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Old April 21, 2019, 09:06 PM   #26
rcollier
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Thanks for all the great advice.
Looking hard at the S.A. 1911 models
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Old April 21, 2019, 09:30 PM   #27
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All my 1911s are Colt Series 70s except one that I inherited from a cousin and it is a WWII Remington Rand/Ithaca.

I bought my 1st one in 1976 and it is still my primary shooter. I used to carry it, but I switched in 2004 to a lighter carry gun.

All of them are well made, never had any problems with them, and they are all accurate.

I shoot mostly 200 gr cast SWC nowadays, with some 230 gr cast once in a while. Seating depth can be finicky with the Colts, and I am sure with other brands as well, but once you get it right, it is some sweet shooting.
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Old April 21, 2019, 10:23 PM   #28
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I'd recommend Ruger for either the full 5" SR1911, or the 4-1/4" CMD. The two that I own, are in every way, comparable to my Colts, (several with gunsmith fitted and tuned Wilson bbl's and bushings) and cost 2/3's of the price.

Out of the box, both of mine had triggers that broke at 4-5 lbs. with little creep and improved over time. Each has all the features I thought necessary for a combat oriented, carry .45 except tritium sights. With SS construction, excellent hi-visibility Novak type 3-dot sights (wish they were tritium however), a beveled mag well, checkered back strap, humped grip safety, match grade bbl., & good sized (read not over-sized) controls, they have all the tweaks I want and none of the arm chair commando BS.

Aside from a few of my over-length reloads with LSWC's, both guns have been virtually 100% reliable for ~4500 rounds now. Lastly, you've got Ruger's excellent customer service dept. if a problem arises.

YMMv but they're first rate in my opinion. Rod
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Old April 22, 2019, 02:09 PM   #29
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IMHO, if I couldn’t afford a DW Pointman (PM) 9, which would be a top choice, I’d opt for a Colt Competition 9mm 1911. I have direct experience with a friend’s Colt Comp 9mm and this is a really nice setup. Based on having shot this one during several range sessions, this one should work for its intended purpose.

My own STI Trojan 9mm 1911 is out of production, can’t replace it, and I’ll never part with it.
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Old April 22, 2019, 02:11 PM   #30
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Colt if you want the real 1911.

Any of all the rest if you want a reasonable facsimile or "just as good as only cheaper" imitations.
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Old April 22, 2019, 02:49 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Jack Ryan View Post
Colt if you want the real 1911.



Any of all the rest if you want a reasonable facsimile or "just as good as only cheaper" imitations.
While I haven't reached the "if it ain't a Colt, it's just a copy" stage, I do agree with the idea of getting a Colt Competition Model in 9mm. It'll be right around $900 but should run without any fuss.

My one caveat would be you might want to swap the dual-recoil spring assembly for a standard single-spring and guide plug. The dual assembly is offering oversprung and overkill for a 9mm, especially with a heavy 1911 slide and barrel.

For the record, I own 2 Colt Competitions, one in .38 Super and one in .45 ACP, and both are great pistols.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
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Old April 23, 2019, 01:44 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by P-990:
My one caveat would be you might want to swap the dual-recoil spring assembly for a standard single-spring and guide plug. The dual assembly is offering oversprung and overkill for a 9mm, especially with a heavy 1911 slide and barrel.
Agree 100% that the DRSA in the Colt Comp 9mm 1911 is “possibly” over-sprung for a lot of lighter charge & weight 9mm loads, which many 9mm 1911 guns might not handle very well anyway.

