Care to recommend a 45 non polymer/non 1911?

[southjk]

I am about ready for a new pistol and since I've never owned a 45 I think that should be the next purchase. I have 3 M&Ps (full size 9, 22 and Shield) and while I love them for what they are I don't want another polymer gun as of right now. Later, maybe a Glock but not this one.

I also don't want a 1911. It seems people are always having to tweak them to get them right and I want something that works great out of the box. I also don't have the budget for the 1911 I would want to buy.

So, what non 1911, non polymer pistol in the sub $700 range would you recommend? It will mostly be for HD and range use.

[BarryLee]

I’ve got a SIG P220 which I like a lot. SIG has several versions of this gun including the Carry, Compact, SAO and Elite. To stay in your price range you'll probaly need to find a used one, but there are plenty out there.

http://www.sigsauer.com/CatalogProdu...tols-p220.aspx

[Walt Sherrill]

You said "NEW" rather than "another" -- so assume you want a new, rather than used, gun.

CZ-97, SIG P220, H&K (several models) or Kahr T40 ... in no particular order.

Witness (EAA/Tanfoglio) also offers some sensational .45s, but EAA's customer service reputation would put ME OFF buying new from them.)

I've had some of these, and shot the others -- but while you said no polymer, I prefer my Glock 38 (.45 GAP) to just about all of them.

[Mike Irwin]

Used S&W 4506.

I love mine.

[tomklra14]

Ruger P90 and S&W 3rd generation (4506, 4566, etc.) are good all metal .45 non-1911 pistols. They are no longer made but can be found used pretty easily.

[BarryLee]

You might also consider the Stoeger Cougar which was formerly the Berretta Cougar. Stoeger is a subsidiary of Berretta and the gun is manufactured using Berretta tooling. I’ve never owned one, but they look decent and get good reviews.

http://www.stoegerindustries.com/fir...ger-cougar.php

[Kevin_d77]

Sig P220 and lately the CZ97 has piqued my interest as well. Love my Sig though!

[lamarw]

As BarryLee has mentioned already the Sig P220.

There just happens to be a great one on GunBroker at a very good starting bid. It is also the desirable German made P220. If you do not mind buying a used pistol: http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=349250186

I am not associated with this buyer, but I bought both ot these P220 shown in the attached picture from the same seller.

[sigarms228]

I also concur with the SIG P220. You may have to stretch your budget a little but to get one new or find a nice used one or CPO - Certified Pre Owned. Either way well worth the investment.

Mine that I bought new in 1996. With the carbon steel slide it is surprisingly light for a metal frame pistol.

[Skans]

EAA Witness, Witness Pro, Witness Hunter in .45

HK USP

Like others have mentioned, the Sig P220.

[blackamos]

The Sig p220 is hard to beat if you dislike manual safeties and I do dislike manual safeties.

[temmi]

SIG P220

[southjk]

You said "NEW" rather than "another" -- so assume you want a new, rather than used, gun

I did say New but I should have said a "new to me" pistol. I'm not opposed to used and I like the idea of the S&W.

I do like the Sig P220 but how to choose which one? There are 27 different models of the p220 on their website. Are they all the same except for appearances?

[lamarw]

Since you are willing to go with used, you really should look at the one I provided you the link to above. The German made ones are highly prized by many Sig folks; although I am not sure they are any better than the ones made in the USA.

[southjk]

Since you are willing to go with used, you really should look at the one I provided you the link to above.

lamarw, I appreciate the link and I did check it out. Unfortunately, I'm pretty picky and if I'm going to buy used I'd rather it didn't have as much visible wear as that one.

I tell you the one I really really like is the P220 Elite Stainless. I guess I should keep saving.

[lamarw]

Understand~ The Elite Stainless would be a nice choice.

[Tactical Jackalope]

SIG P220 - end of further discussion for me, given your criteria.

[carguychris]

I'm not opposed to used and I like the idea of the S&W.

FWIW it pays to do some research.

These guns were offered during the latter two of the three so-called generations of S&W auto pistols (the 1st generation was 9mm only). The 3rd-gen .45's were sold in 3 standard barrel lengths with either a standard slide-mounted decocker/safety, a frame-mounted decocker, or double-action-only. Some had alloy frames and some had steel; most had stainless steel finish but a few were carbon matte blued steel. Not every conceivable combination was actually offered. There were also 2 extra-small mini-compact (sub-sub-compact?) models, a stripped-down compact "Value Series" model, and several Performance Center SAO variants, including a few with "faux 1911" frame-mounted non-decocking safeties.

