Using the Win. .308 field gauge.

Ignition Override · March 18, 2013, 12:21 AM

Just to verify that I understood how people use these, this Win. .308 gauge is First pushed into the chamber, before the bolt is pushed forward while gently attempting to turn it?
If so, then the this field gauge has excellent results-it won't turn at all.

I watched one very seasoned reloading/marksman do so with my gun, but it was about a year ago, and I want to verify that this is the proper procedure.

david_r · March 18, 2013, 01:50 AM

Does your gauge have a cutout for your extractor? If it doesn't, it needs to be picked up out of the magazine for any bolt head that doesn't require the extractor to be pushed over the case rim.

Why are you using a field gauge instead of a no-go? A gauge will only tell you something is out of (or within) specification but not by how much. You need a set to find which ones your chamber falls between.

Bart B. · March 18, 2013, 07:57 AM

Yes, that's the right procedure. Some bolt's extractor requires the gauge be slipped into the bolt face before pushing it into the chamber. Many Mauser 98 actions are like this but other with claw extractors will slip over the gauge head; classic controlled feed Win. 70's for example. If the extractory doesn't have a larger inward-angled surface to slide over the case rim, then you gotta slide the gauge into it first.

F. Guffey · March 18, 2013, 10:13 AM

Today, 12:21 AM #1
Ignition Override
Senior Member

Join Date: February 18, 2008
Posts: 1,497 Using the Win. .308 field gauge.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Just to verify that I understood how people use these, this Win. .308 gauge is First pushed into the chamber, before the bolt is pushed forward while gently attempting to turn it?
If so, then the this field gauge has excellent results-it won't turn at all.

I watched one very seasoned reloading/marksman do so with my gun, but it was about a year ago, and I want to verify that this is the proper procedure.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

“Just to verify that” Yes, there comes a time when talking about ‘it’ does not get ‘it’ done, I am the #ONE fan of verifying. “how (DO) people use these?” Understand! the head space gage is a package deal, back to verify, “I watched one very seasoned reloading/marksman do so with my gun” and that was it? He passed up an opportunity to add a knowledgeable reloader to the list. I would not waste your time by attempting to check the length of your chamber without explaining how it is done and explain the tool more thoroughly.

This is a reloading forum, I will assume responses to this thread are posted by knowledgeable reloaders.

VERIFY: Head space gage, if you are a reloader and loading for your 308 Winchester chamber you have a press, die and shell holder and own a field (reject) gage, or, you are contemplating purchasing one. Because I am the verifiers #ONE fan I would use the press, die and shell holder to verify the dies ability to full length size a case back to minimum length. We as reloaders should know none of the head space gages will allow the die to contact the shell holder when the ram is raised if the the go, no and or beyond gage is installed into the shell holder when the ram is raised. (PROBLEM), the head space gage (GO, NO or beyond) may not fit the shell holder, nor a problem, for a, seasoned reloader, the seasoned? reeloader would use the #4 belted magnum type shell holder, both the #3 and #4 have a deck height of .125” (verifiable with a height gage.

After installing the #4 shell holder, install the 308 Winchester die without the primer punch/sizer plug assemble into the top of the press with the go or the no or the beyond (field gage) setting on the shell holder deck, raise the ram then screw the die down ‘until’ it contacts the field (reject) gage, then stop and think about it. Ask your self (Self?) if you have a cam over press or a RCBS Rock Chucker type lock-up, jam-up or cram-up press, I suggest thinking about ‘it’ because if the press does in fact ‘CAM OVER’ the verifying of the die/shell holder with a head space gage could be off (error) the amount of cam over.

Then there is the Minimum and the Maximum according to SAMMI, the 308 W is MINIMUM 1.630, the Maximum is 1.640, and that is the reason my numbers are better than Sammie’s, no one makes a different die for each of the 10 options between minimum and maximum. My dies are made for minimum length sizing back to full length sizing, therefore I verify my chamber length ‘s’, then adjust the die.

Back to raising the ram with the go-gage, or the no go-gage or the field gage setting on/in the shell holder, after raising the ram, lower the die until it contacts the the head space gage. After the die contact the the gage measure the gap between the die and shell holder with a thickness gage, know to experienced/seasoned reloaders as the companion tool to the press, the feeler gage. `

Back to the part where a knowledgeable reloader knows the die can not be adjusted down to the shell holder with a head space gage setting on the deck of the shell holder, The gap will indicate which head space gage is being used. If the gap is .004” the gage will be a go-gage, if the gap is .008” the gage will be a no-go gage and if the gap is .010” the gage will be a field gage.

