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January 28, 2018, 02:08 AM | #26 | |
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The first two times I didn't take a backup, I needed a backup. 1. Scope lost zero. --Borrowed a rifle and made an amazing shot an hour later. 2. Scope failed. --Got the job done with the broken scope, but... Worst hunting experience of my life. 3. Trigger decided to stop functioning. --Grabbed the backup and filled both tags with ease. I always have a backup now, even if it's also an "alternate" -- like a Marlin 336 .30-30 with iron sights backing up and also offering an alternative to a scoped .270 Win. Sometimes, though... There are dozens of rifles in our hunting camps. In 2019, for example, my family has a special hunt planned in one of the wilderness areas in Idaho. Day one is lever-guns or single-shots only. (Special exception made for my father with his .450 Nitro double rifle, as he doesn't have a single-shot or lever-gun and doesn't want to buy or borrow one, but the double is close enough.) Day two is mil-surps only. (Sporters allowed without optics.) Day three is 'favorites'. (Your favorite legal hunting rifle. -- 90% will be scoped .270s or .30-06s.) From then on, it's whatever you feel like hauling up and down the mountain(s). So, at a minimum, each of us will bring two rifles. Those that will be loaning out mil-surps, single-shots, or lever-guns will have to bring those, as well. Most of us will also have backups. At last count, I have to plan on taking nine rifles, and one of my brothers will have to take at least six. Fifteen rifles (plus ammo!), between two people, plus what the other party members are bringing to fill the slots that they can. Plus... Most of us will have at least one rimfire rifle and at least one shotgun. It's going to be a bit ridiculous...
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January 28, 2018, 08:38 AM | #27 |
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Never carried two rifles in the woods. Sometimes i took both a muzzleloader and center fire rifle into my stand or blind. That was not practical and i quit.
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January 29, 2018, 12:50 PM | #28 | |
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January 29, 2018, 01:03 PM | #29 | |
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And while I get the point behind "It's not the rifle. It's the shooter," I think that's bit of an oversimplification. I am not an expert marksman, but I am a proficient shooter. I don't take dumb shots, and I hit where I aim a large majority of the time. That said, hitting where I aim is, at least in part, a product of the machinery. And a 30-30 is not the right rifle, for a 400 yd shot. Conversely, while a 7mm-08 will kill really nice and dead at 20 yds or a 500, it destroys more meat at 50 yds than a 30-30 does. Hence the original question. I can shoot the shoulder to knock them down right there and absorb a lot of bullet energy. But the shoulders make dang good jerky, and if I'm honest, I'm a jerky fiend! So... I prefer behind the shoulder into the boiler room without one massive exit wound or 7 small ones.
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Matthew "All men are ignorant. The topics of our ignorance may vary, but the nature of the world is that no man may know everything." ~ R Jordan |
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January 29, 2018, 01:05 PM | #30 | |
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Matthew "All men are ignorant. The topics of our ignorance may vary, but the nature of the world is that no man may know everything." ~ R Jordan |
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January 29, 2018, 02:43 PM | #31 |
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I can't imagine having more than one rifle in the field or blind. Just be sure you have a rifle that will kill deer out to 400 yards, but try to keep shots inside of that, due to trajectory drop-off and poor hits. I've used a .270 Win for about 20 years and an '06 before that.
Use a 3-9X scope and zero it to not be above or below the kill zone between the muzzle and 350 yards. At longer distances, you might want to shoot for the shoulder instead of lung-heart, so you don't have to trail it far. Set it at 6x to handle moving deer, but still be able to shoot accurately beyond 300 yds. (I use and recommend Leupold VX2 40mm). Consider using Winchester's new Deer Season XP ammo, since it seems to be the near-perfect ammo for deer, according to recent magazine articles and accuracy testing in my .270 Win. (It seems like a good step-up and I may use it instead of my whiz-bang handloads.) Seems like you have a great stand. Hope you can just relax and enjoy hunting. It's not brain surgery, (unless you try for head shots). |
January 29, 2018, 04:40 PM | #32 |
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Tallest, I've had great success on hogs using Sierra GK's in .260. Unfortunately, they have been largely unobtainable in recent years so my supply is almost gone. I haven't checked in the last few months to see how available they are now.