[loose_holster_dan]

CZ 97B in that price range.

[jmstr]

I am about ready for a new pistol and since I've never owned a 45 I think that should be the next purchase. I have 3 M&Ps (full size 9, 22 and Shield) and while I love them for what they are I don't want another polymer gun as of right now. Later, maybe a Glock but not this one.

Why?

Frame material? Or do you want an exposed hammer?

Which backstrap insert are you using on the M&P 9? I ask as I use the short backstrap on mine and feel very comfortable, as my fingers are slightly shorter than average.

Due to my finger length, the CZ 97 is uncomfortable in DA shooting. The SIG P220 is about the same, unless it has the short/thin trigger and the thinner backstrap area on the grips.

The P220Combat felt good in my hands, as it had that trigger and grip combo [I put on Hogue Piranha grips].

The 3rd generation Glock 21 feels too thick in my hands, with too long of a trigger pull also. I'm in California so can't get Gen 4 even if I wanted to.

Of all of those mentioned, I think the SIG P220 has a good chance of being your go-to gun. It will be a 8+1, instead of the 10 or more [depending on where you live] of the polymer-framed guns, but is the same as a 1911.

SIG P220 has generally been described as having the best 'out of the box' trigger of any mass-produced gun.

They feel nice.

I sold mine, as I was the exception to the benefits of the SIG: my groups were 2 times as big as with the majority of my other .45s.

Ironically, the .45 that groups the best for me [and costs under $1500] is the Ruger P97dc I own. The .45acp I have that groups noticeably better is the Caspian Custom 1911 I built up, at a cost of around $1500. Sig P220Combat was 7" at 7yards vs 1.5-2" with the Caspian and 2.5-3" with the Ruger P97: FOR ME!

All guns feel/fit/balance/point/respond slightly differently in our different hands. The SIG and HK USP .45c were the two I was the worst with [and I gave each of them 10 boxes of .45acp to grow comfortable with them]. And AFTER those two were shot that often I compared the feel and accuracy to my other .45s. The Ruger was the last one I shot that day, and I hadn't shot it in 6 years. Yet, the groups were SOO much better I couldn't believe it.

I am NOT bad mouthing SIG. I am identifying that all of our experiences are OUR experiences, and yours may vary.

The SIG P220 is an excellent gun, well made, reliable, accurate, great reputation.

99% of the people who shoot one will do VERY well with it. And I believe that ratio is about as high as I can say for ANY gun. Some I'd say 60% would do VERY well with.

If you are open to discussion of 1911s, I'd be happy to share my experiences with an entry-level 1911: the RIA Tactical 5". They are very good experiences. However, I'll respect your 'no 1911s' comment.

[Water-Man]

SIG P220.

[SIGSHR]

Neither my Colt Mark IV (used) or Colt Combat Commander (Used) nor my AMT Hardballer (NIB) needed any "tweaking", a good used handgun has already been broken in, my Hardballer had some problems but reliability and accuracy were NOT among them.

[10mm4ever]

The greatest non polymer, non 1911 45acp ever??? That's not that difficult......w. german SIG220.

[745SW]

My vote is for the all steel full size S&W 745, the most reliable 45auto I’ve owned using my lead SWC loads/reloads. And no worries of wearing the receivers finish because its stainless while the slide is blue. The Sig 220 I had in the distant past was the most accurate 45auto I’ve owned but the DA feature and alloy frame were not to my liking on a 45auto. I have factory new loads and I’ve never had a jam with any of my 45’s using factory but I keep factory consumption very low. They’re for zombies not paper targets.

I generally don’t like a bushing on my pistols because in my experience it contributes to reliability issues. Tried a makeshift experiment just for the interest between my 1911, a Colt Gold Cup series 70 (collet bushing), 745 and Glock 19C. Got roughly a two-inch length of Scotch transparent tape, the kind usually found in offices/homes, and taped it toward the muzzle of the pistol with the slide locked back. The 745 and the 19C has no problems with the tape, the slide goes fully into battery. The 1911 will jam, the slide won’t go anywhere near battery.

In the distant past Turner’s had an S&W 945 but it didn’t catch my interest because I mistakenly thought it was a 1911. Besides the price tag was $2000, this was back in the early 90’s I think! Other than their 1911’s I thought all of S&W’s 45auto designs were bushingless. In recent times I saw/have detailed images of a 945 stripped and to my dismay it uses a bushing.

[gman3]

http://www.wideners.com/itemdetail.c...=700|1012|1026

They have new in box German made P220s for a fair price.