Low magnification AR fixed magnification optic and mini red dot reccomendations? - Page 2

riffraff · June 29, 2018, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mobuck

" I don't fight cross dominance with 1X red dots. "

I don't follow? On the better red dots, eye alignment isn't an issue so if you see the dot and it's "on target" you get a hit. Doesn't make any diff which eye.

With magnification I can't keep both eyes open if I shoot with my right eye. I know people say you can fight it, overcome it, but I haven't found a way. The same applies to iron sights. It's not a vision problem rather it's just an eye dominance thing.

With magnification I can keep both eyes open if I shoot with my left eye, which is what I do on a right handed rifle that I own, since I rise it up high enough so I can, an extra 3/4 inch rise is all it takes.

I'm not all that off shooting left handed either to be honest, coordinated enough I guess and it feels OK but bottom line is on a standard rifle brass is gonna wing from the right side and I want to be able to shoot standard rifles normally, reach controls normally, so I take the compromise of adjustments to deal w/ my eyes versus shooting rifles "goofy foot" or having special rifles.

Anyway - so back to red dots. For whatever reason although I cannot keep both eyes open with a set of iron sights using my right eye, with a red dot without magnification I can - I "see" it with both eyes even though I'm only looking through it with one. Maybe that's normal for everyone - I don't know, but it's a beautiful thing!

Mobuck · June 29, 2018, 10:34 AM

I guess I'm just too "old school". I learned to shoot rifles/handguns closing my non-aiming eye. This technique served me well enough and I see no real reason to change.
If the bad guys are close enough to be of such a threat that I need both eyes open, I'm not going to be down behind the optic much anyway.

marine6680 · June 29, 2018, 01:14 PM

Eye dominance can be trained... It's not hard per se but it does take some time and effort.

riffraff · June 29, 2018, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mobuck

I guess I'm just too "old school". I learned to shoot rifles/handguns closing my non-aiming eye. This technique served me well enough and I see no real reason to change.
If the bad guys are close enough to be of such a threat that I need both eyes open, I'm not going to be down behind the optic much anyway.

Not my expertise (if we are ever talking northeast US salt water fishing I got you guys covered

)..

Supposedly the big problem is if you get real stressed out nature kicks in and is going to force both eyes open on you, which can be real bad if your whole shooting experience involves one eye shut.

I don't know anything about gun fights but have had enough near death experiences to understand things go into automatic mode.

Mobuck · June 29, 2018, 08:39 PM

"Supposedly the big problem is if you get real stressed out nature kicks in and is going to force both eyes open on you, "
I'm not sure how "stressful" being mortared sits on the scale but it didn't cause any noticeable inability to close my left eye independently of the right. Not even after the little tail fin thingie ricocheted off the top of my skull.

thallub · June 29, 2018, 10:18 PM

Never cared for the red dot scopes. One of my AR-15 rifles wears the Leupold FXII 4X33 scope. That is a really good scope. It retails for around $250-$275.

https://www.leupold.com/scopes/rifle...s/fx-ii-4x33mm

riffraff · June 30, 2018, 09:37 AM

So still toiling over this but I think the "hot setup" for me might be either a red dot with a magnifier (which someone mentioned earlier via "Romeo & Juliet"), or something like this - which could be the Burris pictured (also recommended here) or another optic that has a rail on top w/ a mini reflex sight.

Since I happen to have a Romeo5 I'm tempted to pickup a Juliet magnifier and just try it. Never even put my hands on a magnifier but I assume there is some need to make that set that matched up well together and those two are meant to be a set.

On the other hand it's not outrageous $$ to try one of these Burris setups, or drop a mini reflex atop that primary arms model and just try it either - either or both optics would find a happy home even if it wasn't on this AR.

Mobuck - so I guess that's the difference between "supposedly" and reality, either that or such circumstances weren't enough to stress you out

. Thank you for your service.

Erno86 · June 30, 2018, 12:49 PM

I have a Burris AR-332 mounted on one of my AK's, that I bought about 10 years ago, and I was disappointed in it, because it does not have a bright field of view.

Eye dominance can be trained...but it's harder too perform the technique in dark-lit environments --- That is, at least for me.

If you buy a variable 1x-?, you have to make sure it's a true 1x. I have a Vortex Razor HD Generation II (1-6x), with JMC crosshairs, mounted on one of my AR's. It's "built like a tank," but the true 1x setting seems to have a little bit of distortion in it --- Otherwise...I like it very much.

riffraff · June 30, 2018, 02:48 PM

Thanks Erno - not sold on the Burris fixed mag optic rather the general idea of the little red dot on top is what I was trying to get at. Without being very goofy that setup has a true 1X and magnification all right there.

