Savage 10 stock question

cptmclark · March 6, 2018, 03:09 PM

Hello,

Im joining the 6.5 long range fun. I want to use my Savage 10 that I rebarreled to 358 Hoosier, replacing the barrel and whatever else it needs.

I see all internet stuff I find is only about replacing that stock with a new model. I like my stock and want to use it. Is it not a good one?

This synthetic stock has an aluminum channel down the stock and pillar bedding. Seems to me it should be good, or easily fixable. Is it? If not can it be easily fixed by tang bedding or other treat?

Thanks for support and help from those with experience with these. This is my first, and it fits me very well so I hope it will support the 1/2 MOA performance I seek.

PS: I do have a 5.56 (0.6”) and a 22-250 (0.75”) that don’t fit me well

std7mag · March 6, 2018, 04:08 PM

If you have the accu stock, and like it then why replace it?

**Unclenick** · March 7, 2018, 03:54 PM

I have the same reaction. Since stocks can be replaced independently from the barrel, why not just do the rebarreling first and see how it shoots? If there's an issue that the new barrel and some tuned loads doesn't fix, then you can look at whether or not the stock is doing what it should. Unless you go to a barrel contour that is too heavy to fit in the stock channel, I would just go with those steps.

Very often, changing stocks is about fitting the shooter better. Adding and adjustable elevation butt plate and cheek rest, getting an under-rail for a palm rest or other accessories, or sometimes with a target rifle, just flat adding some weight for stability in wind. Only you can decide if those things matter to you.

cptmclark · March 7, 2018, 04:57 PM

Thanks.

I assumed no one uses the originals because all articles I found involved a stock change to some gee whiz looking new unit.

Now, I need to choose a most accurate barrel maker. Ideas?
A6.5 Creed or 6.5 PRC

Scorch · March 7, 2018, 05:47 PM

A few of my favorite accurate barrel makers (in no particular order):
Obermeier
Bartlein
Schneider
Lilja
Hart
Mike Rock
Kreiger
Shilen
Douglas

For just about any good quality barrel, you are going to pay at least $400 for just a blank, along with a 3-6 month wait. Some distributors stock barrels, but popular sizes and twist rates are often special ordered.

Then you pay a gunsmith $300-$600 to take the blank and turn it into a barrel. Then you will have to bed the stock, and then finish the metal and stock.

cptmclark · March 7, 2018, 06:41 PM

I used a Shilin bbl on the the same stock for a 358.
It gave me no better than 1moa with best load. For the 6.5, I need 0.5, and it will be the first I’ve had.

RC20 · March 9, 2018, 01:26 PM

If he has a Savage then the barrels come pre fit, $350 to $450

Cut rifle makers are more expensive and a longer wait.

If the Shilen does not shoot then its very likely the stock or the shooter or poor loads. Not a clue what a 358 Hoosier is. Good loads is more than stuffing powder and a bullet in a case.

Shilen is top of the class with button rifled barrels. With developed loads they will shoot under 1/2 MOA.

Lother Walther makes a good barrel but only in Varmint and select calibers (for Savage pre fit, you can special order and its about $550)

I hear good reports on Criterion. I don't have one but they seem to be up there with Shilen finish wise and they are very active on checking gout a barrel that is reported not to shoot.

Bartlein, Lilja etc are top line bench rest and a waste of money for most.

cptmclark · March 9, 2018, 03:28 PM

The 358 Hoosier is a wildcat made to comply with ch@nging state laws that specified max case length and min cal of 357. Now we can use others but the 358 Hoohsir provides about 358 Win ballistics.
My best accuracy with my rifles has been 0.6 with a RR and .75 with a bedded old Rem. Neither fit me like the Savage does.

Thanks for the information.

RC20 · March 9, 2018, 07:44 PM

Not that a lot can't go into it, but all barrel makers throw an occasional bad one out as well.

I would contact Shilen (or the distributor you got it from)

If you can shoot to the .6 and .75 range, its not the shooter. Stock seems good one.

I am definitely sub 1/2 MOA with my 06 Shilen on a Savage action.