Bolt advance? It is almost safe to say the bolt rotates 90 degree from lug engagement to bolt (advance) close, for me it requires little effort to determine the forward advance of the bolt from engage to close in thousandths (.000”), means nothing to anyone else, but I can use the field gage to determine the length of the chamber in .000” because a LONG TIME AGO I determined the bolt was closed and the bolt lugs would/could not be pulled back any further, so I measure the back of the bolt protrusion, then .000” (zeroed) my micrometer, then, installed the no-go or field length space gage and measured again, the difference in the two measurements allowed me to determine the difference in length between the chamber and gage.

Advance reloader? head space gages are nice, most purchases a head space gage then spend the rewst of their like talking about owning one/them. If I had a head space gage I would spend the rest of life using them as a verifying too, again, because I am the # ONE fan of verifying.

Rather than purchase a head space gage then I suggest you purchase a 308 Winchester forming die, the 308 Forming die can be used to duplicate anything A head space gage can do only better because instead of having 3 options out of 26 options an experienced reloader can have 20 options between minimum length (.000”) to +.020”, A reloader that can form cases can form 30/06 cases to 308 Winchester length cases, IF they understand the incline plain and or threads on the press and die. Back to verifying, I size a case and then verify the length of the case from the shoulder to the head of the case, again, I know the length of the chamber.

There is no excuse for an experienced reloader not to knowing how to determine the length of the chamber, again,

“I watched one very seasoned reloading/marksman do so with my gun, but it was about a year ago, and I want to verify that this is the proper procedure”

The seasoned reloader, after chambering the field gage die not know the length of the chamber, all he knew was “the bolt did not close, he did know ‘why’ if by ‘how much’.

Page #66

http://www.saami.org/specifications_...wnload/206.pdf

F. Guffey

March 18, 2013, 12:21 AM	#1
Ignition Override Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2008 Location: About 20 nm from the Big Muddy Posts: 2,884	Using the Win. .308 field gauge. Just to verify that I understood how people use these, this Win. .308 gauge is First pushed into the chamber, before the bolt is pushed forward while gently attempting to turn it? If so, then the this field gauge has excellent results-it won't turn at all. I watched one very seasoned reloading/marksman do so with my gun, but it was about a year ago, and I want to verify that this is the proper procedure. Last edited by Ignition Override; March 18, 2013 at 01:13 AM.

March 18, 2013, 01:50 AM	#2
david_r Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2013 Posts: 131	Does your gauge have a cutout for your extractor? If it doesn't, it needs to be picked up out of the magazine for any bolt head that doesn't require the extractor to be pushed over the case rim. Why are you using a field gauge instead of a no-go? A gauge will only tell you something is out of (or within) specification but not by how much. You need a set to find which ones your chamber falls between.

March 18, 2013, 07:57 AM	#3
Bart B. Senior Member Join Date: February 15, 2009 Posts: 8,927	Yes, that's the right procedure. Some bolt's extractor requires the gauge be slipped into the bolt face before pushing it into the chamber. Many Mauser 98 actions are like this but other with claw extractors will slip over the gauge head; classic controlled feed Win. 70's for example. If the extractory doesn't have a larger inward-angled surface to slide over the case rim, then you gotta slide the gauge into it first.

