December 22, 2017, 08:16 AM | #1 |
Senior Member
Join Date: September 19, 2015
Location: coastal NC
Posts: 645
|
BB Guns legal in NJ?
We are in PA visiting my parents for xmas. My parents are getting my 7 yr old son a red ryder. Next we are off to NJ before heading back to NC. Is it legal for me to take the red ryder into NJ? This feels like a really dumb question but who knows with nj...
|
December 22, 2017, 10:55 AM | #2 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 764
|
BB Guns legal in NJ?
In regards to the law... not in how you describe.
Let’s say a NJ resident buys a BB gun outside of NJ. Legally purchased, as there is not any other law outside of NJ that I know of which would restrict those sales. When one is brought into NJ, it is considered a firearm under NJ law. If you have a NJ FID, long guns can sit in the back of your car, and go anywhere you want to go (minus places where you likely would get arrested for possession; school, court house, airport, etc). Without a NJ FID, long guns can only go directly between residents, ranges, dealers, businesses the person owns/leases (not mobile). There are reasonable deviations, but more for things like gas or a medical emergency. Going to a place you don’t own, would technically be a restriction based on the law. If the BB gun is a handgun, a FID wouldn’t help. People must transport handguns directly between residence, range, dealer, etc. It is also a point to bring up that for a BB pistol, you’d have to file for a pistol purchase permit, just the same as if you were buying a regular handgun, if purchased within NJ. Now, I’m not telling you to knowingly break the law, but if you buy a BB gun, leave it in the sealed box, in your trunk, I don’t see an officer stopping you and searching your car likely for more people. Do people do it? I’m sure many do, but why not buy it in NC? Or at the DE Cabela’s on the way down? |
December 22, 2017, 11:29 AM | #3 |
Senior Member
Join Date: September 15, 2010
Posts: 1,850
|
After spending a few minutes on the NJ State Police website, I would not transport any weapon, including a BB gun into NJ if my intention was not to just drive through, without clarification from a NJ State Police representative or an experienced NJ attorney.
I think it would be fine in a sealed box and locked in the trunk or inaccessible in the back of an SUV. It doesn't make a bit of difference what I, or anyone here thinks though. I would pick up the BB gun on the way home or pay to have it shipped before risking facing an anti-gun NJ cop or judge. Life is too short...
__________________
"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Benjamin Franklin |
December 22, 2017, 11:38 AM | #4 |
Senior Member
Join Date: December 21, 2000
Posts: 4,193
|
No. BB guns are classified as FIREARMS in New Jersey.
__________________
Pilot |
December 22, 2017, 12:36 PM | #5 |
Senior Member
Join Date: November 17, 2009
Location: Back in a Non-Free State
Posts: 3,133
|
OMG, why would anyone who remotely enjoys protecting their bacon or mildly enjoy shooting sports live in that State? WHY?
__________________
Simple as ABC . . . Always Be Carrying |
December 22, 2017, 01:39 PM | #6 |
Senior Member
Join Date: January 15, 2013
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,416
|
In NJ, air guns (BB guns, pistols, etc.) are considered firearms. Traveling through NJ, firearms and ammunition must be transported separately in a locked compartment inaccessible to the vehicle occupants or in locked cases if there is no trunk. No FID card is required.
From above: "If you have a NJ FID, long guns can sit in the back of your car, and go anywhere you want to go (minus places where you likely would get arrested for possession; school, court house, airport, etc)." I'm not sure this is correct, and I wouldn't recommend anyone being a test case for it. |
December 22, 2017, 04:44 PM | #7 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 764
|
Quote:
It is correct... 2C:39-5c Then after that, read 2C:39-6 for the list of exemptions. Lived in NJ for quite some time. And I prefer to do things correctly for the short amount of time I’m still here. |
|
December 22, 2017, 05:32 PM | #8 |
Senior Member
Join Date: August 23, 2008
Location: East shore of Lake Michigan.
Posts: 713
|
Walmart in New Jersey sells BB guns...check the link.
https://www.walmart.com/search/?query=bb%20gun
__________________
Sent from my Tandy 1000 |
December 22, 2017, 05:58 PM | #9 |
Senior Member
Join Date: September 15, 2010
Posts: 1,850
|
Smoke and Recoil
It makes no difference if a resident with the proper permit can buy a BB gun locally. We are talking about a non-resident visiting the state. Advising anyone to break a law will find you giving bad advice somewhere other than TFL. I've been bored today and have looked for a clear definition of the law regarding BB guns in NJ. I find nothing definitive. If you can site a credible source that says it is acceptable for a visiting non-resident to possess a BB gun, please do so.
__________________
"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Benjamin Franklin |
December 22, 2017, 06:22 PM | #10 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 764
|
BB Guns legal in NJ?
