Rem, 7mm Rem Mag.
And 2 rifles in 25 caliber. 250 Savage, 257 Roberts.
And of the calibers i would like to have, 25 Souper, 25-284, 25-350 Rem Mag, 257 Weatherby, 7mm-08(again), 7mm-350 Rem Mag, 7mm Dakota.

Only one 6.5mm interests me. 6.5mm Rem Mag.

What! no 25-06! That 7mm-08 I recently got is turning out to be heady stuff--darn close to the perfect all-around utility cartridge. I too have a soft spot for .284 and 257

[BuckBerry]

Guys,
Thank you so much for all the interesting perspectives. This has been excellent reading all of the advice. Also, I’m glad to see I didn’t awaken any serious “Creedmoorians”. Definitely keeping my 270, that was not up for debate.

[BuckBerry]

Originally Posted by Sure Shot Mc Gee

I would suggest spreading out the calibers. And which of the two bolt throws you prefer.

You already own one of the most accurate cartridges made. 270 Win (non-belted.)

Everything else close to it (270) is a want-a-be. (6mm-1/4 bore-6.5 anything-7mm_all are hoping to garner the 270s reputation)

I’d have to agree with you here for sure.
And once I’ve gotten used to the 60-degree bolt throw of the x-bolt, I absolutely love it. Basically makes me want to stick with them completely.

[Scorch]

I wouldn't sell either of the rifles to buy a 6.5 Creedmore. You already have both ends covered (light recoil vs reaching out). The 6.5 Creedmore is nothing special, and 6.5s of various flavors have been hyped for decades (6,5X54, 256 Newton, 6.5X55, 6.X57, 264 Win Mag, 6.5 Rem Mag, 6.5-06) and developed fan clubs, but never really caught on. There isn't enough of a difference between the 243 and the 6.5 Creedmore to justify spending money on it. Unless you really just want another rifle, in which case there's nothing stopping you.

[Rifletom]

Post #5 has some merit actually. If the 6.5 CM lasts a 1/3 of the time the .270 Win has been around, then it will warrant it's status.

[Bimus]

A few years back I happened to run in to a man that was out shooting when I was out shooting. One of his rifles was a 270 the other rifle he had was a 270-08 he really liked it. RCBS made dies for him . What a pair

[Doyle]

A few years back I happened to run in to a man that was out shooting when I was out shooting. One of his rifles was a 270 the other rifle he had was a 270-08 he really liked it. RCBS made dies for him

So, essentially what he had was a 7mm-08 that used a .277 bullet instead of .284.

[LineStretcher]

Roy Weatherby once said that the best rifle calibers for hunting medium to large game (not dangerous game) would be 6.8 - 7.2 mm. He suggested that the Winchester .270 which is .703mm was the best. It is a necked down .30-03 that, with the proper bullet style produces a good wound channel out to 400 yards on most large game. It requires a long action rifle but if you choose the .270 WSM you can then shoot it an often lighter, short action rifle. This is what I prefer. I own several rifles but by far, my favorite is my McMillan Dynasty G3 short action .270 WSM. I use to shoot 150g Nosler Accubond LR bullets but they have discontinued them and when my stock pile runs out I'll have to find an alternative.

So to the OP's original question, I don't think you have enough gain changing to a 6.5 but you might gain if you were to look at .270 alternatives such as the WM or WSM. Weatherby is producing a 6.5-300 now but something in the back of my mind say's it's a marketing game just to try to get in on some of the 6.5 revenue. I have not shot it and I'm sure it's a good gun but I'm not switching.

[Don Fischer]

Originally Posted by Scorch

There isn't enough of a difference between the 243 and the 6.5 Creedmore to justify spending money on it. Unless you really just want another rifle, in which case there's nothing stopping you.

You could say that bout the 270 and the 6.5 CM but not the 243 and the 6.5 CM. Show me a 243 bullet that weight's even 120gr, let alone 160grs? I shoot a 6.5x55 and a 6.5x06 and would not shoot the 120gr bullet in either. I'd go the 120gr bullet in my 25-06 though in a heart beat!

