The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old July 4, 2018, 07:05 PM   #26
Kirosha
Member
 
Join Date: June 20, 2018
Location: South Alabama
Posts: 87
Most police take their oaths very seriously, so you will often see off duty officers stepping in to help when it is legitimately needed. Brian, clearly 99% of off duty cops would have stepped in. In Alabama, if you are hitting in the head or stomach repeatedly, that is grounds for second degree assault, a felony. That is grounds for the use of deadly force by a citizen in protection of another. So yes, you'd see an off duty cop stepping in, at least the ones I know.
__________________
"People shouldn't be afraid of their government. Governments should be afraid of their people."

"Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it."
Kirosha is offline  
Old July 4, 2018, 08:54 PM   #27
FireForged
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 4, 1999
Location: Rebel South USA
Posts: 2,074
Quote:
In Alabama, if you are hitting in the head or stomach repeatedly, that is grounds for second degree assault, a felony
I am certainly no expert and I do not live in Alabama but I think you are mistaken about that. The codified Statute does not seem to support what you have said here. The Definition of serious physical injury is fairly specific as well.

Generally speaking, I would not want to try and justify the use of deadly force against a lone and seemingly unarmed person. That's just me.
__________________
Life is a web woven by necessity and chance...
FireForged is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 09:20 AM   #28
briandg
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 4, 2010
Posts: 5,468
Quote:
In Alabama, if you are hitting in the head or stomach repeatedly, that is grounds for second degree assault,
That would actually be assault with battery, since the attack was clearly serious. There are other subtleties to the charges.

In the legal definition, assault does not normally cover physical attack, it is limited to threats and other non physical intimidation, instilling fear.

Battery is a separate charge, and they try to make a clear distinction. Battery takes place when physical contact is made.

Felony assault and battery are charged when the attack causes serious bodily harm. Misdemeanor assault can be charged in cases of a push or light non injurious blow.
__________________
None.
briandg is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 10:42 AM   #29
FireForged
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 4, 1999
Location: Rebel South USA
Posts: 2,074
If they are talking about Alabama, you might want to read the statute. Your definitions may mirror common language or statutes from other places but I think you may be mistaken about Bama. I am no expert but I have traveled through there a few times and have superficially read through their criminal code.
__________________
Life is a web woven by necessity and chance...

Last edited by FireForged; July 5, 2018 at 10:50 AM.
FireForged is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 01:02 PM   #30
gwpercle
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 2012
Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana
Posts: 1,740
When armed:
1.) Do not get into , or attempt to break up , someone else's fight... I've seen too many instances where that person gets killed. Last year it happened here in Baton Rouge.
2.) If you drop your gun in the presence of armed offices....DO NOT attempt to pick it up, they will do something you wont like.
3.) I hate to say this ....but you are better off not being a hero if you can help it .
gwpercle is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 01:13 PM   #31
briandg
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 4, 2010
Posts: 5,468
the statutes in alabama may not fit the general description, it doesn't really matter unless the particular event involves alabama.

The description is listed as being common law from the early years, or the 'god given rights' laws. It's described as being common across the united states and other countries.

But, it's just nitpicking to draw the distinction during a casual conversation about this thing, especially since it doesn't involve anything I belong in. Alabama is a different place, different things take place and they have different ideas about the world, right or wrong.

I guess that the distinction only matters if you are involved with the legal system in alabama, and the involvement involves these specific things.
__________________
None.
briandg is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 01:30 PM   #32
Kirosha
Member
 
Join Date: June 20, 2018
Location: South Alabama
Posts: 87
Quote:
At what point do you believe that even off duty you should step in and save the guy who has lost and is still taking a serious beating? a punching match doesn't always end with just a bloody nose. Do you still stand aside, as an armed off duty cop, and let the action proceed?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirosha View Post
Most police take their oaths very seriously, so you will often see off duty officers stepping in to help when it is legitimately needed. Brian, clearly 99% of off duty cops would have stepped in. In Alabama, if you are hitting in the head or stomach repeatedly, that is grounds for second degree assault, a felony. That is grounds for the use of deadly force by a citizen in protection of another. So yes, you'd see an off duty cop stepping in, at least the ones I know.
I think that this isn't the right place to go deep into the Code of Alabama, nor was it my intention to delve deeper than I already have. My point was to Brian but about how cops, off duty or on duty, usually react in my experience.
__________________
"People shouldn't be afraid of their government. Governments should be afraid of their people."

"Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it."
Kirosha is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 02:02 PM   #33
JERRYS.
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 23, 2013
Location: Alabama
Posts: 2,968
argue all you want about what ifs..... but the fact remains that he got shot by the cops after reaching for a gun, after being told not to do so by the same cops.

the cops will be judged on what they knew at the time, not by what some pretend intellect found out later.

a man involved in a fight was reaching for a gun. the cops told him not to do so, the man did so and was shot.

Last edited by JERRYS.; July 6, 2018 at 04:02 PM.
JERRYS. is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 02:12 PM   #34
Double Naught Spy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague Cnty, TX
Posts: 12,714
What is strange is that he had a CCW, but was open carrying. The gun obviously was not concealed. I am not sure how the officers failed to spot it previously.

Now the protests have started against the PSU cops about killing a Navy veteran.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/portlan...on-washington/

Witnesses say he was trying to break up a fight. What the cops saw was a combatant with a gun.
__________________
"If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher." -- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011
My Hunting Videos https://www.youtube.com/user/HornHillRange
Double Naught Spy is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 02:52 PM   #35
MTT TL
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 21, 2009
Location: Quadling Country
Posts: 2,780
Quote:
This is exactly what people had feared would happen, Olivia Pace said.
Oh come on, Nobody thought EXACTLY that was going to happen.

I'm not a huge fan of armed campus police but these people are living in a dream world if they think that they are not a target for the next loser loner off his Xanax. Schools are one of the few places we really need an armed response on call.
__________________
Thus a man should endeavor to reach this high place of courage with all his heart, and, so trying, never be backward in war.
MTT TL is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 05:19 PM   #36
FireForged
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 4, 1999
Location: Rebel South USA
Posts: 2,074
Quote:
the statutes in alabama may not fit the general description, it doesn't really matter unless the particular event involves alabama.

Quote:
In Alabama, if you are hitting in the head or stomach repeatedly, that is grounds for second degree assault
So you were speaking generally... I was confused by the fact that you quoted and responded to a comment specifically about Alabama
__________________
Life is a web woven by necessity and chance...
FireForged is offline  
Old July 5, 2018, 08:17 PM   #37
Tactical Jackalope
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 5, 2010
Location: Miami, Florida
Posts: 6,429
Yup. Freak accident. That really is unfortunate.

I wish he had better retention in his holster at least. I remember when I jumped a fence once and my pistol fell out of my holster and hit the ground.

Things are so tense lately between LE and citizens. That's a whole other conversation though.
Tactical Jackalope is offline  
Old July 6, 2018, 07:00 PM   #38
Frank Ettin
Staff
 
Join Date: November 23, 2005
Location: California - San Francisco
Posts: 9,471
I think this has gone on long enough.
__________________
"It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper
Frank Ettin is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:48 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2021 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Page generated in 0.06880 seconds with 10 queries