Question for the Cowboy shooters

oilcan72 · January 29, 2011, 08:01 AM

Hello all,

I'm just getting in to the Cowboy action shooting, and I have an ASM 1858 Remington cartridge conversion to start with. My question is which draw style is the easiest for a beginner, cross draw or regular draw? I just wanted to get a rig to start with before I get in too deep.

Thanks everyone

oilcan72

Delmar · January 29, 2011, 09:40 AM

Cross draw is less common. I suppose it just matters what feels best to you. If I remember correctly there are category where cross draw is not allowed but I haven't looked at the rules in a while.

I like CASS a lot but I have only done it a few times cause I decided the cost is too rich for my blood. I might change my mind if I find a really good deal on a nice rifle.

wogpotter · January 29, 2011, 10:07 AM

I don't shoot competition like SASS so this may not be relevant, but I think it depends on barrel length.

If you have the 7 1/2" BBL it's a long way to pull up, even with a western-style holster, unless you go for the low slung gunslinger look with the latigo strap below the knee & so on.
If you have a 5~6" BBL then this doesn't seem to be so much of a problem.

I'm basing this on using a '58 Remington with the 7 1/2" barrel & a 6" modern revolver I find no problem with the 6" BBL even with a much higher holster position, but am thinking of a cross-draw rig for the '58.

darwins · January 29, 2011, 10:55 AM

I too am just getting into CAS. However, I have been told by those I know who are involved that cross-draw is generally not allowed because you end up sweeping those behind and to the side of you with your muzzle.

junkman_01 · January 29, 2011, 11:19 AM

Then an awful lot of SASS/CAS shooters are breaking their organizations rules. I think they are allowed as I see them all the time.

Noz · January 29, 2011, 12:00 PM

Cross draws are allowed and there are techiques that are enforced that allow you to make a reasonable draw from a cross draw holster without sweeping anyone.
It can be a hassle if the RO is not familiar with the techniques required.

Whether to use them or not is strickly personal choice. Short barreled guns seem to like the cross draw better.

Some of the faster shooters use the cross draw but a lot more use the double strong side holster straight drop, one on each hip.

I am not fast and never will be but I have gone to the double strong side holster set. It allows me to use both hands in transition better than the cross draw.

Try both ways, see what works for you.

wogpotter · January 29, 2011, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Short barreled guns seem to like the cross draw better.

The exact opposite of what I found, interesting.

Hellgate · January 29, 2011, 07:33 PM

I shoot my remingtons with the weak side cross draw. The long barrels are slower to holster in the leather is high on the hip. To safely holster I do a partial pivot to avoid breaking the 170.

Jbar4Ranch · January 30, 2011, 12:35 AM

There seems to be about an even split between crossdraw rigs and double rigs, but I think I see more crossdraw rigs.

Gunfighter and B-Western are the only two categories that require double rigs instead of cross draw rigs, but a double rig can be used in ANY category. Gunfighter can be a drop rig or not, but B-Western requires the entire revolver to be below the top of the belt... not necessarily a Buscadero rig, as a straight belt with a drop holster would be just as acceptable... as long as it was "flashy". A crossdraw holster can't depart from vertical by more than 30° as normally worn, holsters must be on different sides of the belly button, and separated by at least the width of two fists at the belt. With different barrel lengths, most folks will put the longer barrel in the crossdraw holster.

I've used a crossdraw rig most of the time I've been shooting Cowboy Action, but I started crossing over to Gunfighter about three years ago, and have been stocking up on fancy clothes, boots, & leather for B-Western since last year.

The founders of the game knew how it was to be played, but eventually "The Gamers" came along and a rule book had to be written, and it gets longer & longer with each incarnation because so many people do things to gain an edge that aren't really in the spirit of the game, and when called on it say, "Show me in the rule book where it says I can't do that."

http://www.sassnet.com/Downloads/RO/...ok-16-2010.pdf

fal308 · January 30, 2011, 10:05 AM

I run strong side straight drop on my left hip and crossdraw just in front of my right hip. I use a pair of 7 1/2 bbl Vaqueros. I swivel slightly downrange when drawing/holstering the crossdrawn gun.

