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Old January 3, 2019, 07:35 PM   #1
UltralightBob
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Lightest Glock Mods

I would like to build the lightest (but still functional) glock possible. Should I start with an existing pistol... or build one from scratch with an aftermarket slide and frame?

End pistol will shoot 40S&W. So, something off of either the G27 or G33 frame/slide size would make sense.

I would intend on putting many hours and rounds through the final product to ensure reliability with my chosen ammo.

Basic Gen 4 Glock 27 weighs 19.40 ounces without a magazine, and 21.34 with a magazine. I would like to shave off 2-3 ounces. (and please don't respond that I should just leave a couple rounds out of the mag...)

What would be the best slide cut design that would still give me the max slide strength, but take off the most weight? (has anyone weighed their slide with and without cuts? know the weight savings?

What spring weight would I want to go to if I am taking slide weight off?

What is the lightest weight RSA option? The "heavier" springs you get from places like LWD actually add about .55 ounces, as they are steel instead of plastic (I'm fine with the plastic rod in the captured gen4 rsa but would want a heavier spring to compensate for the lighter slide)

What kind of weight savings from things like skeletonize firing pins? Other titanium parts that can be swapped in for OEM?

Anyone ever shaved weight off of the mag itself? skeletonized mags?

Which after market barrel options are the lightest? For example, Lone Wolf's look like they are fluted whereas KKM are strait. What is the weight difference between the two?

Thanks for the help
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Old January 3, 2019, 07:41 PM   #2
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Especially one on 40S&W
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Old January 3, 2019, 07:43 PM   #3
UltralightBob
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I should also point out... I am not looking for advice on whether I should cut up a Glock, but rather HOW and which mods will shave the most weight but still retain functionality.
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Old January 3, 2019, 10:40 PM   #4
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Seems like a lot of this is a comparison you'd have to make yourself by creating a spreadsheet and looking up information on the manufacturer websites for all these parts. If someone has done it already hopefully they'll sound off. More firearm specific forums might have that information available more readily.

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Old January 4, 2019, 01:38 AM   #5
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Just buy a lighter gun.
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Old January 4, 2019, 12:10 PM   #6
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I don't recommend you do this. :/
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Old January 4, 2019, 01:22 PM   #7
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Please just go buy a 360PD.
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Old January 4, 2019, 01:31 PM   #8
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People, the OP just wanted some suggestions on how to lighten a Glock!
I myself like to tinker and can appreciate the OP's desire to modify an existing weapon.
I imagine that the user name Ultrlight Bob make some sense now!

Here's some suggestions.
Krytos makes a titanium slide that they boast is 25% lighter than a stock slide.
https://www.krytosindustries.com
SInce the slide is the heaviest part of a glock, that would make the most weight savings possible, and surely shave off a few ounces.

Also look into the weight savings of ARX polycase ammo over conventional hollowpoint ammo. I got a weight saving of 2.5 ounces with eleven rounds.
ARX Interceptor 9mm, 65 grain solid fluted bullet going almost 1700 ft. chronographed out of my glock 19.
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Old January 4, 2019, 01:39 PM   #9
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Ok... now that we have the typical "don't do this" or "just buy another gun" contributions to the conversation out of the way, I think we can move on...

I don't mean to be rude here, and I get it that I am a new poster here amongst veterans, but I thought my post was very clear in the parameters of the information I am seeking. Does anyone have anything constructive to add about my actual topic and question?

In regards to the one on-topic post: My problem with getting the information from manufacturers websites, is that not all of them post the weights in the level of detail that I am seeking. In fact, most do not post the actual measured weight of their product at all. I am looking for fellow gun enthusiasts who have made similar modifications to their firearms, who have experiences they can share about the pros and cons of various mods they have performed, and the actual measured weights of the parts if they can put them on a postal scale or a food scale from a department store.

Thank you in advance for your help.
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Old January 4, 2019, 01:44 PM   #10
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@HighValleyRanch, THANK YOU! that is excellent info. I had not come across the idea of the titanium slides. (I was typing my previous retort before I had seen your post).

Also, if I can achieve acceptable levels of reliability with this weapon, it will be my backwoods carry gun, so I would be looking at firing fairly heavy (deep penetrating) bullets. Do you know if the polycase ammo offers options like that?

Thanks!

Does anyone have any experience with the Titanium slides?
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Old January 4, 2019, 02:00 PM   #11
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Regarding ARX heavy .40 cal:
They come in 107 grain, but not heavy like 180 since that would be the weight savings.
The theory is velocity vs. heavy weight for impact.

For woods carry, I would go with the BuffaloBore outdoorsman 180 hard cast for penetration, forget the weight savings on ammo.

If doing cutouts, it would do one on either side to keep rigidity in the center. Probably any cutouts would not be as much weight saved as titanium, though, but cheaper. But considerthe cost of custom shop time, unless you have a machinist friend.

It would seem that any other minor weight savings in parts would be minimal at best.

Good luck on your project! I love ultra light, that's why an LCR is my primary woods carry gun.
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Old January 4, 2019, 02:37 PM   #12
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Well darn, I just looked into those Titanium slides. Looks like they only make one for the G19 and G17.... I emailed them to see if they had custom options for other calibers/slide lengths... I will let ya all know when I hear back.

