Just subscribed. Some thoughts

Balog · May 27, 2006, 04:10 PM

Well, after much dithering and procrastinating I finally subscribed to SWAT a few days ago. I've loved the magazine since it covered the Beslan massacre, but it took Jeff Randall to motivate me to sign up. Between his insightful article on the border and the love he showed to the .22rf, I was sold. Thanks for your dedication to customer service and more signal, less noise. I may be low speed and high drag but you still offer much I can use.

There are two areas I'd love to see your unique no BS treatment of; body armor and NOD's. Both are huge investments (especially on an E-3's salary); both are areas where hard facts are scarce and difficult to obtain; and both are confusing to the average fellow who isn't in the industry. I'd love to see both an overview of the current state of the industry, as well as reviews of specific products and producers. Any chance we'll be seeing this type of article in the near future?

Denny Hansen · June 2, 2006, 12:22 PM

Balog,
Thanks for the kind words. We do our best. We’ll see what we can do about your suggestion, but please keep the following in mind:

Body armor articles are tougher than most. While we could say, “It was comfortable or very uncomfortable” we think our readers would see that as more of a puff piece—and it probably would be. We could not, in good faith, shoot at a single vest and make a “report.” An analogy would be to fire a single round over a chronograph and then report that “X” manufacturers “defense load” produces “Y” velocity.

For a good report, we would need at least three vest/plate samples from several manufacturers to shoot. Testing would have to be performed in a manner that is scientifically reproducible, and would have to gather a significant amount data to arrive at any conclusions that are relevant in the real world.

Finally, an author is not going to purchase a vest for several hundred dollars to destroy when his check for the article will not begin to cover the purchase price. And few companies would be willing to donate vests for such a test.

Denny

Balog · June 2, 2006, 07:09 PM

Denny: thanks for the response. I certainly understand the difficulties involved in armor testing; it may be another "gun safe" kind of subject. Perhaps an overview of the NIJ testing protocol and some links to resources would be a good compromise between an in-depth look and a total absence of comment on the subject?

Denny Hansen · June 3, 2006, 01:56 PM

See what we can do. Thanks for the input.

Denny

Harley Quinn · June 16, 2006, 09:27 AM

I am going to send a few to a friend he is interested in the mag. I am sending him the one on the Border intrusion and the minutemen. He is in AZ and they are being over run.
I read where they are now building fence's in some areas.

Back in the 70's we were testing the stuff (vests) that was availiable at that time. Had some 22 long rifle's full autos. HMMM, not good for the wearer. Must be why the Gov't. likes he 223

22-250 was hell on um even out well past rural type of fighting. 223 was brutal. Street distance and shotgun.

I am glad they have gone to the 223 for police work. LEO's now have a better chance when it comes to that kind of firefight. I am sending my friend the mag that had the article in it about the lever action 30-30s as a police weapon. Worked for Wyatt Earp.

HQ

May 27, 2006, 04:10 PM	#1
Balog Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2004 Posts: 259	Just subscribed. Some thoughts Well, after much dithering and procrastinating I finally subscribed to SWAT a few days ago. I've loved the magazine since it covered the Beslan massacre, but it took Jeff Randall to motivate me to sign up. Between his insightful article on the border and the love he showed to the .22rf, I was sold. Thanks for your dedication to customer service and more signal, less noise. I may be low speed and high drag but you still offer much I can use. There are two areas I'd love to see your unique no BS treatment of; body armor and NOD's. Both are huge investments (especially on an E-3's salary); both are areas where hard facts are scarce and difficult to obtain; and both are confusing to the average fellow who isn't in the industry. I'd love to see both an overview of the current state of the industry, as well as reviews of specific products and producers. Any chance we'll be seeing this type of article in the near future?

June 2, 2006, 12:22 PM	#2
Denny Hansen Staff Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2001 Location: Prescott Valley, AZ Posts: 2,422	Balog, Thanks for the kind words. We do our best. We’ll see what we can do about your suggestion, but please keep the following in mind: Body armor articles are tougher than most. While we could say, “It was comfortable or very uncomfortable” we think our readers would see that as more of a puff piece—and it probably would be. We could not, in good faith, shoot at a single vest and make a “report.” An analogy would be to fire a single round over a chronograph and then report that “X” manufacturers “defense load” produces “Y” velocity. For a good report, we would need at least three vest/plate samples from several manufacturers to shoot. Testing would have to be performed in a manner that is scientifically reproducible, and would have to gather a significant amount data to arrive at any conclusions that are relevant in the real world. Finally, an author is not going to purchase a vest for several hundred dollars to destroy when his check for the article will not begin to cover the purchase price. And few companies would be willing to donate vests for such a test. Denny __________________ S.W.A.T. Magazine Weapons, Training and Tactics for the Real World Join us at TFL or at AR15.com or on Facebook

June 3, 2006, 01:56 PM	#4
Denny Hansen Staff Emeritus Join Date: June 29, 2001 Location: Prescott Valley, AZ Posts: 2,422	See what we can do. Thanks for the input. Denny __________________ S.W.A.T. Magazine Weapons, Training and Tactics for the Real World Join us at TFL or at AR15.com or on Facebook

June 16, 2006, 09:27 AM	#5
Harley Quinn Junior member Join Date: August 30, 2005 Location: State of KALI Posts: 1,531	Got my July issue yesterday. I am going to send a few to a friend he is interested in the mag. I am sending him the one on the Border intrusion and the minutemen. He is in AZ and they are being over run. I read where they are now building fence's in some areas. Back in the 70's we were testing the stuff (vests) that was availiable at that time. Had some 22 long rifle's full autos. HMMM, not good for the wearer. Must be why the Gov't. likes he 223 22-250 was hell on um even out well past rural type of fighting. 223 was brutal. Street distance and shotgun. I am glad they have gone to the 223 for police work. LEO's now have a better chance when it comes to that kind of firefight. I am sending my friend the mag that had the article in it about the lever action 30-30s as a police weapon. Worked for Wyatt Earp. HQ

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June 2, 2006, 07:09 PM	#3
Balog Senior Member Join Date: May 19, 2004 Posts: 259	Denny: thanks for the response. I certainly understand the difficulties involved in armor testing; it may be another "gun safe" kind of subject. Perhaps an overview of the NIJ testing protocol and some links to resources would be a good compromise between an in-depth look and a total absence of comment on the subject?