I highly recommend the Wilson Combat (14lb.) Flat Wire Recoil Spring with the full-length 1/4” guiderod & plug. This is what I have in my STI Trojan 9mm 1911, so I can confirm this setup works.
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Old April 23, 2019, 10:07 PM   #33
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In that price range, I would buy a Kimber. They are, in my opinion, one of the best values available.
The Colts and SA pistols I've owned in the past don't perform as well as the Kimbers I own and from my past experience with Colt repair service, I would never own another Colt.
I've owned a number of Kimbers over the years and each one has been a superb shooter, 100% reliable and trouble free.
I don't care for the full length guide rods or nylon mainspring housings they use on some models but those issues are easily fixed.
I was pleased to see my new 9MM stainless target come in with the old short GI type guide rod and stainless mainspring housing. It has proved to be one of my most accurate 9MM pistols and 100% reliable.
Some guys don't like Kimbers but I don't understand why. I've shot them alongside my Les Baer, Wilson Combat, Ed Brown and Dan Wesson 1911s and, in my experience, they compare very favorably for a lot less money.
I'm basing my opinion on actual use rather than something I read somewhere. I've been shooting 1911s for 48 yr and have owned a bunch of them during that time.
My two cents.
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Old April 24, 2019, 09:07 PM   #34
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I would recommend looking at Springfield Armory. I carry a Range Officer Compact 45 on a daily basis, and my shooting buddy bought the 9mm version after shooting my gun. You can choose a 4" compact or a full size Range Officer which both offer 9mms. I favor Springfield because of their excellent customer service, which in my opinion is the best in the business, and exceptional value for the quality. Good Luck with your decision, and let us know what you choose.
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Old April 24, 2019, 11:40 PM   #35
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For cheapest that has a decent reputation for reliable- and great reputation for customer service- Rock Island stands out: as has been mentioned.

I have 3 of them currently- 2 in .45 and 1 in .38Super. They make a 1911 in 9mm I believe, or, you can buy the .38 Super and swap out a 9mm barrel with it.


In my RIA 1911's, I am a bit of a trigger snob, and have sent one or two back [after the 500 round break in] when I noticed something a bit 'off'.

They fixed it, and I had the head gunsmith at that time [Arnel- he does GOOD work, at reasonable prices] slick up the action a bit.

I am VERY happy with them.


Once I was at the range and did my 'normal' range routine. This involved 50 rounds slow-fired, 2 handed standing at 7 yards. I achieved the standard I set for myself- all of them in a space of about 3"x4" oblong.

This isn't anything special- but enough to make me confident of hitting center mass- not side of the mass.

When I pulled the target in, a couple guys to my left [shooting 1911s] asked what brand 1911 I was using. I told them, and they said I should do a commercial for RIA. I didn't comment about shooter skill- but let them think it was the gun, as it is ok skill, but not really exceptional. that would be 50 rounds into a 2" x 3" oblong for me.


Their groups were more like 10" x 16" on the target- and they were using a Colt 1911 Gold Cup and a Kimber [Trophy I think? I remember thinking it was about a $1300 gun around 2013, whatever it was]. I remember them commenting they could have bought 2 or 3 of my RIA 1911s for the price of their pistols, and my groups were 'SOOO' much better.

Again- probably not the gun's fault.

The moral: more expensive won't create a good shooter. And a RIA that you practice with will probably make you happy.


NOW, Star Model B was brought up. The B has a swinging link, and the B Super has a barrel lug more like a BHP or something. They are very 1911-esque.

Their triggers can be made to work very well, like a 1911. However, some differences:
1- almost NO access to spare parts or aftermarket parts. If your extractor doesn't work, you can spend $150 to have a couple made for you [or around $100 for one], but the gun only costs around $300.
2- magazines may be spotty in use.
3- some barrels don't like anything other than steel shells.
4- no grip safety.
5- thumb safety blocks hammer from pivoting- unlike 1911 which blocks sear from pivoting, and allowing hammer to drop.
6- sights are 1911 GI sights- no better.

They ARE fun, but I wouldn't recommend one to someone who really wants a 1911 in 9mm. I'd say just get a RIA and ammo.
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Old April 25, 2019, 06:51 AM   #36
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We have a Springfield 1911 in 9mm along with 2 in 45 and Dan Wesson 1911 in 45. Got the 9mm used for about $500 and it is a keeper. We also had 2 Colt 1911s, not in 9mm, that were sent down the road as they were mediocre at best. If you want a 9mm 1911 the Springfield is a good choice and worth a look. Good luck with whatever you decide.
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Old April 25, 2019, 11:26 AM   #37
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The Colt is the real one, others are copies. some of the copies are better than the Colt. The Dan Wesson are real nice guns but they are pricier than the plain Colt or SA. The Ruger or Kimber after the Colt or SA. The Colt and SA are the bet you're gonna get for under 1000.00.
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Old April 26, 2019, 08:18 AM   #38
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+1 for the Rock Island. I had one, let a friend talk me out of it and have regretted it ever since.
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Old April 26, 2019, 08:38 AM   #39
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I could not be happier with my Ruger 1911 Target 9mm! At under $800, you get a pistol made in the USA with a 4.25 trigger and bull barrel. The SS Target has a fully adjustable rear sight. At 42oz, it is a soft shooter and makes a great range pistol! Mine has not had a single malfunction! I did add a fiber optic front sight on mine. Good luck!
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Old April 26, 2019, 03:38 PM   #40
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For entry level I don't think you can beat the Ruger 1911s. Very nice made in America pistols in 9mm and .45ACP in Commander and full sizes.
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Old April 27, 2019, 10:23 AM   #41
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Entry Level 1911 in 9mm