There is a Walmart a few miles down the road from me... I don’t have to drive down there and confirm that they do not sell them. They don’t. I guarantee that if someone ordered one like that, it would be canceled, due to shipping restrictions.
Need to remember that 49 states (probably less, but emphasizing NJ is an anomaly with it) don’t consider BB guns firearms (similarly, black powder guns). A department store like Walmart isn’t going to be my go-to legal advice on BB guns. They probably don’t get the inquiries through the website enough for them to write it in that BB guns are a no go for NJ stores. Years back, Walmarts and K-Marts did sell BB guns, as well as shotguns and .22s... but most let their FFLs lapse. Sports Authority had the same situation, and there was one in Eatontown that kept theirs when all others stopped selling guns (until the chain closed completely). Go to a Dick’s in NJ, their BB guns are behind the counter (airsoft is not, being they are considered more along the lines of paintball guns). You go in, they do a Certificate of Eligibility and a NICS (judging you have a FID), you walk out with your BB gun. Buy any ammo (exception being shotgun ammo), they log your FID, put ammo in a locked plastic container, which is opened by the register as you check out. Listen, I’m very glad people do want to help the OP, but BB guns are considered firearms under NJ law. That means they are subject to NJ 2C:39 statutes, which can be easily be assessed. I’m giving him what the law is within NJ, without having to read pages of statutes, which are complicated for a specific reason. NJ’s constitution does not give citizens any rights regarding firearms, so 2C:39 is what you have to look at for legality from the NY border, and between the Delaware River, Hudson River, and Atlantic Ocean. There are a handful of AG decisions to consider (like the odd one saying Shockwave/TAC-14 firearms are legal, and not requiring a pistol permit for), but nothing changes the fact that it is illegal for a non-resident to stay in NJ with a BB gun, without abiding by the exemptions. As described by the OP, it is illegal unless he owns the property he is staying at. Whether he is going to get caught is another argument, but in regards to NJ law, it would be breaking the law. The OP is an adult, and can decide whatever he wants in his travels. If he was worried enough to post a thread on this, I’d just suggest to take the Turnpike (I95) to the Delaware Memorial Bridge, and within a few exits, you are at a Cabela’s where you can buy a BB gun, and not have to worry about NJ transportation laws. Plus, DE has no sales tax. Last edited by Screwball; December 22, 2017 at 06:27 PM. |
December 22, 2017, 06:26 PM | #11 |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 764
|
To add, each year a bill is proposed in the NJ Senate and General Assembly to remove BB guns from the firearm definition. And each year... it goes nowhere.
|
December 22, 2017, 06:47 PM | #12 |
Senior Member
Join Date: August 23, 2008
Location: East shore of Lake Michigan.
Posts: 713
|
What would Ralphie do ?
__________________
Sent from my Tandy 1000 |
December 22, 2017, 08:12 PM | #13 | |
Staff
Join Date: September 25, 2008
Location: CONUS
Posts: 18,414
|
Quote:
|
|
December 23, 2017, 04:26 PM | #14 |
Senior Member
Join Date: November 20, 2007
Posts: 438
|
I clicked on that walmart link, entered a zip code for "Sussex County New Jersey, which is as rural as you can get in New Jersey, searched the 4 stores for BB Gun Availability, and there are none.
|
December 24, 2017, 05:03 AM | #15 |
Staff
Join Date: March 11, 2006
Location: Upper US
Posts: 28,617
|
One should also consider the lack of Walmart selling BB guns in NJ might have less to do with the NJ laws than the profit those guns bring in.
I know that in my area, the Walmarts have a policy that each XX square inches of shelf space have to generate X amount of sales. If they don't sell a specific product enough to make that level, they replace it with something else. In other words, if they don't sell very many BB guns due to NJ laws, they are going to replace the BB gun with a fishing pole, or some other product that "moves".
__________________
All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better. |
December 24, 2017, 08:00 AM | #16 |
Senior Member
Join Date: June 25, 2006
Location: The Keystone State
Posts: 1,966
|
NJ=no-no
Don't take the chance; this is a state that records license plate numbers of vehicles in gun show parking lots.
One of the reason we relocated to PA.
__________________
"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading". --Thomas Jefferson |
December 24, 2017, 08:43 AM | #17 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 764
|
Quote:
While I have nothing good to say about NJ, you going to support that with any evidence? A town over from mine is the only “gun” show I know of that occurs in NJ, which is a regular monthly thing. Never seen anyone taking plates the few times I went in, nor have I seen people mention it... ever. Jackson Police, who patrols the location that it is held, has better things to do on a Sunday. NJSP likely has more important things to do, as well. |
|
December 24, 2017, 05:17 PM | #18 |
Senior Member
Join Date: September 19, 2015
Location: coastal NC
Posts: 645
|
Thanks. This is absolutely ridiculous but law is law. My plan is to leave the gun in PA and get it when I come back in 6 weeks when Im not going to NJ.