Could take the same Burris mini reflex, or another mini reflex, and drop it onto any optic that has the bit of rail on top is what I'm thinking.

Erno86 · July 1, 2018, 12:40 PM

The Burris Fast-Fire mini-reflex is not a bad option either. I have one mounted on my other AR, atop a Burris 1-4x. The only downside are cheek weld issues, with the Fast-Fire mounted on top of the scope; though it should not be much of a problem while using it at short ranges.

Scoits · July 1, 2018, 02:03 PM

I use a leupold 1x4 scope in a Burris mount and had a fastfire 3 on it but then went to a Crimson Trace rail master 201 for close in. Prefer that arrangement.

PlatinumCore16 · July 2, 2018, 11:21 AM

I don't know if you picked one yet or not (couldn't tell through the thread), but I will put my vote in for the Primary Arms 3x ACSS. The "CQB" reticle is really nice for ranges out to 300yds, but the outer ring is quick up close. And the entire reticle illuminates as opposed to just the horseshoe. It isn't the lightest, but it's easy to see unilluminated and lit up. Eye relief was enough for me, but I understand you're looking for something with a bit of forgiveness there.

riffraff · July 2, 2018, 02:42 PM

I think the PA in 3X is gonna be the winner but gonna research the 5X a bit first since with a red dot on top of it there's less downside to shrinking field of view - kinda kicking myself, the company itself Primary Arms had a used 3X on Ebay they were selling for $200 I could've got for $160 about when this thread started - should've jumped on it!

A little too "not 100% sold" on the Trijicon to be seriously considering dumping a grand on one right now - I'm gonna wait until I happen to put put hands on one and can try it, and will see how the whole thing works out when I put it together too.

The Burris red dot mentioned seems like a winner as far as the red dot choice..

I did consider a magnifier & red dot but appears #1 eye relief w/ a magnifier is pretty bad and I don't like the idea of having that hardware constantly in my face, even when it's swung out of the way that's a kinda a big blind spot.

As always thanks everyone for your help!

marine6680 · July 2, 2018, 07:50 PM

In the words of the PA marketing guy on AR15dotCOM...

The 5x is huge.

The clarity of the ACOG glass is insane. It's impressive looking through it in a store, and even better outdoors.

I like both of mine. I think the 4x are worth the sale price as I see them for around $950 from time to time.

HWS · July 2, 2018, 09:15 PM

I too have a Primary Arms 2.5 prism scope. I never even turn it on in daylight. The black reticle is just right in that environment. I can hit steel targets at 300 yards or ten yards, no problems. It is quick. At say 30-40 yards, you pick what part of the target you want to hit. Forget all that talk about being bad at short distances. It just is not, it is great at very short distances.

darkgael · July 3, 2018, 03:59 AM

Quote:

The clarity of the ACOG glass is insane

+1.
I have a Trijicon ACOG TA01 4x32 on my Colt. It is, hands down, the clearest scope that I have had the pleasure to look through.I have had it a long time along with an RX01 reflex. No complaints.

stagpanther · July 3, 2018, 08:10 AM

Quote:

I never even turn it on in daylight. The black reticle is just right in that environment.

Same--I never have to turn mine on either.

June 29, 2018, 10:18 PM	#31
thallub Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2007 Location: South Western OK Posts: 3,112	Never cared for the red dot scopes. One of my AR-15 rifles wears the Leupold FXII 4X33 scope. That is a really good scope. It retails for around $250-$275. https://www.leupold.com/scopes/rifle...s/fx-ii-4x33mm Last edited by thallub; June 29, 2018 at 10:28 PM.

June 30, 2018, 12:49 PM	#33
Erno86 Senior Member Join Date: September 22, 2012 Location: Marriottsville, Maryland Posts: 1,739	I have a Burris AR-332 mounted on one of my AK's, that I bought about 10 years ago, and I was disappointed in it, because it does not have a bright field of view. Eye dominance can be trained...but it's harder too perform the technique in dark-lit environments --- That is, at least for me. If you buy a variable 1x-?, you have to make sure it's a true 1x. I have a Vortex Razor HD Generation II (1-6x), with JMC crosshairs, mounted on one of my AR's. It's "built like a tank," but the true 1x setting seems to have a little bit of distortion in it --- Otherwise...I like it very much. __________________ That rifle hanging on the wall of the working class flat or labourer's cottage is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there." --- George Orwell

