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Old April 6, 2024, 06:12 PM   #1
timlab55
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Newbie Here - AR15 questions

Newbie here, so be nice okay?
I'm new to this site, as I'm very new to the AR world. If I knew 1/2 the things you old timers know, I wouldn't of spend some crazy money (SSA doesn't pay that much)

Question: I would like to put foregrips on my AR15 with the handguards that came with my AR15. Also I would like to add a Foldable Picatinny Rail Rifle Bipod. Any suggestions?

Question: The other thing I would like to know is how to make my AR15 quite? When I shot, it sounds like a stick of 10 TNT sticks going off. Yes, I changed out the stock flash supposure with a muzzle block <---didn't help.

Thanks
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Old April 6, 2024, 11:27 PM   #2
ballardw
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For "quiet" is would suggest a good set of earplugs worn under a good set of ear muffs.

With a rifle bipod you likely should provide details of why you want one as there are a lot of options depending on why. I have one bipod that has legs that go to nearly 30 inches because the places I intended to shoot often have vegetation that is that tall. Some folks use a bipod just to help keep most of the rifle off the ground when not actively shooting. That doesn't require a very fancy rig.

You would have to tell use what sort of handguards you have currently, or point us to a picture to recommend anything that fits on a current rifle.
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Old April 7, 2024, 05:25 AM   #3
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First off welcome.

What you can mount really depends on your handguard. If its the round ridged plastic mil spec type, your options are very limited. If its metal with lots of slots, thats a great start.

Muzzle brakes generally make blast/noise worse. Flash hiders are generally better in relation to noise/blast than muzzle brakes.

Linear compensators, are the best at reducing noise/blast.
They do not make the gun quieter, bur rather direct the noise/blast away from the shooter. Its still gonna be loud. But it shouldn't rattle your teeth. I prefer the kaw valley linear compensators.https://kawvalleyprecision.com/produ...near-comp-blk/
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Old April 7, 2024, 05:30 AM   #4
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Welcome to the site.

I have found there to be a wealth of technical information on this site and everyone on it to be uncommonly civil and polite. (Thank you moderators.)

You complimented the site for the amount of information here in your first post and I believe you are correct.

For your questions it would help if we knew which AR you own. Also pictures, as was mentioned by the previous poster, would really help.

For posting pictures you can get some instructions here:
https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=292842

Posting pictures is kind of a chore. I've done it in the past but I always have to go back to the instructions to get it done. That said, others, even a lot of folk new to the site, seem to be able to do it quite handily.

As to the noise, what other firearms do you normally shoot? That is, what are you comparing your AR to? This information would be helpful.

Good luck.
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Old April 7, 2024, 07:33 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by DaleA View Post
Welcome to the site.

I have found there to be a wealth of technical information on this site and everyone on it to be uncommonly civil and polite. (Thank you moderators.)

You complimented the site for the amount of information here in your first post and I believe you are correct.

For your questions it would help if we knew which AR you own. Also pictures, as was mentioned by the previous poster, would really help.

For posting pictures you can get some instructions here:
https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=292842

Posting pictures is kind of a chore. I've done it in the past but I always have to go back to the instructions to get it done. That said, others, even a lot of folk new to the site, seem to be able to do it quite handily.

As to the noise, what other firearms do you normally shoot? That is, what are you comparing your AR to? This information would be helpful.

Good luck.
The op said he switched from a " flash supposure" to a "muzzle block" im interpreting that to mean flash suppressors and muzzle brake. It sounds like he shot it with the flash suppressor decided it was too loud, then switched to a muzzle brake, which are usually worse. I reccomended a linear compensator.
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Old April 7, 2024, 11:07 AM   #6
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Okay most of you asked what I have. Here is a picture of it as an attachment. In case no one can make heads or tails of the stuff, starting at the top is the AR15 with a muzzle break at the end. On the left side of it is my 20 round mag rounds. Below the AR15 is my power pack for my day/night scope. Next to it is my 30 round mag. Next to it is my day scope. Above it in the middle is my IR light that goes to my day/night scope, and the last thing is my day/night scope. Trying to upload the file. I might get it one of these days.

