Winchester Model 70 conversion

MilitaMatters · November 21, 2016, 01:07 AM

So I am extremely new into the gunsmithing scene and have no experience tinkering with them. My idea is to convert a Winchester Model 70, in .308 win, into an M40 precision rifle. Or at least a look alike.

Does anyone know what the approximate price of this project might be? Are there any kits out there for it? I don't want to go to a gunsmith unless I need too.

Thanks.

bamaranger · November 21, 2016, 01:58 AM

I'm not a gunsmith, but will tell you that your first issue is starting with the wrong rifle, the M40 is based on the Remington M700.

The Remington and Win bolt rifles are not modular rifles like the AR. Components are fitted, not assembled, and typically require special shop tools, like a mill or lathe, and experience/training. About the simplest bolt rifles to work with are the Savage 10/110 series, due to the manner in which the barrel attaches to the receiver, allowing simpler headspacing.

For a look alike, there were at one time some assembled rifles being sold that were based on 700 actions and were essentially repros of the early M40's. I think maybe the Gibbs Rifle Company was working them up, could be wrong about that. Seems like there were special runs of OD tinted scopes too, to aid the project.

bamaranger · November 21, 2016, 02:13 AM

Just did some checking, Remington actually made M40 repro a few years back, a limited run, but the closest you'll get, right off the shelf.

Gibbs makes 1903 snipers, my bad.

jmr40 · November 21, 2016, 05:25 AM

The M-40 is based on the 700 action. But most early Vietnam war era sniper rifles were Winchester 70's in 30-06 with a heavy target barrel. It wouldn't be too hard to re-create that. But installing the barrel would require a gunsmith with the tools and skills necessary.

Early rifles had walnut stocks, but the rain and humidity made them impractical in Jungle warfare. I've read reports that they weren't accurate enough to use past about 40 yards most of the time because the wood swelled so much from the moisture. That problem was corrected in the early 70's when they went to McMillan fiberglass stocks.

old roper · November 21, 2016, 07:18 AM

Here is history on model 70 sniper rifle.

https://looserounds.com/2012/06/09/w...brief-history/

They have made reproduction of the model 70 sniper rifle and they use pre 64 actions.

Here is a deal that came up on scopes few years back

http://www.gundigest.com/tactical-ge...c-sniper-scope

kraigwy · November 21, 2016, 10:19 AM

I read the OPs post, had to step back, get another cup of coffee, relax a bit and come back and read it again.

Turn a Model 70 into a Remington M40 version of a M700.

They are two different rifles, both good rifles. That would be akin to saying you want to convert a Model 27 S&W into a Colt Python.

You want a Model 40 get a Remington 700 and make one, you want a Model 70 target rifle buy or build one.

They had Model 70 sniper rifles, in reality they were target rifles. They are well made and accurate. But the cost more to build then the Remington and that's why Remington got the contract to build M24s (Army) and M40s Marines.

The Army Marksmanship Unit was big on Model 70 Target rifles. I have two AMU built Model 70s, (one in 308 and one in 300 WM) that I got from the CMP Auction Site. They also have AMU Model 700s or 40X's (tgt. version) pop up every now and then but I like Model 70s.

Both the Model 70 and 700 are good rifles. I believe the Model 70 has a better trigger, and (a biggie in the target rifles) the Model 70 has a flat receiver as opposed to the round receiver of the Remington. When it comes to bedding a target rifle that is a big advantage.

The main difference between the two is the personal opinions of the shooter.
Same as the difference between ford and chevy.

Model 70 Tgt. in 308.

Model 70 Tgt in 300 WM.

Nothing wrong with wanting a M40 or M24 Clone, but you have to start with a Remington, its a completely different rifle then the Model 70.

joed · November 21, 2016, 11:38 AM

I like your idea of building a model 70 for your project. One of the rifles I own is a model 70 Stealth in .308 Win. This rifle is a bit heavy but I've never had a rifle like it. I have it topped with a Weaver T36 and it is very accurate.

You'd need a heavy barrel, synthetic stock (my preference), optics and trigger. The Winchester triggers are easy to adjust.

If you decide to continue I'd like to hear how it progresses.

MilitaMatters · November 22, 2016, 12:17 AM

I have a model 70 in .308

In its current configuration, with a wooden stock and standard barrel, it is not suited to rough use. My idea stems from the model 40. However, I do not like the Remington 700's action or receiver platform at all. Never have been a fan.

What I want is a synthetic stock that can be modified (cut up and put back together for my own modifications) and a receiver that will accept a magazine from below.

Essentially, I want a model 70 that looks similar to an m40, but with the addition of a detachable magazine to allow for quicker reloading.

If anyone knows of any kits that favor this type of reconfiguration, I would be appreciative. If not, would I be able to purchase all of the parts needed and assemble them myself? Or would I require the assistance of a gunsmith?

Best regards.

taylorce1 · November 22, 2016, 11:35 AM

You're going to need a gunsmith if you replace the barrel.