I will suggest the Colt Competition 9mm in Blue, like the one I bought last month for $775 off of Gunbroker, new in the box. I have other Colts, an Ed Brown 1911, and a Jim Clark, Jr. Caspian Hardball 1911, all in .45ACP. The Competition is the cheapest 1911 that I own, but it has many positives that you cannot get in that price range. The sights are extremely visible and adjustable, the beavertail is well-done and is a good, positive safety, and the dual recoil springs function perfectly, especially handy with the NATO ammo that I shoot, which is +P rated and snappy in recoil. The stock gun is accurate enough to do anything at IDPA, and it has been 100% reliable through its initial 2,000 rounds of hardball, hollow-point and truncated cone bullet styles. It carries well in a Milt Sparks Summer Special IWB holster. If you do not reload, the ammo is much cheaper than .45ACP. It works well with the Wilson 10-round magazine.
I bought it just to see if Colt had upped their game from the 1980 quality issues, and have been pleasantly surprised. For $775, the Competition is a steal.
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Old April 27, 2019, 03:59 PM   #42
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Hi rcollier,

I'm 100% sure that 1911-A1 recommendations will be all over the spectrum. Most will be based upon brand loyalty. There's nothing wrong with brand loyalty.

Many years ago, I bought guns w/o research or insufficient research. More often than not, I went with recommendations from shooters whom I had assumed knew their gun knowledge. I learned the expensive way that there had to be a better way. Not all guns are of equal quality. We'll get what we pay for especially applies to guns, yet we can overpay for lesser quality. Brand name no longer implies excellent quality.

The US Military and Western law enforcement can be good indicators of handgun quality. However, you have to keep in mind that an agency-issued handgun might not be the handgun preferred by its cops. For instance, I've read that the FBI has adopted the 9MM as its issued cartridge and Glock as its issued handgun. That does not mean that cops who are in harm's way will carry Glocks chambered for 9MM. My guess is most will stay with their Glock 22's or their Springfield Armory Professional .45 ACP. Law enforcement agencies almost universally issue one excellent quality handgun chambered for a specific cartridge. However, they'll allow their cops who are in harm's way to carry other handguns and cartridges from agencies' approved lists.

Springfield Armory is the oldest manufacturer of military arms in the USA. It was commissioned by President George Washington. SA has almost silently evolved as the preeminent 1911-A1 handgun maker in the world. You could spend thousands more for a tricked out esoteric brand 1911-A1, but I can almost guarantee you it will not be of better quality than a Springfield Armory TRP that'll run you about $1500. If you want the best of the best, go with a Springfield Armory Professional Model. The Pro is a 100% hand made, custom created handgun that was designed to be used by professionals and is used by military and law enforcement professionals. The Professional Model will set you back about $3500. That's a lotta $$$. You will not be able to buy any 1911-A1 at any price that's superior to the Professional Model.

I used to own 2 Colt 1911's & an S&W 1911. The S&W was far more reliable than my Colts. I had just turned 21 when I bought my Colt Government Model Series 70 1911-A1 .45 ACP. I proudly showed it to my dad. My dad was an accomplished machinist. He knew metal. He created precision aircraft parts to tolerances of thousandths of an inch. He examined my brand new Colt Series 70 and politely told me it was very poorly manufactured. It was reasonably reliable with 230 grain FMJ ammo. It wasn't reliable with any other ammo. Later I learned that the Series 70 Government Model was the entry level gun made by Colt and purchased by hand gunners who invested a lot of $$$ to get them to work. The SA TRP is 100% reliable right out of the box with any ammo you feed it. It requires nothing to make it 100% reliable with any ammo. It's been referred to as the best value 1911-A1 on the market. And all SA 1911-A1's are made in the USA.

I own 4 Springfield Armory 1911-A1's. (I've included one that isn't a true 1911-A1 but close enough for government work.) I own no other 1911-A1 brands. Believe me, I've researched the heck outta 1911-A1 brands. Most 1911-A1 brands are excellent. You'll have to decide what's right for you.