Last edited by timlab55; April 7, 2024 at 11:13 AM.
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Old April 7, 2024, 11:35 AM   #7
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Here is the picture of my rig.
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File Type: png AR15b.png (966.4 KB, 65 views)
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Old April 7, 2024, 12:36 PM   #8
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I think I found my answer to making my AR15 quite without purchasing a suppressor and that is to use sub sonic rounds. What do you all think?
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Old April 7, 2024, 01:10 PM   #9
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Thanks for the pic, helps a lot.

Your muzzle device looks similar to the KAK flash can. Its similar to a linear compensator and is about equally effective at reducing noise/blast. Unless you get an actual silencer/suppressor you wont do much better.

Witt machine and tool makes an interesting muzzle brake linear compensator thing thst is supposed to work well. Never tried one myself. Bit expensive, but an option. https://wittmachine.net/product/sme-...ment-slimline/

Id look at the magpul handguards if you want to mount things and not break the bank. Keep in mind, you have a fairly short handguard, so while you will be able to mount things, you still wont have much room to work with over all. The handguard you have is the older military style and was not designed/intended to have things mounted to it.

You might consider grip pods. Grips with bippds built in. They look a little goofy, and they are not amazing, but they work ok. Plus they are light, and dont take up much rail space, which you wont have much of.. Something along these lines. https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1024975048

Subsonics would help with the noise but create several other problems. They are expensive and not common. On top of that you are reducing velocity by around 66% down from around 3000fps to 1050fps, which makes it much less effective, maybe a bit more thsn a 22lr. Rifles are loud, not much getting around that. I use these earmuffs when i shoot rifles. Best i have foundhttps://a.co/d/iEzPJDk

Heres a cool video, from tactical hyve, kinda shows the history and progression of handguards and accessories. Should help you understand your ar and how to get where you are wanting to go a bit better. https://youtu.be/NHkVURKrnz0?si=7GWCgeL87wmAhAaK
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Last edited by Shadow9mm; April 7, 2024 at 03:58 PM.
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Old April 7, 2024, 01:17 PM   #10
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Quote:
Newbie here, so be nice okay?
I'm new to this site, as I'm very new to the AR world. If I knew 1/2 the things you old timers know, I wouldn't of spend some crazy money (SSA doesn't pay that much)
Welcome. I hope you enjoy the discussions here and participate on a regular basis where you have answers! Enjoy.

Quote:
Question: I would like to put foregrips on my AR15 with the handguards that came with my AR15. Also I would like to add a Foldable Picatinny Rail Rifle Bipod. Any suggestions?
What handguard is on your AR? Is it a std A2 type? What foregrip style?

Quote:
Question: The other thing I would like to know is how to make my AR15 quite? When I shot, it sounds like a stick of 10 TNT sticks going off. Yes, I changed out the stock flash supposure with a muzzle block <---didn't help.
The real solution is likely a suppressor or better yet double up ear protection. A linear compensator like the Kaw Valley can make it sound longer barreled.

https://kawvalleyprecision.com/produ...-linear-comps/

Quote:
I think I found my answer to making my AR15 quite without purchasing a suppressor and that is to use sub sonic rounds. What do you all think?
Sounds like an expensive low performance solution, but it is worth a try.
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Old April 7, 2024, 07:06 PM   #11
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timlab55; welcome.

we try not to bite.

when you complain about the noise of the weapon, you must consider if you are concerned about the muzzel blast, or the sonic crack of the supersonic projectile in flight.

a suppressor will mitigate the blast, but the sonic crack is loud and just can't be helped. going subsonic is only an option if you don't want the longer ranged power of the supersonic... you may want to do some research on all the pros/and/cons before you make that move. just saying.

also of note; the bypod idea on a barrel mounted forearm will diminish accuracy. you may want to think about a free float forearm. (some of us learned that the hard way)
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Old April 7, 2024, 07:49 PM   #12
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The noise of the weapon...I'm not sure which one it is as I'm even new to shooting execpt when I was in the Army using an M16A2. But I live out in the country. I'm sure just the way it is now, it would wake anyone up at 5:00 a.m. as I'm looking for only coyote's. So how can I tell which one it is? Now you know which animal I'm after. I don't really care about the distances, as the most I will shoot is 200 ft.