March 18, 2013, 10:13 AM	#4
F. Guffey Senior Member Join Date: July 18, 2008 Posts: 7,249	Today, 12:21 AM #1 Ignition Override Senior Member Join Date: February 18, 2008 Posts: 1,497 Using the Win. .308 field gauge. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Just to verify that I understood how people use these, this Win. .308 gauge is First pushed into the chamber, before the bolt is pushed forward while gently attempting to turn it? If so, then the this field gauge has excellent results-it won't turn at all. I watched one very seasoned reloading/marksman do so with my gun, but it was about a year ago, and I want to verify that this is the proper procedure. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- “Just to verify that” Yes, there comes a time when talking about ‘it’ does not get ‘it’ done, I am the #ONE fan of verifying. “how (DO) people use these?” Understand! the head space gage is a package deal, back to verify, “I watched one very seasoned reloading/marksman do so with my gun” and that was it? He passed up an opportunity to add a knowledgeable reloader to the list. I would not waste your time by attempting to check the length of your chamber without explaining how it is done and explain the tool more thoroughly. This is a reloading forum, I will assume responses to this thread are posted by knowledgeable reloaders. VERIFY: Head space gage, if you are a reloader and loading for your 308 Winchester chamber you have a press, die and shell holder and own a field (reject) gage, or, you are contemplating purchasing one. Because I am the verifiers #ONE fan I would use the press, die and shell holder to verify the dies ability to full length size a case back to minimum length. We as reloaders should know none of the head space gages will allow the die to contact the shell holder when the ram is raised if the the go, no and or beyond gage is installed into the shell holder when the ram is raised. (PROBLEM), the head space gage (GO, NO or beyond) may not fit the shell holder, nor a problem, for a, seasoned reloader, the seasoned? reeloader would use the #4 belted magnum type shell holder, both the #3 and #4 have a deck height of .125” (verifiable with a height gage. After installing the #4 shell holder, install the 308 Winchester die without the primer punch/sizer plug assemble into the top of the press with the go or the no or the beyond (field gage) setting on the shell holder deck, raise the ram then screw the die down ‘until’ it contacts the field (reject) gage, then stop and think about it. Ask your self (Self?) if you have a cam over press or a RCBS Rock Chucker type lock-up, jam-up or cram-up press, I suggest thinking about ‘it’ because if the press does in fact ‘CAM OVER’ the verifying of the die/shell holder with a head space gage could be off (error) the amount of cam over. Then there is the Minimum and the Maximum according to SAMMI, the 308 W is MINIMUM 1.630, the Maximum is 1.640, and that is the reason my numbers are better than Sammie’s, no one makes a different die for each of the 10 options between minimum and maximum. My dies are made for minimum length sizing back to full length sizing, therefore I verify my chamber length ‘s’, then adjust the die. Back to raising the ram with the go-gage, or the no go-gage or the field gage setting on/in the shell holder, after raising the ram, lower the die until it contacts the the head space gage. After the die contact the the gage measure the gap between the die and shell holder with a thickness gage, know to experienced/seasoned reloaders as the companion tool to the press, the feeler gage. ` Back to the part where a knowledgeable reloader knows the die can not be adjusted down to the shell holder with a head space gage setting on the deck of the shell holder, The gap will indicate which head space gage is being used. If the gap is .004” the gage will be a go-gage, if the gap is .008” the gage will be a no-go gage and if the gap is .010” the gage will be a field gage. Bolt advance? It is almost safe to say the bolt rotates 90 degree from lug engagement to bolt (advance) close, for me it requires little effort to determine the forward advance of the bolt from engage to close in thousandths (.000”), means nothing to anyone else, but I can use the field gage to determine the length of the chamber in .000” because a LONG TIME AGO I determined the bolt was closed and the bolt lugs would/could not be pulled back any further, so I measure the back of the bolt protrusion, then .000” (zeroed) my micrometer, then, installed the no-go or field length space gage and measured again, the difference in the two measurements allowed me to determine the difference in length between the chamber and gage. Advance reloader? head space gages are nice, most purchases a head space gage then spend the rewst of their like talking about owning one/them. If I had a head space gage I would spend the rest of life using them as a verifying too, again, because I am the # ONE fan of verifying. Rather than purchase a head space gage then I suggest you purchase a 308 Winchester forming die, the 308 Forming die can be used to duplicate anything A head space gage can do only better because instead of having 3 options out of 26 options an experienced reloader can have 20 options between minimum length (.000”) to +.020”, A reloader that can form cases can form 30/06 cases to 308 Winchester length cases, IF they understand the incline plain and or threads on the press and die. Back to verifying, I size a case and then verify the length of the case from the shoulder to the head of the case, again, I know the length of the chamber. There is no excuse for an experienced reloader not to knowing how to determine the length of the chamber, again, “I watched one very seasoned reloading/marksman do so with my gun, but it was about a year ago, and I want to verify that this is the proper procedure” The seasoned reloader, after chambering the field gage die not know the length of the chamber, all he knew was “the bolt did not close, he did know ‘why’ if by ‘how much’. Page #66 http://www.saami.org/specifications_...wnload/206.pdf F. Guffey