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January 30, 2018, 08:19 AM | #33 | |
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January 30, 2018, 09:33 AM | #34 |
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I'm with the guys that say to plan for the long range shot, and if you want to shoot a deer closer, just do it. Use a bonded bullet that won't explode on impact, and you're good to go.
If it were me (and I wish it was!) I'd bring the 7mm08 loaded with Accubonds. They'll open well and stay together (not explode or shrapnel) over a wide range of velocities. Also, consider using a heavier bullet that leaves the barrel a bit slower. It will give excellent long range performance, and also not be quite so hot for the short range shots. Or just bring two guns, we won't judge.
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January 30, 2018, 11:46 PM | #35 |
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Tried it a couple of times.
I've squirrel hunted with a 410 pump and a 22 semiauto in tow. 410 for tree shots in a direction where I don't want the bullet to travel far and 22 for shots on the ground.
Now I have a Savage 42 with a 410 lower under a 22 mag upper. Great squirrel gun. Life is good. Prof Young |
January 31, 2018, 11:43 AM | #36 |
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There have been times I carried two muzzle loaders up in the stand, since I had multiple tags & wanted a quick second shot.
In your case, it sounds like the stand is large enough that you'd have to switch positions to get a shot out of either side. So you could just leave one gun at each window and pick up the appropriate one as you switch back and forth, if that's what you wanna do. I tend to agree with the others that any gun that will kill a deer at 400 yards should do the same at 50, and choosing the proper bullet and/or shot placement should take care of excessive meat damage. But in the end, don't let anyone tell you how to enjoy your hunt. If it makes you happy to keep a dozen guns at hand, then do so. |
January 31, 2018, 12:45 PM | #37 |
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I have never taken 2 rifles to a blind.
I don't get this "2 rifle thing"!? Our hunting lease has a rule: If a yot or hog shows up the hunt is over; we are asked to shoot the yot/hog. Doesn't matter to me what rifle I have - I shoot the yot or hog. If I'm deer hunting - rabbits and grouse get a pass. If I'm hunting rabbits/grouse - the deer get a pass. Yots and hogs get NO pass regardless of the rifle I have on hand.
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January 31, 2018, 01:00 PM | #38 | ||
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All that aside... I appreciate everyone's feedback. Still not sure what next season will look like, but I have some good content to consider. Thank you all!
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January 31, 2018, 01:01 PM | #39 |
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Not familiar with how the action works but the idea of a barrel swap on a T/C seems a lightweight option if it's easy and quiet to swap them. Maybe have the close in barrel attached with the long range barrel off to the side where time and noise may not be quite the issue.
I've been intending on buying a few barrels for my Lyman muzzleloader to do just this. A handy carbine for patched ball, a shorty .54 cal for thick stuff or tracking a wounded hog, a .45 or .50 with either peep sights or a Malcolm style scope for fields, and a barrel reamed to 28 ga. However I need a punch and mallet to pull and seat a barrel. I could do it quiet enough as it doesn't too much effort. Or maybe you should practice shooting with a pistol, especially something like a T/C Contender as it can be chambered in something good out to 100 yds and scoped if you wish. |
January 31, 2018, 10:18 PM | #40 |
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My 7-08 also loves 120 grain Barnes TSX bullets. I guaranty you are not going to drive them fast enough to blow up. Shoot them behind the shoulders and lungs go "poof". An improperly handled .30-30 will damage more meat than a properly handled 7-08. If you can hit one with a .30 30 you can most certainly place the bullet precisely with a scoped 08. However there is certainly nothing wrong with packing 2 or 3 rifles to the stand if that is what you want to do.