Getting regular 3/8 and a few 1/4 and holes in 1.

My reloads are good but not bench rest class.

cptmclark · March 9, 2018, 08:50 PM

Thanks RC20.
I need the hope. I've enjoyed working on my on rifl s for fifty years. Always hoping to get one moa. Now I read about folks expecting a half minute and I want it

jmr40 · March 9, 2018, 09:08 PM

The stock you have is better than 90% of the aftermarket stocks. You could spend $600 and get a stock 1/2 lb lighter, but not any more accurate. Anything else would at best be a lateral move and probably a downgrade.

cptmclark · March 10, 2018, 08:17 AM

.04 from an 06 is subperb. Mine with a glass bedded stock bearing points stays under 1.0 loaded hot, but not with light loads. Original 700 bbl.

With these alum reinforced stocks, is there any benefit from glas bedding any points, or is the rail and pillar torque points probably the best as is?
Just adding the new barrel and whupping up some tailored loads seems way easier than the old days. I’m eager

RC20 · March 10, 2018, 11:34 AM

I am really not a stock person, my brother does wood stock bedding.

I have 3 and the only one that got bedded was an EABS Thumbhole that had pillars and they were flat not curved, it never fit right.

The other two (including the 06) are Boyds. Fit right in, relieved the rear tang and that was it.

I figured if I could get sub MOA I was going to be happy.

What I found was once I had a good setup, sub 5/8 was doable.

At that point it was no longer the equipment (shot a lot of mil surplus prior and a bit of Sako) it was the shooter and the reloads.

And its one of those you never know.

1. I got a bug for 7.5 Swiss, got a K-31 (and a 1911 in the deal) and built up a Savage. The K-31 would not shoot, great barrel, clean, little use. Finally one day I moved the bullet way back and then it shot what is supposed to (actually a bit better at just sub 1 MOA to 1 MOA.

2. I have been shooting a lot of 168 Hornady Z-Max (promotional item, actually A Max with a yellow/green tip). I just found those shoot good up close to the lands.

Its been decent bags, working on consistent trigger, consistent butt tension into the shoulder, refining reloads (I got rid of the expander in the sizer and use the Lyman M die which is very gentle on the neck)

Some days it all comes together and is great, other days it goes back to 3/4 cause I am not consistent. And I am 65, been at it hard for 5 years now I guess, its going to be my entertainment if I can retire.

cptmclark · March 10, 2018, 02:09 PM

Dear adorable,

Good info on your efforts. Very useful. Other writers too.
My 06 is still a factory ADL from 20 years ago, except that I relieved and bedded the action with accraglas. Always a 1.25 shooter until lately when I played with the loads again. This one has a very long throat, letting me load wAy out to get close to the lands. I did away with the bore width in then neck to gain case space and bumped up the 4350 a bit under my 165 sbt. Group size reduced and speed went to 2950. Not sure it’s wise but measurements, primers and bolt lift are normal. My best mid animal shooter so far. (Retiring does give u time to shoot, if u can still afford the powder and ball

RC20 · March 10, 2018, 05:15 PM

Well its been a long time since I was Dear Adorable!

Mostly its to annoy the people that have all those saying cute saying like Guns don't kill people, people do and some of that other bravado sort.

You are welcome. I like sharing what I have learned and in turn I have learned volumes here.

So far my Savages have told me when I was getting over the limit. Heavy bolt lift, the ejector wipe. This is a good write-up on it.

https://www.primalrights.com/library...nding-pressure

You might consider a 12FV from Savage, when they come on sale they are as low as $279 (rebate and Cabella discount) - $325 rebate only.

The stock is cheap but the 6.5 shoots easy, the barrel is a heavy Varmint contour, top bolt release which I prefer in a Savage.

The barrels generally are quite good, sub 3/4 MOA with a good hand loads.

The Acu Trigger (Varmint with adjusted down to 1.5 .bs) is a really nice trigger, almost as good as a Jewel.

You can get a Boyds stock latter, unde $150 for the standard, I like the lightweight thumbhole best so far. My brother has an At One stock I will shoot eventually.

