Suppressor resale values years from now?

Rembrandt · May 8, 2016, 09:35 PM

Curious what suppressor resale values could be like down the road. Would they be like scopes and other accessories that neither add nor decline in value?....or would it be like full autos that become more valuable and collectible?

TMD · May 8, 2016, 09:51 PM

Can't speak for the future but in current times selling a suppressor privately is almost nill. Most people don't want to pay a stranger for something they can't take possession of immediately. Not to mention after the tax stamp comes back the transfer still has to be done on a 4473 so a FFL will still have to be involved somehow. Much easier to pay a few dollars more and buy through an authorized dealer.
Now in the future if suppressors are dropped form the NFA list that would be a different story.

Machineguntony · May 9, 2016, 01:17 AM

A good way to determine the value of a gun is to look at the averages on gunbroker.

The average value of a used silencer/suppressor? ZER0 (with some rare exceptions, such as a factory HK SD silencer)

There is only one listing on GB for a used silencer. It has zero bids.

Even for new silencers, there are zero bids. Look at this pic of the listed auctions for new silencers as of 5/9...

The reason for zero bids on new GB silencer auctions is the customary $50-$75 holding fee on top of the $200 tax stamp. The winning bidder must have the selling dealer ship the silencer to the winning bidders' holding dealer. This holding dealer will charge a holding fee. Holding dealers will customarily waive this holding fee for buyers who buy direct from the holding dealer.

That's right now. If not for 922(o), a used machine gun would also be worth a big fat zero.

But talk about the future prices for silencers, if ATF 29P becomes rule, then the oil can/solvent trap silencers might be worth more in the future (because of new marking rules, no one would be able to make a registered oil can silencer with the registered back end). That's just speculation, but if you can't make it anymore, people typically may want it at some point. I've spoken to some old time dealers who never foresaw the current prices of MGs ('M16 for $2500! What a rip off!', said one dealer in the late 80s).

Btw, I'm pretty sure that most scopes and most other accessories decline in value; they don't just float on par. There are exceptions of course, such as if you purchased a warehouse full of 22LR in the 90s and sat on it, a boatload of Colt snake guns in the 90s/2000s, or a ton of smokeless powder from the 90s. But I'm pretty sure any used Leupold is worth significantly less than the msrp.

Theohazard · May 9, 2016, 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rembrandt

or would it be like full autos that become more valuable and collectible?

Full autos increase in value because supply was cut off in 1986. The same isn't true for silencers.

Not only are new silencers readily available, but unlike normal firearms, silencer technology is improving significantly every few years. This means that the 7.62 SDN-6 I bought in 2012 is already obsolete. It's still a really good silencer, but there are newer models now with better features. If I wanted to sell my SDN-6 I'd have to sell it dirt cheap.

Add in the fact that buying a used silencer requires the same $200 transfer tax as buying a new silencer, and you'll quickly see that there's virtually no market for used silencers. Who wants to pay the $200 tax and wait several months for an old design when a new silencer gets you better performance?

Theohazard · May 9, 2016, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMD

Not to mention after the tax stamp comes back the transfer still has to be done on a 4473 so a FFL will still have to be involved somehow.

No, a dealer doesn't need to be involved with a private transfer of an NFA item as long as the transfer takes place within state lines between two residents of that state. So no 4473 would be needed in that case. You still have to do the Form 4 process with the ATF, but that's it; there's no dealer involved.

Obviously, state private transfer laws might change things, but I'm referring to federal law. For example, WA state private transfer laws would require a dealer to be involved in a transfer of any NFA item besides a silencer: State law doesn't define silencers as firearms, so a private transfer of a silencer wouldn't involve a dealer at all.

444 · May 9, 2016, 08:12 AM

I agree with everything posted but,.......

I don't really know anyone who has ever purchased a used suppressor, but I could see it happening as a local type transaction. But obviously, the price would have to be significantly lower than just buying a new one. And, as has been mentioned, if you are buying an NFA item from out of state, the wait times become ridiculous (I have done this more than once FWIW). To someone who has been through these wait times, the fact that the suppressor is local to you might provide an incentive to buy one used. In other words, if your buddy has a suppressor he wants to sell, and you want to buy it, then the length of time for you to take possession of it would be far less than if you ordered a new one from out of state.

As to the future, I have no idea.

Double Naught Spy · May 9, 2016, 08:20 AM

Personally, I think as a $ investment, suppressors are likely very bad. I think there is a very real possibility that in 10 or 20 years that they will be legal without the special paperwork and that the bottom will fall out of the price.