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March 2, 2018, 06:57 AM | #41 |
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Illegal here. And a .30-30 will kill fine at 400 yards.
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March 2, 2018, 07:39 AM | #42 |
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Does anyone hunt with dual long guns?
And a 4 oz. ball peen hammer will drive a 16P framing nail. Doesn’t make it the right tool. Most 30-30 rounds have dropped 42”+ at 400 yds, and that’s more holdover than I’d like. Much more importantly, 200 yds is the just about the max for reliable bullet expansion. After that, your velocity is diminishing too fast. At 400 yds you’re likely sub-1200fps. That’s just not the right way to do it... for me at least Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
March 2, 2018, 07:41 AM | #43 |
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Plus the fact that getting "minute of deer" accuracy at 400 yds is EXTREMELY rare in a lever-action rifle.
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March 2, 2018, 10:10 AM | #44 |
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I know someone who carries a crossbow and a rifle when hunting. He figures shots with a rifle in one particular direction are not safe due to the angle of terrain and proximity of neighbors. Its the closest thing I have heard that makes "sense" to me. Touting a rifle and a crossbow out to the blind seems like a pretty big commitment to me.
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March 2, 2018, 04:55 PM | #45 |
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In one of Dixie Gun Work's earlier Blackpowder Annuals there is a very interesting article titled "Backup Guns of the Buffalo Hunters", and it examines the gear and weapons carried by commercial hide-hunters of the middle and late 19th century on the Great Plains. The article states that some novice hunters would hit the field carrying only their massive "Buffalo Sharps" or Remington Rolling Blocks and literally trust their lives on just that one gun. And many of them lost their lives when bands of Comanches and Kiowa, enraged at the destruction of their chief meat animal would attack the hunters. The Sharps and Remmies were absolutely awesome guns and they fired a massive, hard-hitting round. But they only fired one round at a time and when you are only with a few others facing off against a band of 50-100 warriors with lances and repeaters, you are pretty much broiled alive.
According to that same article, by the late 1870s, it is not uncommon for a commercial hunter to carry a Sharps or Rolling Block as his main gun, but also a Model 1873 Winchester or Spencer has a backup. The leverguns were not just for defense against possible Indian raids. They were also for harvesting jackrabbits and other small game for the ranch wagon. You don't shoot a jack with a .45-70 and expect to see a lot of edible meat left afterward. |
March 2, 2018, 07:03 PM | #46 |
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I have had similar situations and have never even considered a 2nd gun. I carried what I felt like hunting with that day and if something came up out of range I let it walk and didn't worry about it.
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March 3, 2018, 07:48 AM | #47 |
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I have only had one freezer filler gun for deer/elk/antelope over the last 40 years here in Colorado. Most kills were quick & close in heavy timber with a few long distance kills on the open plains. It was also my go to coyote getter on the farm/ranch. My trusty 308 has never let me down.
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March 3, 2018, 08:58 AM | #48 |
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Oh ya: "Beware the man who only has one gun. He probably knows how to use it!" lol
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March 29, 2018, 07:16 AM | #49 |
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I once hunted with a .22-250 and got several deer with it, but one day, was walking through the woods and saw a doe coming, so got behind a hardwood tree and waited until it was about 50 yards away and broadside. I noticed it was limping on one front leg, so didn't want to spoil a lot of meat and decided to shoot it in the head.
Well, I fired 5 times at the head, but as it limped, the head bobbed up and down, so I never hit it. Had to reload and shoot it through the lungs. What a frustrating experience!!! |
March 29, 2018, 11:52 AM | #50 |
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I always have a backup rifle along but it stays in the Bronco unless I need it. Hunt elk now with my 30-06 and 6.5x55 along as back-up. wanting to do deer with my 308 and cast bullet's, back-up is the same 6.5x55. East of the cascade's for deer my 25-06 get's the call but same 6.5x55 back-up. Ya know I could just use that 6.5x55 for every where! Love that rifle and cartridge!
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