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Old September 8, 2016, 12:16 AM   #1
Deepc
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FLORIDA CLASS D security licence ammo restrictions

The statute says that you can carry a .357 with. 38 sp ammo. Does this include + p rounds? What about critical defense rounds?
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Old September 8, 2016, 07:32 AM   #2
Tom Servo
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The licensing handbook is available here.

According to Section 493.6115(6),

Quote:
Firearms and Ammunition — Licensed agencies shall allow
licensed employees to use only standard (factory) ammunition
of a type and load which is appropriate for the location and duty
requirements of armed employees; however, use of the following
type ammunition is prohibited:
1. Glaser-type or any other pre-fragmented-type bullets
2. Exploding bullets
3. Full metal jacket (fmj)/full metal case (fmc) bullets
except in semiautomatic firearms
4. Teflon-coated (ktw-type) or any other type of armor
piercing bullets
5. Full wadcutter bullets (except on firing range)
6. Reloads (except on firing range)
There's no prohibition on +P ammunition, nor on a specific hollowpoint design, so long as it isn't "armor piercing" or "exploding."
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Old September 8, 2016, 09:36 AM   #3
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Raises a couple of questions. If you carry a revolver you can't use FMJ which means you are restricted to lead. Okay, that's fine but why no wadcutters? Are they more dangerous than a lead round nose or flat point? Other question is what is a .45 163 ACP pistol. What the heck is that?
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Old September 8, 2016, 09:57 AM   #4
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The wadcutter thing is probably because factory wadcutter ammo is usually powder puff target shooting type stuff. (Yes I know extremely deadly and I don't want a .177 pellet sent my way but it isn't generally suited to defense in factory loadings that I have experience with)
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Old September 8, 2016, 10:23 AM   #5
Deepc
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Thanks Tom Servo

Now I'm wondering why no fmj in a revolver. I own a. 357 revolver and a .380 auto. I thought I knew the obvious differences between the two, but must be missing something. Just can't figure what's bad with fmj in one,but not the other.
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Old September 8, 2016, 10:25 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jag2
If you carry a revolver you can't use FMJ which means you are restricted to lead.
FMJ generally refers to a bullet that is fully encased on the front and perimeter but with an exposed lead base, while FMC generally refers to a bullet that is fully encased on all sides.

In lieu of other documentation clarifying item #3, I presume that conventional JHP bullets with a copper-jacketed base and open tip are acceptable, as they are neither FMJ, FMC, "armor piercing" nor "exploding." (+1 Tom.) If the writers of the manual were savvy enough to use the terms FMJ and FMC, I would assume that they were also knowledgeable enough to more clearly and explicitly prohibit JHP bullets if that was their intent.

FWIW I suspect that the allowance for FMJ in semi-auto firearms is a holdover from the bad old days when many auto pistols would choke on anything other than FMJ hardball.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jag2
...why no wadcutters? Are they more dangerous than a lead round nose or flat point?
Likely another holdover due to a widespread old-school perception that wadcutters are only good for punching paper. FWIW early 1970s gel tests demonstrating that 148gr hollow-base wadcutters are MORE effective than the conventional and near-universal 158gr .38Spl LRN bullet were initially met with some head-shaking disbelief and incredulity, so this may reflect some ax-grinding by conservative writers decades ago.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jag2
...what is a .45 163 ACP pistol.
Most likely a typo. FWIW some older word processing software would write hidden formatting characters into the text, which may pop up as random numbers or nonsense characters if you open the file in newer software that's not fully backwards-compatible. Back when floppy disks held only 512K and hard drives were exotica that only university research labs had, word processors couldn't write lots of auxiliary formatting code into files or you might run out of disk space.
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Last edited by carguychris; September 8, 2016 at 04:45 PM. Reason: clarification, minor reword
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Old September 8, 2016, 10:29 AM   #7
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Quote:
Raises a couple of questions. If you carry a revolver you can't use FMJ which means you are restricted to lead. Okay, that's fine but why no wadcutters? Are they more dangerous than a lead round nose or flat point? Other question is what is a .45 163 ACP pistol. What the heck is that?
Wouldn't JHP and JSP bullets be OK in a revolver (or, for that matter, semi-auto) under these restrictions? (ETA: I see carguychris beat me to it on that)

I think the .45 163 ACP thing must refer to this ammo - admittedly a rather odd way to list it.
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Old September 8, 2016, 11:27 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jag2
Raises a couple of questions. If you carry a revolver you can't use FMJ which means you are restricted to lead.
Are you saying that this regulation classifies jacketed hollow points as "full metal jacket" or "full metal case"?
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Old September 8, 2016, 11:33 AM   #9
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Yours is not to question.
Are you actually trying to make sense of rules made by bureaucrats?
Most of whom don't know much of anything about what they make rules about.
Just read the manual and follow the rules there in.
Saves a lot of frustration.
If there's anything confusing there, don't bother asking anyone.
You will no doubt get different answers from everyone you ask.
Just use your own judgement.
The bureaucrats won't care, they're too busy writing more rules.
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Old September 8, 2016, 03:54 PM   #10
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Quote:
4. Teflon-coated (ktw-type) or any other type of armor
piercing bullets
Good grief? Still? Shocking, how long a lie will continue through society and work its way into the legal system.
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Old September 8, 2016, 04:43 PM   #11
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Quote:
Old Bill Dibble
Quote:
Quote:
4. Teflon-coated (ktw-type) or any other type of armor
piercing bullets
Good grief? Still? Shocking, how long a lie will continue through society and work its way into the legal system.
How long? ...............as long as companies market their ammo as metal piercing or armor piercing.....
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Old September 8, 2016, 05:55 PM   #12
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I have a few packs of KTW in the collection, but I never came across .25ACP. Exactly what armor is that supposed to pierce?
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Old September 8, 2016, 06:10 PM   #13
Old Bill Dibble
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KTW hasn't made in ammo in over 30 years. It hasn't even been branded in 20. Yet it is still banned so it has not been marketed that I know of in a generation.

However it is the same logic fail as the media made. Being Teflon coated has nothing to do with it being armor piercing.

I'd imagine that ammo is worth something to a collector.
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Old September 8, 2016, 06:26 PM   #14
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Quote:
I have a few packs of KTW in the collection, but I never came across .25ACP. Exactly what armor is that supposed to pierce?
Those uber strong nylon windbreakers
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Old September 9, 2016, 08:09 AM   #15
Don P
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Quote:
florida class d security licence ammo restrictions
the statute says that you can carry a .357 with. 38 sp ammo. Does this include + p rounds? What about critical defense rounds?
you cannot carry a firearm only having a class d security officer license. You must also have a Florida class g license in order to carry a firearm

In the link Tom provided, Title III subsection B is about the G license.
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Last edited by Don P; September 9, 2016 at 08:16 AM.
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Old September 9, 2016, 08:54 AM   #16
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Tom Servo:
Quote:
but I never came across .25ACP. Exactly what armor is that supposed to pierce?
It is highly piercing of the aluminum foil around a stick of gum.
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