Buy them because you want to use them, not because you want to get money back for them in the future.

Skans · May 9, 2016, 04:53 PM

The problem with $0 value for used suppressors is this: what will eventually happen to all of these used suppressors? Selling a used machinegun is easy - price it right and you will have people willing to jump through all kinds of hoops, and give you a box of cherry bon-bons to boot to be the first in line!

GE-Minigun · May 12, 2016, 07:31 AM

Quote:

The reason for zero bids on new GB silencer auctions is the customary $50-$75 holding fee on top of the $200 tax stamp. The winning bidder must have the selling dealer ship the silencer to the winning bidders' holding dealer. This holding dealer will charge a holding fee. Holding dealers will customarily waive this holding fee for buyers who buy direct from the holding dealer.

You REALLY need to be finding another dealer if your getting charged for this...a holding fee...-CENSORED--CENSORED--CENSORED-!!!. I would never charge a "holding fee"...what an absolute crock of crap. I charge $50 for transfer and if you transferred/purchased through me often enough I normally waive that fee.

444 · May 12, 2016, 08:37 AM

This is again another reason to buy local. I am repeating myself here but buying NFA items from out of state makes this more complicated and it takes longer. In the NFA,world, suppressors are fairly inexpensive. Buying one used, from out of state for me would have to be very very cheap to make it worthwhile.

Sharkbite · May 12, 2016, 10:01 AM

I seriously hope Suppressors get removed from the NFA. I would HAPPILY see all of my cans resale value drop to ZERO if that happened.

A buddy of mine wanted to buy one of my 22lr cans. After i explained the process. He just bought a new one.

PawPaw · May 12, 2016, 10:51 AM

Two things about supressors have always struck me as odd.

1) They're NFA items. Which means paperwork and bureaucracy and an obscene tax scheme. Bizarre.

2) The prices that the manufacturers charge for them. I used to work around machine shops, and I can tell you that good machine work ain't cheap for a one-off project, but if I were in tbe business of making suppressors, I wouldn't do one-off work. I'd make 'em by the hundreds in lot batches, and I could probably get the per-unit cost down to below $20.00 and sell them for about $60 each.

Really, there's not much to a suppressor. Some tubing, some baffles and some thread work. They're fairly simple devices. Yeah, the baffles are interesting and some work better than others, but if a fellow came up with a good baffle scheme, it would be easy to reproduce.

Deja vu · May 12, 2016, 10:52 AM

only if they are banned will the price go up.

Generally speaking there price is $0 once you pay for them.

9x19 · May 12, 2016, 01:52 PM

The best thing that could happen, for all involved, is to drop them from NFA and impose a $100 excise tax at the manufacturer (much like is done with $20 tax on handguns for private citizen sales).

The increase in sales volume would cover the 50% reduction in taxes, not to mention the reduced work-load for the NFA examiners.

But, trying to remember the last time the FedGov did anything that was good for all is hard to do.

Skans · May 13, 2016, 08:27 AM

So, what happens to old suppressors that might still work, but are obsolete? Are people just cutting/destroying them? If you are 90 years old and have one of those old MAC suppressors which use wipes, do you just leave it to your kids to deal with?

johnwilliamson062 · May 16, 2016, 07:33 PM

Quote:

The increase in sales volume would cover the 50% reduction in taxes, not to mention the reduced work-load for the NFA examiners.

There is no need to replace the revenue. It isn't significant in ATFE budget and probably doesn't really cover the app process anymore. It is a penalty to limit citizens behavior, not to generate revenue.

sfwusc · May 16, 2016, 09:08 PM

Stupid question.

If you have a trust, then couldn't you just "sell" the trust to someone?

That would avoid all the paperwork right? The NFA item wouldn't have been transferred. It would still be owned by the trust.

TMD · May 16, 2016, 09:53 PM

Quote:

If you have a trust, then couldn't you just "sell" the trust to someone?

Nope, don't work that way

johnwilliamson062 · May 17, 2016, 08:22 PM

What about the high end suppressors? Do you think they hold their value better?

TMD · May 17, 2016, 08:33 PM

Don't matter if it's a $200 can or a $1200 one. Private sale market is still almost nill.

Machineguntony · May 17, 2016, 11:59 PM

If you think about it, silencers are total luxury items. It's $600-$1200 for a tube with metal partitions inside!

9x19 · May 18, 2016, 08:14 AM

I tease my buddy that it's just a "tube full of fancy washers".

Sharkbite · May 18, 2016, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Don't matter if it's a $200 can or a $1200 one. Private sale market is still almost nill.