They are laminated so its not going to move around at all, they look good with quite a color and finish choice.

thickstrings · April 29, 2018, 08:05 PM

Im surprised no one has mentioned http://northlandshooterssupply.com/ They sell screw on barrels for Savage and Remington...Do it yourself... Critereon barrels in the 300.00$ range. Most calibers...Highly recommended! Real easy on a Savage. The 6.5 Creed will shoot. Try a Bell and Carlson .... aluminum bedded and Stiff ... not a flexy fore end like the Sav.

RC20 · April 30, 2018, 09:56 AM

Yep, I should have said NSS, instead of Shilen Distributor. Very nice to work with. Good tool set for the Savage barrel tools.

They also sell Criterion and those are rated right up with Shilen from those I have discussion with that owned both.

If you put a larger barrel on, you likely will have to relieve the channel to keep it free floating.

Stick with the operations that do the whole job (barrel and the pre fit work) (the mentioned ones).

I have seen Criterion jump into discussions and almost demand a barrel back if its not shooting. They are serious.

I think Shilen responds directly as well. I am not impressed with XCR,

My bench mark is Shilen and how easily it cleans and shoots. By far away the easiest to clean. To me that means they put effort into lapping and that reflects on its the better consistent shooter.

cptmclark · April 30, 2018, 10:36 AM

I actually used NSS for the tools and a replacement barrel nut,
the bbl came from Shilin. Best accuracy with the 358 Hoosier was 1.1" with a 180 Barnes bullet. Heavier bullets not so good. I hope I installed the bbl right.

Now i've put the original unshot 22-250 barrel back on (the Hoosier isn't needed any more) and shot it one time. About 25 rounds doing a break in routine. Shot two five shot groups at the end, and both were 1.0" at 100 yds.

How to reduce these groups is what I'm hoping to learn about. I want to get into one of the 6.5s and have a 0.5" shooter, but don't know if anyone guarantees that accuracy?

March 6, 2018, 03:09 PM	#1
cptmclark Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 432	Savage 10 stock question Hello, Im joining the 6.5 long range fun. I want to use my Savage 10 that I rebarreled to 358 Hoosier, replacing the barrel and whatever else it needs. I see all internet stuff I find is only about replacing that stock with a new model. I like my stock and want to use it. Is it not a good one? This synthetic stock has an aluminum channel down the stock and pillar bedding. Seems to me it should be good, or easily fixable. Is it? If not can it be easily fixed by tang bedding or other treat? Thanks for support and help from those with experience with these. This is my first, and it fits me very well so I hope it will support the 1/2 MOA performance I seek. PS: I do have a 5.56 (0.6”) and a 22-250 (0.75”) that don’t fit me well

March 7, 2018, 03:54 PM	#3
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	I have the same reaction. Since stocks can be replaced independently from the barrel, why not just do the rebarreling first and see how it shoots? If there's an issue that the new barrel and some tuned loads doesn't fix, then you can look at whether or not the stock is doing what it should. Unless you go to a barrel contour that is too heavy to fit in the stock channel, I would just go with those steps. Very often, changing stocks is about fitting the shooter better. Adding and adjustable elevation butt plate and cheek rest, getting an under-rail for a palm rest or other accessories, or sometimes with a target rifle, just flat adding some weight for stability in wind. Only you can decide if those things matter to you. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

March 7, 2018, 05:47 PM	#5
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	A few of my favorite accurate barrel makers (in no particular order): Obermeier Bartlein Schneider Lilja Hart Mike Rock Kreiger Shilen Douglas For just about any good quality barrel, you are going to pay at least $400 for just a blank, along with a 3-6 month wait. Some distributors stock barrels, but popular sizes and twist rates are often special ordered. Then you pay a gunsmith $300-$600 to take the blank and turn it into a barrel. Then you will have to bed the stock, and then finish the metal and stock. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services