Buy an FN SPR or PBR it'll get you closer to what you want cheaper than a rebarrel and restock of your current rifle. The FN rifles use the M70 action with DBM the difference is the SPR has the claw extractor and the PBR is a push feed.

To buy and install a barrel will run you anywhere from $500 to $700+ on average. It's $200 on average for M70 DBM with one magazine. A synthetic stock you can cut and reconfigure to your liking, well that requires a good quality stock like HS, McMillan, or Manners another $400-700. B&C use fiberglass that's blown in and not hand laid, I'm not sure I'd cut into one of those.

I've built a few rifles and I didn't even list the costs you haven't thought of yet. It wouldn't be hard to push your build to past $2000. You'd be money ahead to sell your rifle and buy one of the two I linked, I think the SPR comes with a McMillan and the PBR uses a Houge. So I'd lean the SPR.

Scorch · November 22, 2016, 04:53 PM

Like others have said "you can't get there from here". You have a Winchester Model 70, presumably a push-feed model. You want a Viet Nam-era sniper rifle. You want to end up with a Remington M40, based on the Remington 700. That's a long way to go. Sell the Winchester and buy a Remington like this one.
http://www.gunbroker.com/item/600815192

Or conversely, you can go with a Model 70 like the early Viet Nam-era sniper rifles. Just buy something like this
http://www.gunbroker.com/item/600618492

But you cannot start out with a Winchester Model 70 and wind up with a Remington 700. You can't start out with chocolate ice cream and wind up with strawberry. Doesn't work.

jmr40 · November 23, 2016, 10:35 AM

Quote:

What I want is a synthetic stock that can be modified (cut up and put back together for my own modific

That isn't practical with synthetic, at least not the good ones. The quality stocks from McMillan, Brown precision etc. have laminated layers of either fiberglass or kevlar cloth from the stocks grip up past the action screw. The cutout for the action is machined just like a wood stock. But the fore end and butt stock are made with thinner layers of the fiberglass or Kevlar in an outer shell. The interior is hollow, but generally filled with foam to deaden sound. Cut through the outer shell and you ruin the strength of the stock.

The mid grade stocks such as B&C or HS-Precision use cast aluminum inserts for the action to bolt to and a mixture of molten plastic and chopped fiberglass is poured into a mold and hardens. The cheaper stocks are simply injection molded plastic.

They ain't cheap, but McMillan is the best bet for an accurate reproduction. They are custom built and will work with you on special features you may want.

The B&C stocks are pretty decent, especially on a heavier sniper/target/varmint type of rig. I don't especially like them on a sporter weight rifle, I much prefer a McMillan Edge for this. But B&C does offer some decent options at much more attractive prices.

https://www.stockysstocks.com/stocks...rt-action.html

November 21, 2016, 01:07 AM	#1
MilitaMatters Member Join Date: July 17, 2016 Posts: 18	Winchester Model 70 conversion So I am extremely new into the gunsmithing scene and have no experience tinkering with them. My idea is to convert a Winchester Model 70, in .308 win, into an M40 precision rifle. Or at least a look alike. Does anyone know what the approximate price of this project might be? Are there any kits out there for it? I don't want to go to a gunsmith unless I need too. Thanks. __________________ "This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is mine..."-Major General William H. Rupertus, 1941.

November 21, 2016, 01:58 AM	#2
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,312	wrong foot I'm not a gunsmith, but will tell you that your first issue is starting with the wrong rifle, the M40 is based on the Remington M700. The Remington and Win bolt rifles are not modular rifles like the AR. Components are fitted, not assembled, and typically require special shop tools, like a mill or lathe, and experience/training. About the simplest bolt rifles to work with are the Savage 10/110 series, due to the manner in which the barrel attaches to the receiver, allowing simpler headspacing. For a look alike, there were at one time some assembled rifles being sold that were based on 700 actions and were essentially repros of the early M40's. I think maybe the Gibbs Rifle Company was working them up, could be wrong about that. Seems like there were special runs of OD tinted scopes too, to aid the project.

November 21, 2016, 02:13 AM	#3
bamaranger Senior Member Join Date: October 9, 2009 Location: North Alabama Posts: 8,312	checks Just did some checking, Remington actually made M40 repro a few years back, a limited run, but the closest you'll get, right off the shelf. Gibbs makes 1903 snipers, my bad.