I disagree there. If i wanted to sell my SDN-6 (for example), AND i was willing to sell it for $400...i bet i could find a buyer. $1200 for a new one or $400 for a used one is a steal.

The problem is when a new can (22lr) is so cheap. I couldn't reduce the price on my used one enough to make it worthwhile to buy it used

Just like all things PRICE/value makes or breaks the sale. Selling to an out of state person makes it a bigger deal.

May 8, 2016, 09:35 PM	#1
Rembrandt Senior Member Join Date: August 10, 2002 Posts: 2,108	Suppressor resale values years from now? Curious what suppressor resale values could be like down the road. Would they be like scopes and other accessories that neither add nor decline in value?....or would it be like full autos that become more valuable and collectible?

May 9, 2016, 01:17 AM	#3
Machineguntony Senior Member Join Date: June 22, 2013 Posts: 1,277	A good way to determine the value of a gun is to look at the averages on gunbroker. The average value of a used silencer/suppressor? ZER0 (with some rare exceptions, such as a factory HK SD silencer) There is only one listing on GB for a used silencer. It has zero bids. Even for new silencers, there are zero bids. Look at this pic of the listed auctions for new silencers as of 5/9... The reason for zero bids on new GB silencer auctions is the customary $50-$75 holding fee on top of the $200 tax stamp. The winning bidder must have the selling dealer ship the silencer to the winning bidders' holding dealer. This holding dealer will charge a holding fee. Holding dealers will customarily waive this holding fee for buyers who buy direct from the holding dealer. That's right now. If not for 922(o), a used machine gun would also be worth a big fat zero. But talk about the future prices for silencers, if ATF 29P becomes rule, then the oil can/solvent trap silencers might be worth more in the future (because of new marking rules, no one would be able to make a registered oil can silencer with the registered back end). That's just speculation, but if you can't make it anymore, people typically may want it at some point. I've spoken to some old time dealers who never foresaw the current prices of MGs ('M16 for $2500! What a rip off!', said one dealer in the late 80s). Btw, I'm pretty sure that most scopes and most other accessories decline in value; they don't just float on par. There are exceptions of course, such as if you purchased a warehouse full of 22LR in the 90s and sat on it, a boatload of Colt snake guns in the 90s/2000s, or a ton of smokeless powder from the 90s. But I'm pretty sure any used Leupold is worth significantly less than the msrp. __________________ Sent from Motorola DynaTac 8000x

May 9, 2016, 08:12 AM	#6
444 Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 3,968	I agree with everything posted but,....... I don't really know anyone who has ever purchased a used suppressor, but I could see it happening as a local type transaction. But obviously, the price would have to be significantly lower than just buying a new one. And, as has been mentioned, if you are buying an NFA item from out of state, the wait times become ridiculous (I have done this more than once FWIW). To someone who has been through these wait times, the fact that the suppressor is local to you might provide an incentive to buy one used. In other words, if your buddy has a suppressor he wants to sell, and you want to buy it, then the length of time for you to take possession of it would be far less than if you ordered a new one from out of state. As to the future, I have no idea. __________________ You know the rest. In the books you have read How the British Regulars fired and fled, How the farmers gave them ball for ball, From behind each fence and farmyard wall, Chasing the redcoats down the lane, Then crossing the fields to emerge again Under the trees at the turn of the road, And only pausing to fire and load. Last edited by 444; May 9, 2016 at 08:18 AM.

May 9, 2016, 08:20 AM	#7
Double Naught Spy Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2001 Location: Forestburg, Montague Cnty, TX Posts: 12,717	Personally, I think as a $ investment, suppressors are likely very bad. I think there is a very real possibility that in 10 or 20 years that they will be legal without the special paperwork and that the bottom will fall out of the price. Buy them because you want to use them, not because you want to get money back for them in the future. __________________ "If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher." -- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011 My Hunting Videos https://www.youtube.com/user/HornHillRange

May 12, 2016, 08:37 AM	#10
444 Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2000 Location: Ohio Posts: 3,968	This is again another reason to buy local. I am repeating myself here but buying NFA items from out of state makes this more complicated and it takes longer. In the NFA,world, suppressors are fairly inexpensive. Buying one used, from out of state for me would have to be very very cheap to make it worthwhile. __________________ You know the rest. In the books you have read How the British Regulars fired and fled, How the farmers gave them ball for ball, From behind each fence and farmyard wall, Chasing the redcoats down the lane, Then crossing the fields to emerge again Under the trees at the turn of the road, And only pausing to fire and load.