Tanker6 · January 30, 2011, 06:53 PM

I'm using a double strong (one on each hip) currently, but it's a loaner from my pard. I've been using it for about a month and have come to the following conclusions.

First, it's a really nice set up and if I wanted to shoot with both hands, then this is great. By "two handed," I mean I can shoot two-handed with each pistol, shoot gunfighter (with one in each hand at the same time) or double duelist (shooting right side with right hand, then pull left side and shoot left side with left hand). However, I think I've decided to shoot duelist which is one-handed for both pistols. I'm right handed and like to shoot with that hand. The issue I have with double strong is that it takes time to get my grip properly when handing the gun from my left to my right hand (after drawing the left pistol). Hence, when I decide on my own leather (which will be fairly soon), I will probably opt for a crossdraw so I can grab both pistols with my shooting hand.

I type all of this so that those reading can realize that each rig has its own pros and cons, so the best thing to do is experiment -- especially if someone's willing to let you try their stuff, before you make a decision.

Jim Watson · January 30, 2011, 09:47 PM

With CAS gear, the crossdraw + straight draw is fast if you are shooting both guns with one hand, not gunfighter or double duelist.
You are SUPPOSED to do the "cross draw sashay" which keeps the gun forward of the 170 degree line on the draw, but most folks barely wiggle their hips and the gun just kind of whips around with little said. Or did the last I shot which has been a while.

January 29, 2011, 08:01 AM	#1
oilcan72 Member Join Date: August 28, 2009 Location: NorthWest Indiana Posts: 47	Question for the Cowboy shooters Hello all, I'm just getting in to the Cowboy action shooting, and I have an ASM 1858 Remington cartridge conversion to start with. My question is which draw style is the easiest for a beginner, cross draw or regular draw? I just wanted to get a rig to start with before I get in too deep. Thanks everyone oilcan72

January 29, 2011, 10:07 AM	#3
wogpotter Senior Member Join Date: September 27, 2004 Posts: 4,811	I don't shoot competition like SASS so this may not be relevant, but I think it depends on barrel length. If you have the 7 1/2" BBL it's a long way to pull up, even with a western-style holster, unless you go for the low slung gunslinger look with the latigo strap below the knee & so on. If you have a 5~6" BBL then this doesn't seem to be so much of a problem. I'm basing this on using a '58 Remington with the 7 1/2" barrel & a 6" modern revolver I find no problem with the 6" BBL even with a much higher holster position, but am thinking of a cross-draw rig for the '58. __________________ Allan Quatermain: “Automatic rifles. Who in God's name has automatic rifles”? Elderly Hunter: “That's dashed unsporting. Probably Belgium.”

January 29, 2011, 07:33 PM	#8
Hellgate Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2010 Location: Orygun Posts: 869	I shoot my remingtons with the weak side cross draw. The long barrels are slower to holster in the leather is high on the hip. To safely holster I do a partial pivot to avoid breaking the 170. __________________ With over 15 perCUSSIN' revolvers, I've been called the Imelda Marcos of cap & ball. SASS#3302 (Life), SASS Regulator, NRA (Life), Dirty Gamey Bastards #129 Wolverton Mtn. Peacekeepers (WA), former Orygun Cowboy (Ranger, Posse from Hell)