March 9, 2018, 01:26 PM	#7
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	If he has a Savage then the barrels come pre fit, $350 to $450 Cut rifle makers are more expensive and a longer wait. If the Shilen does not shoot then its very likely the stock or the shooter or poor loads. Not a clue what a 358 Hoosier is. Good loads is more than stuffing powder and a bullet in a case. Shilen is top of the class with button rifled barrels. With developed loads they will shoot under 1/2 MOA. Lother Walther makes a good barrel but only in Varmint and select calibers (for Savage pre fit, you can special order and its about $550) I hear good reports on Criterion. I don't have one but they seem to be up there with Shilen finish wise and they are very active on checking gout a barrel that is reported not to shoot. Bartlein, Lilja etc are top line bench rest and a waste of money for most. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

March 9, 2018, 07:44 PM	#9
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	Not that a lot can't go into it, but all barrel makers throw an occasional bad one out as well. I would contact Shilen (or the distributor you got it from) If you can shoot to the .6 and .75 range, its not the shooter. Stock seems good one. I am definitely sub 1/2 MOA with my 06 Shilen on a Savage action. Getting regular 3/8 and a few 1/4 and holes in 1. My reloads are good but not bench rest class. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

March 6, 2018, 04:08 PM	#2
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	If you have the accu stock, and like it then why replace it?

March 7, 2018, 04:57 PM	#4
cptmclark Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 432	Thanks. I assumed no one uses the originals because all articles I found involved a stock change to some gee whiz looking new unit. Now, I need to choose a most accurate barrel maker. Ideas? A6.5 Creed or 6.5 PRC

March 7, 2018, 06:41 PM	#6
cptmclark Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 432	I used a Shilin bbl on the the same stock for a 358. It gave me no better than 1moa with best load. For the 6.5, I need 0.5, and it will be the first I’ve had.

March 9, 2018, 03:28 PM	#8
cptmclark Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 432	The 358 Hoosier is a wildcat made to comply with ch@nging state laws that specified max case length and min cal of 357. Now we can use others but the 358 Hoohsir provides about 358 Win ballistics. My best accuracy with my rifles has been 0.6 with a RR and .75 with a bedded old Rem. Neither fit me like the Savage does. Thanks for the information.

March 9, 2018, 08:50 PM	#10
cptmclark Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 432	Thanks RC20. I need the hope. I've enjoyed working on my on rifl s for fifty years. Always hoping to get one moa. Now I read about folks expecting a half minute and I want it

March 9, 2018, 09:08 PM	#11
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,808	The stock you have is better than 90% of the aftermarket stocks. You could spend $600 and get a stock 1/2 lb lighter, but not any more accurate. Anything else would at best be a lateral move and probably a downgrade. __________________ "If you're still doing things the same way you were doing them 10 years ago, you're doing it wrong" Winston Churchill

March 10, 2018, 08:17 AM	#12
cptmclark Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 432	.04 from an 06 is subperb. Mine with a glass bedded stock bearing points stays under 1.0 loaded hot, but not with light loads. Original 700 bbl. With these alum reinforced stocks, is there any benefit from glas bedding any points, or is the rail and pillar torque points probably the best as is? Just adding the new barrel and whupping up some tailored loads seems way easier than the old days. I’m eager

March 10, 2018, 11:34 AM	#13
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	I am really not a stock person, my brother does wood stock bedding. I have 3 and the only one that got bedded was an EABS Thumbhole that had pillars and they were flat not curved, it never fit right. The other two (including the 06) are Boyds. Fit right in, relieved the rear tang and that was it. I figured if I could get sub MOA I was going to be happy. What I found was once I had a good setup, sub 5/8 was doable. At that point it was no longer the equipment (shot a lot of mil surplus prior and a bit of Sako) it was the shooter and the reloads. And its one of those you never know. 1. I got a bug for 7.5 Swiss, got a K-31 (and a 1911 in the deal) and built up a Savage. The K-31 would not shoot, great barrel, clean, little use. Finally one day I moved the bullet way back and then it shot what is supposed to (actually a bit better at just sub 1 MOA to 1 MOA. 2. I have been shooting a lot of 168 Hornady Z-Max (promotional item, actually A Max with a yellow/green tip). I just found those shoot good up close to the lands. Its been decent bags, working on consistent trigger, consistent butt tension into the shoulder, refining reloads (I got rid of the expander in the sizer and use the Lyman M die which is very gentle on the neck) Some days it all comes together and is great, other days it goes back to 3/4 cause I am not consistent. And I am 65, been at it hard for 5 years now I guess, its going to be my entertainment if I can retire. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