[Scorch]

You could say that bout the 270 and the 6.5 CM but not the 243 and the 6.5 CM. Show me a 243 bullet that weight's even 120gr,

When comparing bullets of different calibers, it's better to look at the sectional density and ballistic coefficient rather than the bullet weight. By your comparison, a 6.5 would never even compare to a 7mm (which has common bullet weights from 120 gr to 190 gr, let alone a 30 caliber (125 gr to 220 gr).

[kraigwy]

My main hunting rifle is the 270 Win. an excellent round.

Having said that DONT UNDERESTIMATE THE 6.5 CM. It certainly isnt a "fad" as some have said. Its accurate, and with the Honrnady 143 gr bullets, will do anything the 270 150 gr 270 will do.

I have come up with some good loads for my 270. But no matter what, I cant get it to shoot as well as my 6.5.

I have to 270s, and 2 6.5s, the same goes for both rifles. Its a bit cheaper to load the 6.5 then the 270 also, not much, but a little, I use Hornady bullets in both.

Also its getting to the point you can find factory 6.5s as easy as the 270.

Its not just the 270. I shoot a couple target 308s, and 223s, bolt and semis. None out shoot the 6.5 CM.

Using the 150 gr Hornady in the 270 and the 143 Hornady in the 6.5, both my loads shoot super sonic to 1400 yards. There is only about 10-12 ft lbs of energy difference at that distance.

We all have our favorites, mine is the 270.

But one thing you can take to the bank, the 6.5 CM is not a fad. It will be around a lot longer then any of us. Its getting more and more popular, because it WORKS.

[Jbotto]

To the OP: For the reason alone, that you own and have the .243, I would not be getting rid of that for anything. It's extremely important to garner new interest in hunting/shooting and if the .243 is the rifle you use/have used for that, it is worth keeping. I have a .243 that I gave to my brother to use when he started deer hunting in high school. I told him he can keep it as long as he wants, but as soon as he wants something else, to get it and return that .243 back to me. I'm sure one of us will have kids to train to use a hunting rifle someday, but I digress....

Like many of the other posts above me with much more clout and experience, I will agree that for hunting purposes under 400 yards, there really isn't enough of a difference between the 6.5cm and the .270. But that shouldn't stop you from getting a new rifle if you'd like. I will say that the few times I've picked up an HMR in a gunshop, sans optics, it seems like it would be the top end of the weight scale that I'd like to carry for hunting. Nothing stopping you from buying one to enjoy punching small groups at extended ranges from a light recoiling rifle at the range, but I think it would be pushing it to carry that rifle for any medium to great distance.

[Wyosmith]

My "read" on the 6.5CM being a fad is as follows.

Yes it was a fad when it came out. Is it now? Maybe a bit, but so was the 30-06 when it came out, and the 270, and the 25-06, and the 44 magnum, and even the 375H&H.
So what?
ALL popular cartridges are fads ---until they are not.

What makes the difference between a fad cartridge and a mainstream cartridge is 40-50 years of acceptance and demand.

I am old enough to know that I will not be around, or interested much about the issue of public acceptance of the 6.5CM as a mainstream cartridge by the time there is no room left for debate. Like the 6.5 Remington Magnum is now, there will be NO doubt of it's failure (if it fails) in 50 years, and like the 44 Remington magnum is now, there will be NO doubt of it's acceptance in 50 years. Krag and I both venture our opinions, but neither of us will be able to "prove we were right" in 50 years. That's up to you younger shooters, some of whom are reading this.

If the 6.5CM is a fad and you like it, get on board with it and you will be one of the shooters that make it into a mainstream cartridge.

If it were to "flash in the pan" and stop selling in the next 10 years, SO WHAT! ? Maybe Hornady or Winchester will bring out a 6.5-06 and that shell would steel the wind from the CMs sails....who knows!? But why would that matter to a happy owner? Especially one who loads his own ammo.

I agree with KragWy and I think the 6.5 CM is transitioning from fad to mainstream now, but even if we are wrong it doesn't matter.
The cartridge is excellent and if the public looses interest in 10-30 years it would not matter at all to a happy owners now.