January 30, 2011, 12:35 AM	#9
Jbar4Ranch Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 1999 Location: Near Helena, Montana Posts: 1,719	There seems to be about an even split between crossdraw rigs and double rigs, but I think I see more crossdraw rigs. Gunfighter and B-Western are the only two categories that require double rigs instead of cross draw rigs, but a double rig can be used in ANY category. Gunfighter can be a drop rig or not, but B-Western requires the entire revolver to be below the top of the belt... not necessarily a Buscadero rig, as a straight belt with a drop holster would be just as acceptable... as long as it was "flashy". A crossdraw holster can't depart from vertical by more than 30° as normally worn, holsters must be on different sides of the belly button, and separated by at least the width of two fists at the belt. With different barrel lengths, most folks will put the longer barrel in the crossdraw holster. I've used a crossdraw rig most of the time I've been shooting Cowboy Action, but I started crossing over to Gunfighter about three years ago, and have been stocking up on fancy clothes, boots, & leather for B-Western since last year. The founders of the game knew how it was to be played, but eventually "The Gamers" came along and a rule book had to be written, and it gets longer & longer with each incarnation because so many people do things to gain an edge that aren't really in the spirit of the game, and when called on it say, "Show me in the rule book where it says I can't do that." http://www.sassnet.com/Downloads/RO/...ok-16-2010.pdf __________________ Sometimes the squeaky wheel gets replaced... SASS 47015

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January 29, 2011, 09:40 AM	#2
Delmar Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2009 Location: Norhthern Indiana Posts: 307	Cross draw is less common. I suppose it just matters what feels best to you. If I remember correctly there are category where cross draw is not allowed but I haven't looked at the rules in a while. I like CASS a lot but I have only done it a few times cause I decided the cost is too rich for my blood. I might change my mind if I find a really good deal on a nice rifle.

January 29, 2011, 10:55 AM	#4
darwins Senior Member Join Date: September 18, 2008 Posts: 100	I too am just getting into CAS. However, I have been told by those I know who are involved that cross-draw is generally not allowed because you end up sweeping those behind and to the side of you with your muzzle.

January 29, 2011, 11:19 AM	#5
junkman_01 Junior member Join Date: November 9, 2010 Location: Florida Posts: 260	Then an awful lot of SASS/CAS shooters are breaking their organizations rules. I think they are allowed as I see them all the time.

January 29, 2011, 12:00 PM	#6
Noz Senior Member Join Date: February 25, 2009 Posts: 643	Cross draws are allowed and there are techiques that are enforced that allow you to make a reasonable draw from a cross draw holster without sweeping anyone. It can be a hassle if the RO is not familiar with the techniques required. Whether to use them or not is strickly personal choice. Short barreled guns seem to like the cross draw better. Some of the faster shooters use the cross draw but a lot more use the double strong side holster straight drop, one on each hip. I am not fast and never will be but I have gone to the double strong side holster set. It allows me to use both hands in transition better than the cross draw. Try both ways, see what works for you.

January 30, 2011, 10:05 AM	#10
fal308 Staff Alumnus Join Date: October 12, 1998 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,992	I run strong side straight drop on my left hip and crossdraw just in front of my right hip. I use a pair of 7 1/2 bbl Vaqueros. I swivel slightly downrange when drawing/holstering the crossdrawn gun.

January 30, 2011, 06:53 PM	#11
Tanker6 Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 2010 Location: Texas Posts: 193	I'm using a double strong (one on each hip) currently, but it's a loaner from my pard. I've been using it for about a month and have come to the following conclusions. First, it's a really nice set up and if I wanted to shoot with both hands, then this is great. By "two handed," I mean I can shoot two-handed with each pistol, shoot gunfighter (with one in each hand at the same time) or double duelist (shooting right side with right hand, then pull left side and shoot left side with left hand). However, I think I've decided to shoot duelist which is one-handed for both pistols. I'm right handed and like to shoot with that hand. The issue I have with double strong is that it takes time to get my grip properly when handing the gun from my left to my right hand (after drawing the left pistol). Hence, when I decide on my own leather (which will be fairly soon), I will probably opt for a crossdraw so I can grab both pistols with my shooting hand. I type all of this so that those reading can realize that each rig has its own pros and cons, so the best thing to do is experiment -- especially if someone's willing to let you try their stuff, before you make a decision.

January 30, 2011, 09:47 PM	#12
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,534	With CAS gear, the crossdraw + straight draw is fast if you are shooting both guns with one hand, not gunfighter or double duelist. You are SUPPOSED to do the "cross draw sashay" which keeps the gun forward of the 170 degree line on the draw, but most folks barely wiggle their hips and the gun just kind of whips around with little said. Or did the last I shot which has been a while.