Keep in mind that spending a fortune on a 1911-A1 does not guarantee quality.
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Old April 27, 2019, 04:11 PM   #43
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This is my opinion and only my opinion: an authentic 1911-A1 is chambered for only the .45 ACP. Keep in mind that I'm blued steel and wood old school.

An excellent 1911-A1 article that's worth your while:

https://www.thearmorylife.com/1911-a...rican-classic/
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Old April 27, 2019, 06:51 PM   #44
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What is an "authentic 1911-A1? I'm not aware of any manufacturer who ever sold a firearm with that designation. What about a WW1 M1911? It doesn't have any "A1" to its name -- is it not authentic?

And, if you want to be a purist, if the only "authentic" full-size 1911 is in .45 ACP, then the only "authentic" Commander 1911 would have to be in 9mm Luger.
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Old April 28, 2019, 02:39 AM   #45
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+1 for Ruger 9mm 1911 offerings for an awesome entry level priced 1911.
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Old April 28, 2019, 07:44 AM   #46
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What about Auto Ordnance? A few mentioned RIA and I've heard they are good but AOs are US made and probably in the same price range.
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Old April 28, 2019, 08:34 AM   #47
SATRP
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Aguila,

Firing spring block is not authentic.

The original 1911 adopted by the US Army was 1911. It's designation was changed t 1911-A1 after WWI due to modifications of the original design.

Vickers Guide of the 1911 has excellent historical info: https://www.vickersguide.com/1911
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Old April 28, 2019, 09:01 AM   #48
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SATRP, I think your post number 42 has a few errors in it.

For example - A TRP is certainly not what a purist would call a 1911 A1
Springfield Armory Inc, is not The Springfield Armory.

Also, I am certain that Aguila Blanca knows what a 1911 and a 1911 A1 are.

There are several great 1911s in 9mm- Colt, Springfield Armory Inc, Ruger all make nice ones that can be considered ' entry level '
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Old April 28, 2019, 09:07 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SATRP
Aguila,

Firing spring block is not authentic.

The original 1911 adopted by the US Army was 1911. It's designation was changed t 1911-A1 after WWI due to modifications of the original design.

Vickers Guide of the 1911 has excellent historical info: https://www.vickersguide.com/1911
I'm pretty sure Aguila knows this history. And he was merely saying the only true M1911A1s are in .45 ACP, and were built under contract for the U.S. Government, not built and sold for commercial, civilian sales. Those guns would have been Colt Government Models, in the various configurations.

And yes, I know Springfield Armory likes to stamp their pistols with 1911-A1. I was looking at a Springfield FBI model in a local gunshop just yesterday even. Doesn't change the fact that they aren't technically "true" M1911A1s.

As for the proper caliber of a 1911, Colt introduced the Super .38 Automatic before 1930, and the ammunition makers upgraded the ammo to ".38 Super" in the early 1930s. So it's easy to argue that the .38 Super is a classic cartridge for the Government Model, as much as the .45 ACP. And the Colt Commander was the first U.S.-manufactured pistol in 9mm Luger, beating the S&W Model 39 to the commercial market by just a little bit.

Looking at John M Browning's development of the automatic pistol, it's easy to see the .45 ACP cartridge for the M1911 / Government Model came about due to the insistence of the U.S. Army Board of Ordnance, not because that's where the development of the automatic pistol was going on its own.
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Old April 28, 2019, 09:56 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by rodfac View Post
I'd recommend Ruger for either the full 5" SR1911, or the 4-1/4" CMD.
I'd be inclined to second that recommendation. I've heard mostly good things about Ruger's SR1911's. Fondled a Commander in 9mm yesterday at an LGS. It felt pretty good. (I'm currently in the process of convincing myself I do not need it .)

I went with a Remington 1911 R1 Enhanced because I got a killer deal on it, but I'd have gone for the Ruger for the same kind of deal.

Re: The .45 ACP argument. I went with a Government (full-size) 1911 in .45 ACP because I wanted an "updated" 1911 as close to a classic 1911 as possible w/in my budget. Same reason I own a Ruger Blackhawk in .45 (long) Colt. Yeah, a Commander in 9mm would have been less expensive to shoot and a bit easier to carry, just as a Blackhawk in .357 Magnum would've made more sense for me. But...
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