May 8, 2016, 09:51 PM	#2
TMD Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2011 Posts: 1,293	Can't speak for the future but in current times selling a suppressor privately is almost nill. Most people don't want to pay a stranger for something they can't take possession of immediately. Not to mention after the tax stamp comes back the transfer still has to be done on a 4473 so a FFL will still have to be involved somehow. Much easier to pay a few dollars more and buy through an authorized dealer. Now in the future if suppressors are dropped form the NFA list that would be a different story.

May 9, 2016, 04:53 PM	#8
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,132	The problem with $0 value for used suppressors is this: what will eventually happen to all of these used suppressors? Selling a used machinegun is easy - price it right and you will have people willing to jump through all kinds of hoops, and give you a box of cherry bon-bons to boot to be the first in line!

May 12, 2016, 10:01 AM	#11
Sharkbite Senior Member Join Date: November 4, 2013 Location: Western slope of Colorado Posts: 3,679	I seriously hope Suppressors get removed from the NFA. I would HAPPILY see all of my cans resale value drop to ZERO if that happened. A buddy of mine wanted to buy one of my 22lr cans. After i explained the process. He just bought a new one.

May 12, 2016, 10:51 AM	#12
PawPaw Senior Member Join Date: December 24, 2010 Location: Central Louisiana Posts: 3,137	Two things about supressors have always struck me as odd. 1) They're NFA items. Which means paperwork and bureaucracy and an obscene tax scheme. Bizarre. 2) The prices that the manufacturers charge for them. I used to work around machine shops, and I can tell you that good machine work ain't cheap for a one-off project, but if I were in tbe business of making suppressors, I wouldn't do one-off work. I'd make 'em by the hundreds in lot batches, and I could probably get the per-unit cost down to below $20.00 and sell them for about $60 each. Really, there's not much to a suppressor. Some tubing, some baffles and some thread work. They're fairly simple devices. Yeah, the baffles are interesting and some work better than others, but if a fellow came up with a good baffle scheme, it would be easy to reproduce. __________________ Dennis Dezendorf http://pawpawshouse.blogspot.com

May 12, 2016, 10:52 AM	#13
Deja vu Senior Member Join Date: March 14, 2010 Location: Border of Idaho & Montana Posts: 2,584	only if they are banned will the price go up. Generally speaking there price is $0 once you pay for them. __________________ Shot placement is everything! I would rather take a round of 50BMG to the foot than a 22short to the base of the skull. all 26 of my guns are 45/70 govt, 357 mag, 22 or 12 ga... I believe in keeping it simple. Wish my wife did as well...

May 12, 2016, 01:52 PM	#14
9x19 Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 1998 Location: Sherman, TX USA Posts: 3,750	The best thing that could happen, for all involved, is to drop them from NFA and impose a $100 excise tax at the manufacturer (much like is done with $20 tax on handguns for private citizen sales). The increase in sales volume would cover the 50% reduction in taxes, not to mention the reduced work-load for the NFA examiners. But, trying to remember the last time the FedGov did anything that was good for all is hard to do. __________________ Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!

May 13, 2016, 08:27 AM	#15
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 11,132	So, what happens to old suppressors that might still work, but are obsolete? Are people just cutting/destroying them? If you are 90 years old and have one of those old MAC suppressors which use wipes, do you just leave it to your kids to deal with?

May 16, 2016, 09:08 PM	#17
sfwusc Senior Member Join Date: July 14, 2013 Posts: 231	Stupid question. If you have a trust, then couldn't you just "sell" the trust to someone? That would avoid all the paperwork right? The NFA item wouldn't have been transferred. It would still be owned by the trust.

May 17, 2016, 08:22 PM	#19
johnwilliamson062 Junior member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 9,995	What about the high end suppressors? Do you think they hold their value better?

May 17, 2016, 08:33 PM	#20
TMD Senior Member Join Date: August 9, 2011 Posts: 1,293	Don't matter if it's a $200 can or a $1200 one. Private sale market is still almost nill.

May 17, 2016, 11:59 PM	#21
Machineguntony Senior Member Join Date: June 22, 2013 Posts: 1,277	If you think about it, silencers are total luxury items. It's $600-$1200 for a tube with metal partitions inside! __________________ Sent from Motorola DynaTac 8000x Last edited by Machineguntony; May 18, 2016 at 01:28 AM.

May 18, 2016, 08:14 AM	#22
9x19 Senior Member Join Date: October 15, 1998 Location: Sherman, TX USA Posts: 3,750	I tease my buddy that it's just a "tube full of fancy washers". __________________ Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!