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Old April 7, 2024, 08:08 PM   #13
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if you are 1/4 mile or more from the nearest house, the sonic crack is mostly what they will hear. and most of my neibours wouldn't complain about me shooting critters at 5 am.

sonic crack is not what the shooter notices the most, (at least not in the standard ar-15 setup) and hard to distinguish for the shooter.

you might try this, take a cell-phone (or other recorder) and put it on sound recorder, place it about 10 feet to one side of a target and a little in front of it. then go about 1 to 2 hundred yards away and fire a few rounds at the target. listen to the recording and you will see the difference.

the sonic crack from the small .224 projectile is not near as objectionable as that of many other "high power" rounds.

at the risk of going off on a wild tangent, i have been shooting long range for several years, and have used an old cell phone to record my bullet impact for later inspection. the sound is astonishing. i know that the recorder can't really give a 1:1 account but it will amaze you, the crack / smack / thump triplet of sound...

well anyway, IMO ar15 from over 400yds from both blast and crack is nothing to worry about as far as noise level is concerned. if you through in some vegitation to muffle it, it's nothing that would wake up a normal person, in a closed building. but that is just an openion.
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Old April 7, 2024, 08:11 PM   #14
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Get a Linear Compensator so the gas/sound goes forward.
https://kawvalleyprecision.com/produ...near-comp-blk/
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Old April 7, 2024, 09:13 PM   #15
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@georgehwbush - I will try it this week. Seems harmless. I have to be honest here and tell you I got the AR15 a week ago. I have only shot 2 rounds through it. The day I got it and yesterday and both rounds where aimed at the ground. I have no target place setup yet, but working on it. My AR15 isn't zero in or nothing. But I will try and complete my task this week. Maybe I'll use my cell phone and fire 1 round 5 ft from it (into the ground). Then walk 600 ft, shot another round in the ground. Then come back and listen to the recording. After that, I will (I hope) upload it to the website so everyone can hear it.

In the meantime, I'm going down tomorrow and pickup 20 rounds of subsonic ammon for the AR15.

@Blindstitch - I will look at it tomorrow.
Thanks
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Old April 8, 2024, 05:22 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timlab55 View Post
@georgehwbush - I will try it this week. Seems harmless. I have to be honest here and tell you I got the AR15 a week ago. I have only shot 2 rounds through it. The day I got it and yesterday and both rounds where aimed at the ground. I have no target place setup yet, but working on it. My AR15 isn't zero in or nothing. But I will try and complete my task this week. Maybe I'll use my cell phone and fire 1 round 5 ft from it (into the ground). Then walk 600 ft, shot another round in the ground. Then come back and listen to the recording. After that, I will (I hope) upload it to the website so everyone can hear it.

In the meantime, I'm going down tomorrow and pickup 20 rounds of subsonic ammon for the AR15.

@Blindstitch - I will look at it tomorrow.
Thanks
Be careful shooting into the ground at 200yds, unless it’s a good berm with a fairly steep angle you have a pretty substantial risk of a ricochet if the ground is relatively flat or a low slight grade hillside. You might have a more serious problem with your neighbors than a noisy firearm if you start bouncing bullets around the countryside. Since you have stated you are very new to firearms I’d suggest taking a good safety class for a better understanding of what can happen downrange. The legal liability on a ricochet could be life altering and downright deadly with a high powered rifle. Wherever that bullet goes and whatever damage it does is your responsibility. Please accept this as friendly advice, I don’t mean to rag on you but it’s pretty serious business.
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Old April 8, 2024, 06:10 AM   #17
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I totally agree with you on that one about ricochets. I guess I should of been more clear about that one. Image standing up and pointing the gun down to the ground and fire a round. With that being said, what I intend on doing is firing a round into the ground (maybe 3 ft from me), with my recorder on. Then leaving the recorder on, walking the 200 yards and doing the same thing. Heaven no, shooting into the ground at 200yds no way.
If you look at the attachment, you'll see what I mean by getting a more quite sound from my AR15.
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Old April 8, 2024, 11:42 AM   #18
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You folks have been a great help in helping understand the world of firearms. But once again I'm really in need to make my AR15 quite before shooting. The sub sonic rounds will they are almost impossible to get, as all the stores in my area don't care them. That only leaves me with 1 answer and that is to get a silencer/suppressor. Okay I'm game, but I'm on a very tight budget (as we all are). Can someone direct me to a website where I can get one of these please?
Thanks
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Old April 8, 2024, 11:51 AM   #19
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timlab55---I am not a hunter at all so this question is not really for you but for some of the other more knowledgeable people on the site.