I would just buy it in NC but its from my parents and they really want to see him opening it. He is 7 so this will be his first gun. He has fired a bb gun before and learned about gun safety but this will allow us to shoot in the field behind the house and really drill in some gun safety before I get him a .22. |
December 24, 2017, 07:57 PM | #19 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 764
|
Quote:
What are you doing in NJ, if you don’t mind me asking? Listen, it is illegal to have the BB gun in NJ, and if it works out that you’ll be back there a few weeks later, I’d go that route. But being able to keep a long gun in my trunk with a FID (legally)... and all the times I’ve had one in my car, it has jammed me up zero times. Been stopped zero times with it in the car, and any time I’ve been stopped (light out or speeding), never was asked if there were a firearm in the car. People make NJ as this fictional place where law enforcement has psychic ability, and will lock you up if you have a single shotgun shell that rolled under the seat back during hunting season last year, which you didn’t know about. Still need to be pulled over for a reason. Still need probable cause to search your vehicle. Kind of hard to pick a car out of traffic, knowing there is a BB gun in the trunk. |
|
December 25, 2017, 12:57 AM | #20 | |
Staff
Join Date: November 23, 2005
Location: California - San Francisco
Posts: 9,471
|
Quote:
Where do people get the preposterous idea that just because something has or hasn't happened to them it will or will not happen to someone else? Your limited experiences are not evidence of a universal rule.
__________________
"It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper |
|
December 25, 2017, 05:35 AM | #21 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 764
|
Quote:
Pointing out the idea that NJ law enforcement are not better at their job than law enforcement in any part of the country. If you look at the rest of the quote that was omitted, I clearly say that the plan of action he is doing is the correct one. Last edited by Frank Ettin; December 25, 2017 at 05:51 AM. Reason: delete off-topic comment |
|
December 25, 2017, 05:55 AM | #22 | |
Staff
Join Date: November 23, 2005
Location: California - San Francisco
Posts: 9,471
|
Quote:
Personal anecdotes aren't data.
__________________
"It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper |
|
December 25, 2017, 06:38 AM | #23 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: May 16, 2012
Location: ME
Posts: 764
|
BB Guns legal in NJ?
Quote:
Fair enough, but just for clarification, how does post 16 in here fit in regards to anecdotes/data? Not trying to start anything, but rather know what is allowed/not allowed, so I don’t have to bother you in the future with a post that needs to be reviewed. If there isn’t anything wrong with that one, I’m going to need some clarification on what specifically was wrong with mine... because I see the two similar, just at different ends of the spectrum. Anytime I see NJ L/E brought up, it is always like they are these super cops that can smell a firearm twenty miles away. Not a suggestion of breaking the law, but if followed per 2C:39, a person isn’t going to be jammed up for legal transportation of a firearm just because they are within NJ. And to be clear, not a jab at you being a moderator or TFL rules. Specifically, I rather not make you need to do more work on here than you probably already do (moderated two other forums for a few years, so know how much fun it is). And to also add, Merry Christmas. |
|
December 25, 2017, 12:38 PM | #24 | |
Staff
Join Date: September 25, 2008
Location: CONUS
Posts: 18,414
|
Quote:
Even if the plural of anecdote were to be data, the fact that 'X' number of people illegally transported BB guns in the trunks of their cars and didn't get caught doesn't change the fact that it's illegal. (Which you, yourself, stated.) Some people are more risk-aversive than others. If Screwball is willing to run the risk of getting busted the next time has has a taillight burned out and a BB gun in his trunk, that's his choice. But this site doesn't allow us to advocate that other people engage in unlawful behavior, and IMHO "suggesting" that the OP could "probably" get away with it seems to me to be very close to violating that rule. The answer apparently is that it is not legal to have the BB gun in the vehicle when cruising around New Jersey to visit friends and/or family. With that established, how to deal with that reality is a personal decision best left to the OP himself. Last edited by Aguila Blanca; December 25, 2017 at 12:45 PM. |
|
December 26, 2017, 04:02 PM | #25 |
Senior Member
Join Date: January 15, 2013
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 1,416
|
From Screwball:
"Fair enough, but just for clarification, how does post 16 in here fit in regards to anecdotes/data?" It's misleading data. I frequently go to a couple of gun shows in PA and have bought firearms there.(long guns; handguns had to be sent to my local FFL). And I've done nothing illegal. I don't care if they write down my license plate number and issue an APB. But that's not the issue here. NJ residents are allowed to transport firearms from a place where it's legal to another place where it's legal. That's it. What's not being considered is in the case of an auto accident, which in my experience is never anticipated but happens. Now you have cops on the scene and an illegal gun in your car. |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
|
|