July 1, 2018, 12:40 PM	#35
Erno86 Senior Member Join Date: September 22, 2012 Location: Marriottsville, Maryland Posts: 1,739	The Burris Fast-Fire mini-reflex is not a bad option either. I have one mounted on my other AR, atop a Burris 1-4x. The only downside are cheek weld issues, with the Fast-Fire mounted on top of the scope; though it should not be much of a problem while using it at short ranges. __________________ That rifle hanging on the wall of the working class flat or labourer's cottage is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there." --- George Orwell

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June 29, 2018, 10:34 AM	#27
Mobuck Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2010 Posts: 6,846	I guess I'm just too "old school". I learned to shoot rifles/handguns closing my non-aiming eye. This technique served me well enough and I see no real reason to change. If the bad guys are close enough to be of such a threat that I need both eyes open, I'm not going to be down behind the optic much anyway.

June 29, 2018, 01:14 PM	#28
marine6680 Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2012 Location: Parker, CO Posts: 4,594	Eye dominance can be trained... It's not hard per se but it does take some time and effort.

June 29, 2018, 08:39 PM	#30
Mobuck Junior member Join Date: February 2, 2010 Posts: 6,846	"Supposedly the big problem is if you get real stressed out nature kicks in and is going to force both eyes open on you, " I'm not sure how "stressful" being mortared sits on the scale but it didn't cause any noticeable inability to close my left eye independently of the right. Not even after the little tail fin thingie ricocheted off the top of my skull.

June 30, 2018, 02:48 PM	#34
riffraff Senior Member Join Date: January 21, 2016 Posts: 629	Thanks Erno - not sold on the Burris fixed mag optic rather the general idea of the little red dot on top is what I was trying to get at. Without being very goofy that setup has a true 1X and magnification all right there. Could take the same Burris mini reflex, or another mini reflex, and drop it onto any optic that has the bit of rail on top is what I'm thinking.

July 1, 2018, 02:03 PM	#36
Scoits Senior Member Join Date: June 18, 2017 Posts: 178	I use a leupold 1x4 scope in a Burris mount and had a fastfire 3 on it but then went to a Crimson Trace rail master 201 for close in. Prefer that arrangement.

July 2, 2018, 11:21 AM	#37
PlatinumCore16 Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2017 Location: Colorado Posts: 424	I don't know if you picked one yet or not (couldn't tell through the thread), but I will put my vote in for the Primary Arms 3x ACSS. The "CQB" reticle is really nice for ranges out to 300yds, but the outer ring is quick up close. And the entire reticle illuminates as opposed to just the horseshoe. It isn't the lightest, but it's easy to see unilluminated and lit up. Eye relief was enough for me, but I understand you're looking for something with a bit of forgiveness there.

July 2, 2018, 02:42 PM	#38
riffraff Senior Member Join Date: January 21, 2016 Posts: 629	I think the PA in 3X is gonna be the winner but gonna research the 5X a bit first since with a red dot on top of it there's less downside to shrinking field of view - kinda kicking myself, the company itself Primary Arms had a used 3X on Ebay they were selling for $200 I could've got for $160 about when this thread started - should've jumped on it! A little too "not 100% sold" on the Trijicon to be seriously considering dumping a grand on one right now - I'm gonna wait until I happen to put put hands on one and can try it, and will see how the whole thing works out when I put it together too. The Burris red dot mentioned seems like a winner as far as the red dot choice.. I did consider a magnifier & red dot but appears #1 eye relief w/ a magnifier is pretty bad and I don't like the idea of having that hardware constantly in my face, even when it's swung out of the way that's a kinda a big blind spot. As always thanks everyone for your help!

July 2, 2018, 07:50 PM	#39
marine6680 Senior Member Join Date: July 24, 2012 Location: Parker, CO Posts: 4,594	In the words of the PA marketing guy on AR15dotCOM... The 5x is huge. The clarity of the ACOG glass is insane. It's impressive looking through it in a store, and even better outdoors. I like both of mine. I think the 4x are worth the sale price as I see them for around $950 from time to time.

July 2, 2018, 09:15 PM	#40
HWS Member Join Date: July 1, 2018 Posts: 90	I too have a Primary Arms 2.5 prism scope. I never even turn it on in daylight. The black reticle is just right in that environment. I can hit steel targets at 300 yards or ten yards, no problems. It is quick. At say 30-40 yards, you pick what part of the target you want to hit. Forget all that talk about being bad at short distances. It just is not, it is great at very short distances.