Heck---- I love shooting and hunting with a 9.3X57 Mauser. That shell lost most of it's popularity in only 20 years and was supplanted by the 9.3X62, and was largely discontinued by the 1930s. The only place on earth it's still a popular shell is in Sweden today.

I don't care at all.

I like how it works, and it's accurate and kills everything I want to kill, so I don't care if someone else doesn't accept it. They can and should buy what they like, with both my encouragement and my blessings.

If you like the 6.5CM, get one. You won't be disappointed even if others loose interest in 1 year-------- or in 40 years.

One thing I have learned for sure and for certain about cartridges is that excellence of design is not a guarantee of commercial success, and exaggerated over-hyped cartridges sometime become huge commercial success's because the marketing of these products is without conscience and it's all about making money.

Most consumers do not actually know what is true and false, but only "know" what they read.

If what they are told is untrue (or even 1/2 true) they don't learn it until well after they bought the product. Marketeers know this about human behavior and use it at every opportunity, not just with guns and new cartridges, but with everything from cars to health products.

When we get a really good design that is a commercial success we all win. I think the 6.5 CM is going to be one of those.

If I am proven wrong in 20-40 more years it doesn't mean those that buy a 6.5CM now will ever be disappointed.

Shooting is supposed to be fun. If you like the new 6.5CM get one. If LOTS of people like it over the next few decades then it becomes mainstream automatically.

[Tallest]

I think Wyosmith has nailed it. I, for one, am usually reluctant to give any credit to the 6.5CM arena. I think it started as believing it to be a fad, then it turned into loyalty to preferred .260. But at the end of the day, I have not a leg to stand on.

I think humans are interesting. We feel so strongly about our preferences, that we sometimes allow ourselves to feel threatened by others having different preferences. If I admit that something else is good, I feel that maybe, by comparison, I'm saying that what I have is less than. This is foolishness, but it seems to be human nature. The beauty of this culture, hobby, whatever you want to call it... is that we have the freedom (for the present) to enjoy it however we want. We can like what we like, have as many or as few of each as we can afford, and not bow to anyone else's subjective preferences.

I'm not saying there is anything at all wrong with seeking the wisdom of many, or learning more to make an informed decision. But some folks are going to give you great advice, based on education and experience, while some others are going to preserve their ideal at all costs.

I think it a little amusing that folks are saying things like the 6.5 CM is too similar to what you have to justify it, but some of those folks have at least two rifles of the exact same caliber. So again... who cares.

[kraigwy]

but some of those folks have at least two rifles of the exact same caliber.

Surely you're not referring to my "7" '06s, or my "6" 223s

[Red Devil]

An interesting and informative article RE: the .270 WIN/6.5 CM debate:

6.5 Creedmoor Versus 270 Winchester

Red

[Tallest]

Originally Posted by kraigwy

Surely you're not referring to my "7" '06s, or my "6" 223s

Of course not! Naturally the '06 and the .223 are the only two exceptions given their diversity of application and bullet weight!

[eastbank]

if you want a 6.5cm. get one, but don,t try to throw the 270 win under the bus to get one. what are you going to throw under the bus when you want a 6mm cm? the 6.5 cm.

[Tallest]

Originally Posted by eastbank

if you want a 6.5cm. get one, but don,t try to throw the 270 win under the bus to get one. what are you going to throw under the bus when you want a 6mm cm? the 6.5 cm.

???

Wouldn't it be the .243 to fall short if someone picks the 6mmCM?

But it doesn't seem that anyone has thrown the .270 under the bus.

[stagpanther]

Tastes great...............less filling.

[eastbank]

if the .243 had the same twist as the 6mm CM there would not be a nickles worth of difference between them..

[stagpanther]

if the .243 had the same twist as the 6mm CM there would not be a nickles worth of difference between them..

Except that it eats more powder. If you reload--it piles up in costs after a while; more than a nickel I think.

[eastbank]

both use 47-49 grs of powder, so how much more would it cost? look up loads for both.

[stagpanther]

both use 47-49 grs of powder, so how much more would it cost? look up loads for both.

270 win case capacity H20: 67 grs.
creedmoor case capacity H20: 53.5 grs.