March 10, 2018, 02:09 PM	#14
cptmclark Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 432	Dear adorable, Good info on your efforts. Very useful. Other writers too. My 06 is still a factory ADL from 20 years ago, except that I relieved and bedded the action with accraglas. Always a 1.25 shooter until lately when I played with the loads again. This one has a very long throat, letting me load wAy out to get close to the lands. I did away with the bore width in then neck to gain case space and bumped up the 4350 a bit under my 165 sbt. Group size reduced and speed went to 2950. Not sure it’s wise but measurements, primers and bolt lift are normal. My best mid animal shooter so far. (Retiring does give u time to shoot, if u can still afford the powder and ball

March 10, 2018, 05:15 PM	#15
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	Well its been a long time since I was Dear Adorable! Mostly its to annoy the people that have all those saying cute saying like Guns don't kill people, people do and some of that other bravado sort. You are welcome. I like sharing what I have learned and in turn I have learned volumes here. So far my Savages have told me when I was getting over the limit. Heavy bolt lift, the ejector wipe. This is a good write-up on it. https://www.primalrights.com/library...nding-pressure You might consider a 12FV from Savage, when they come on sale they are as low as $279 (rebate and Cabella discount) - $325 rebate only. The stock is cheap but the 6.5 shoots easy, the barrel is a heavy Varmint contour, top bolt release which I prefer in a Savage. The barrels generally are quite good, sub 3/4 MOA with a good hand loads. The Acu Trigger (Varmint with adjusted down to 1.5 .bs) is a really nice trigger, almost as good as a Jewel. You can get a Boyds stock latter, unde $150 for the standard, I like the lightweight thumbhole best so far. My brother has an At One stock I will shoot eventually. They are laminated so its not going to move around at all, they look good with quite a color and finish choice. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

April 29, 2018, 08:05 PM	#16
thickstrings Member Join Date: July 28, 2006 Posts: 57	Im surprised no one has mentioned http://northlandshooterssupply.com/ They sell screw on barrels for Savage and Remington...Do it yourself... Critereon barrels in the 300.00$ range. Most calibers...Highly recommended! Real easy on a Savage. The 6.5 Creed will shoot. Try a Bell and Carlson .... aluminum bedded and Stiff ... not a flexy fore end like the Sav. __________________ In times of universal deceit, those who speak the truth are revolutionaries.

April 30, 2018, 09:56 AM	#17
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	Yep, I should have said NSS, instead of Shilen Distributor. Very nice to work with. Good tool set for the Savage barrel tools. They also sell Criterion and those are rated right up with Shilen from those I have discussion with that owned both. If you put a larger barrel on, you likely will have to relieve the channel to keep it free floating. Stick with the operations that do the whole job (barrel and the pre fit work) (the mentioned ones). I have seen Criterion jump into discussions and almost demand a barrel back if its not shooting. They are serious. I think Shilen responds directly as well. I am not impressed with XCR, My bench mark is Shilen and how easily it cleans and shoots. By far away the easiest to clean. To me that means they put effort into lapping and that reflects on its the better consistent shooter. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

April 30, 2018, 10:36 AM	#18
cptmclark Senior Member Join Date: November 22, 2004 Location: Indiana Posts: 432	I actually used NSS for the tools and a replacement barrel nut, the bbl came from Shilin. Best accuracy with the 358 Hoosier was 1.1" with a 180 Barnes bullet. Heavier bullets not so good. I hope I installed the bbl right. Now i've put the original unshot 22-250 barrel back on (the Hoosier isn't needed any more) and shot it one time. About 25 rounds doing a break in routine. Shot two five shot groups at the end, and both were 1.0" at 100 yds. How to reduce these groups is what I'm hoping to learn about. I want to get into one of the 6.5s and have a 0.5" shooter, but don't know if anyone guarantees that accuracy?