November 21, 2016, 07:18 AM	#5
old roper Senior Member Join Date: June 11, 2007 Posts: 2,155	Here is history on model 70 sniper rifle. https://looserounds.com/2012/06/09/w...brief-history/ They have made reproduction of the model 70 sniper rifle and they use pre 64 actions. Here is a deal that came up on scopes few years back http://www.gundigest.com/tactical-ge...c-sniper-scope __________________ Semper Fi Vietnam 1965 VFW Life member NRA Life Member

November 21, 2016, 10:19 AM	#6
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	I read the OPs post, had to step back, get another cup of coffee, relax a bit and come back and read it again. Turn a Model 70 into a Remington M40 version of a M700. They are two different rifles, both good rifles. That would be akin to saying you want to convert a Model 27 S&W into a Colt Python. You want a Model 40 get a Remington 700 and make one, you want a Model 70 target rifle buy or build one. They had Model 70 sniper rifles, in reality they were target rifles. They are well made and accurate. But the cost more to build then the Remington and that's why Remington got the contract to build M24s (Army) and M40s Marines. The Army Marksmanship Unit was big on Model 70 Target rifles. I have two AMU built Model 70s, (one in 308 and one in 300 WM) that I got from the CMP Auction Site. They also have AMU Model 700s or 40X's (tgt. version) pop up every now and then but I like Model 70s. Both the Model 70 and 700 are good rifles. I believe the Model 70 has a better trigger, and (a biggie in the target rifles) the Model 70 has a flat receiver as opposed to the round receiver of the Remington. When it comes to bedding a target rifle that is a big advantage. The main difference between the two is the personal opinions of the shooter. Same as the difference between ford and chevy. Model 70 Tgt. in 308. Model 70 Tgt in 300 WM. Nothing wrong with wanting a M40 or M24 Clone, but you have to start with a Remington, its a completely different rifle then the Model 70. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

November 21, 2016, 05:25 AM	#4
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,809	The M-40 is based on the 700 action. But most early Vietnam war era sniper rifles were Winchester 70's in 30-06 with a heavy target barrel. It wouldn't be too hard to re-create that. But installing the barrel would require a gunsmith with the tools and skills necessary. Early rifles had walnut stocks, but the rain and humidity made them impractical in Jungle warfare. I've read reports that they weren't accurate enough to use past about 40 yards most of the time because the wood swelled so much from the moisture. That problem was corrected in the early 70's when they went to McMillan fiberglass stocks.

November 21, 2016, 11:38 AM	#7
joed Senior Member Join Date: November 28, 2014 Posts: 442	I like your idea of building a model 70 for your project. One of the rifles I own is a model 70 Stealth in .308 Win. This rifle is a bit heavy but I've never had a rifle like it. I have it topped with a Weaver T36 and it is very accurate. You'd need a heavy barrel, synthetic stock (my preference), optics and trigger. The Winchester triggers are easy to adjust. If you decide to continue I'd like to hear how it progresses.

November 22, 2016, 12:17 AM	#8
MilitaMatters Member Join Date: July 17, 2016 Posts: 18	[RE] I have a model 70 in .308 In its current configuration, with a wooden stock and standard barrel, it is not suited to rough use. My idea stems from the model 40. However, I do not like the Remington 700's action or receiver platform at all. Never have been a fan. What I want is a synthetic stock that can be modified (cut up and put back together for my own modifications) and a receiver that will accept a magazine from below. Essentially, I want a model 70 that looks similar to an m40, but with the addition of a detachable magazine to allow for quicker reloading. If anyone knows of any kits that favor this type of reconfiguration, I would be appreciative. If not, would I be able to purchase all of the parts needed and assemble them myself? Or would I require the assistance of a gunsmith? Best regards. __________________ "This is my rifle. There are many like it, but this one is mine..."-Major General William H. Rupertus, 1941.

November 22, 2016, 11:35 AM	#9
taylorce1 Senior Member Join Date: November 18, 2005 Location: On the Santa Fe Trail Posts: 8,249	You're going to need a gunsmith if you replace the barrel. Buy an FN SPR or PBR it'll get you closer to what you want cheaper than a rebarrel and restock of your current rifle. The FN rifles use the M70 action with DBM the difference is the SPR has the claw extractor and the PBR is a push feed. To buy and install a barrel will run you anywhere from $500 to $700+ on average. It's $200 on average for M70 DBM with one magazine. A synthetic stock you can cut and reconfigure to your liking, well that requires a good quality stock like HS, McMillan, or Manners another $400-700. B&C use fiberglass that's blown in and not hand laid, I'm not sure I'd cut into one of those. I've built a few rifles and I didn't even list the costs you haven't thought of yet. It wouldn't be hard to push your build to past $2000. You'd be money ahead to sell your rifle and buy one of the two I linked, I think the SPR comes with a McMillan and the PBR uses a Houge. So I'd lean the SPR. __________________ NRA Life Member

November 22, 2016, 04:53 PM	#10
Scorch Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2006 Location: Washington state Posts: 15,248	Like others have said "you can't get there from here". You have a Winchester Model 70, presumably a push-feed model. You want a Viet Nam-era sniper rifle. You want to end up with a Remington M40, based on the Remington 700. That's a long way to go. Sell the Winchester and buy a Remington like this one. http://www.gunbroker.com/item/600815192 Or conversely, you can go with a Model 70 like the early Viet Nam-era sniper rifles. Just buy something like this http://www.gunbroker.com/item/600618492 But you cannot start out with a Winchester Model 70 and wind up with a Remington 700. You can't start out with chocolate ice cream and wind up with strawberry. Doesn't work. __________________ Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs. But what do I know? Summit Arms Services