1. For coyote (or any other varmints) do you think sub-sonic .223/5.56 given the range is only going to be 70 yards is the way to go?

2. What weight bullet would be recommended?
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Old April 8, 2024, 05:30 PM   #20
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Hold the phone, turn up the coffee, I might of found something for everyone here (maybe). I remember in my last post I gave up on finding subsonic rounds to make my AR15 quiet. And yes I'm still interested in the silencer that will not break the bank (SSA doesn't pay much). But anyway, I found this website that list everyone (might) that sells ammo. So as I was looking I think I found my subsonic ammo. The site is:
http://ammoseek.com. Anyway I looked up the type of ammo I was looking for and I found this:
http://hdtac.com/hornady-8026-match-...il-match-hpbtm.
My first impression was that that it was subsonic, and secondly I wanted a Hollow Point. But never head the "boat-tail". Just checking to find out if I can run this through my AR15? If I can my plan is, to order this, check it out (noise wise). If the noise wise is okay, then I can wait a year for the silencer and save up. If I can't deal with the noise then I can go with the silencer.
Thank you
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Old April 8, 2024, 06:15 PM   #21
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"Boat-tail" is fine. A quick Google search will give you a better explanation than I can of the meaning of "boat-tail".

However, the ammunition you link to is not sub-sonic. Muzzle velocity is over 2700 feet per second. (Unless of course I'm looking at the wrong ammo---which is a real possibility.)

https://www.hornady.com/ammunition/r...ch#!/#features
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Old April 8, 2024, 06:32 PM   #22
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I'm not sure what you know but silent isn't silent. Even a suppressor is going to make noise in 223/556. Movies lie to you all day long. But if you're looking for a suppressor do you know that on top of the price of the one you buy you also have to pay a $200 tax stamp in the U.S. And it may take 9-12 months after you buy it for all the paperwork to be cleared and let you take it home.

Get rid of the muzzlebreak and go with a thread adapter or linear compensator.

The only better advice I could give you is start reloading but that's not really cheap unless you crank out a ton of ammo and shoot a lot.
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Old April 9, 2024, 09:25 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tim
My first impression was that that it was subsonic, and secondly I wanted a Hollow Point. But never head the "boat-tail". Just checking to find out if I can run this through my AR15? If I can my plan is, to order this, check it out (noise wise). If the noise wise is okay, then I can wait a year for the silencer and save up. If I can't deal with the noise then I can go with the silencer.
Thank you
I'm not an expert on any of this, so maybe we will be speaking the same language. A 75gr .223 isn't going to be quieter than regular old 55gr stuff.

If you want a rifle to be quiet, a .223/5.56 is an unusual choice. If you want a .223/5.56 AR to function as a semi-automatic rifle, subsonic ammunition isn't a helpful attribute.

I don't have one and the ammunition is expensive, but an AR set up for subsonic 300 black out looks like the well tested solution for a subsonic AR. There is also the .22 AR that is built in 22lr.
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Old April 9, 2024, 10:03 AM   #24
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Ok, im going to go ahead and throw this out there. Based on my understanding of the situation, you're expectations are unrealistic.

You are not going to be able to achieve your goals related to noise with what you have, and or without spending an additional $500-1000. And even then it may not meet your expectations/needs.

A suppressor will cost you around $500 and up, plus a $200 tax stamp, and a waiting period of 4 weeks plus. Even with a suppressor on a 223/5.56 rifle it will still be louder than a lawnmower, similar to a 22lr in my experience.

What your wanting to achieve is Hollywood quiet, which can be done with 300 blackout, subsonic ammo, and a good 30cal suppressor. But its not going to be cheap to do or shoot.

So you are going to have to adjust your expectations either in the area of noise, cost, or both.

I hope you can find a good solution that will meet your needs.
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Old April 9, 2024, 11:23 AM   #25
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If I were you, I would buy noise cancelling headphones, as much cheap ammo as reasonable, find a place to go shooting, and put some rounds downrange.
Of course, work on the fundamentals of running the gun, safety, and basic accuracy. Like golf, you can only pretend so much before you have to get the rounds in.

After a couple hundred rounds you'll have a more balanced view of changes to make.

IMHO of course.
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