Does anyone have experience with these or this company? Is it possible to cut off a similar amount of weight with cutouts and still maintain integrity?
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Old January 4, 2019, 04:29 PM   #13
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If that interested you should be able to determine how much of the slide you'd need to remove in order to obtain a 2 ounce weight reduction. Strip the slide bare and determine its volume and mass. From there it's simple math to determine how much of the slide needs to be removed. I wouldn't be to concerned about adding some front serrations that match other Glocks out there, however I have no idea if that'd be close to 2 ounces . How far back on the slide, how deep, and how wide the serrations are variables you'd have to work out. I'm sure I could figure it in under half an hour if I was at all interested. Of course you'd need a gun in hand to figure all that out...

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Old January 5, 2019, 11:27 AM   #14
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Here is a precut slide that has alot take out for fairly cheap and fits the glock .40 23:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rock-Slide-...8AAOSwvkZbmFft

I found many more windowed slides for the 19 on fleabay than the 23.

By the way, here is an excellent video on the Krytos slide for the glock 19 by Scootch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5ErapMeIgQ

They state a 5 ounce weight savings in the slide!
No change in reliability with the stock recoil spring.
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Old January 5, 2019, 03:24 PM   #15
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I did some math, comparing the stated weight of their titanium slide and the weight of my stock G19 gen 4 slide (subtracting internals)... I come up with a 5.23oz weight savings for a G19 Titanium slide over OEM.

I found a post online that suggests that Krytos might be coming out with a G26 and 34 titanium slide, but nothing about slides for other calibers than 9mm.

Ive got a 6 inch 960Rowland Barrel for my G19... last time I chrono'd it, I was only getting about 1200fps for the 147gr HC... well below the advertised 1400fps. If I truly could get 1400+ out of my 6 inch 960R, then one of these Titanium slides would look really attractive. That would be putting out enough velocity, energy and KPS score to be comparable to a hot G27 40, 357 sig, or even mid range 10mm out of a g29. All in a package that weighs 26-27 ounces loaded (instead of the a g29 at 35-36oz loaded).

However, my math also told me, that if just comparing stock barrel lengths, I am better off with a SigP365 with the 12rd mag... possibly shave off a half ounce or an ounce with some slide cuts... but that would be about 24-25oz loaded (and with similar options... I always add in the extras I know I use, like TLR6 laser light, technaclip, 12 bullets, etc).
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Old January 5, 2019, 03:50 PM   #16
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I chronographed the BB outdoorsman +P 9mm out of my glock 19 and got 1070 fps for 363 fpe. Couldn't find any hotter HC for woods carry for 9mm than that.
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Old January 5, 2019, 05:27 PM   #17
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960 Rowland is a conversion that can be made to 9mm barrels. Reams out about an 1/8th of an inch of chamber to accept the slightly longer cartridges. Using 147gr hard casts, and the ammo from 460 Rowland.com, I was getting a bit over 1200fps. I was getting about 1150 out of the same 6 inch extended G19 barrel (lone wolf) with the Buffalo Bore stuff. So, it is an improvement, but not by a ton like I had hoped. But to be fair, the folks at 460R emailed me that they are going to be checking with their loader to see if there is a reason they are so anemic. They still believe I should be getting 1400fps...
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Old January 5, 2019, 10:15 PM   #18
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A lightened slide on a 9mm pistol in combination with a 960 Rowland conversion could be an "interesting" combination. And not in the good sense of "interesting".

I would recommend talking to Rowland about the advisability of such a course of action before spending too much money on it.

The Glock action (and other similar locked breech recoil operated pistol actions) balances slide/barrel momentum with bullet momentum. A high-velocity, heavy bullet load will increase bullet momentum significantly. That, in turn, combined with a lightened slide will increase slide velocity two ways. Higher momentum imparted by the heavier & faster bullet and less slide/barrel mass on the other side of the equation.

Most guns work best (and last best) in a fairly narrow range of slide velocities. Too low and malfunctions become an issue. Too high can cause both malfunctions and a significant decrease in service life--even potentially dangerous situations.
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Old January 7, 2019, 11:41 AM   #19
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If you cut the slide that much, you will increase slide velocity causing increased wear and decreased reliability. It changes the timing. You would need to add a comp/and or heavier recoil and mag springs which kinda offsets the benefit.

That being said....... I carry a fullsize Glock.... A few ounce? Cut out Latte......

As far as the 960 Rowland and 147 grain bullets.

https://www.underwoodammo.com/collec...=7865900924985
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Old January 7, 2019, 10:30 PM   #20
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Well, in regards to the slide velocity and whether a glock could take it... Ive shot my GEN4 MOS 19 with my 6 inch lone wolf 960R barrel. The felt recoil between the 960R stuff and buffalo bore 147g hard casts was minuscule at best. If a pistol can take the underwood or BB +p+ stuff, then it aught to be able to handle 960R IMHO which at best is only another 100FPS.

I would also consider that the folks at 460Rowland don't have a problem with reaming out barrels for the G26 to my knowledge, and that is already an ounce or two lighter than the g19. Then consider that the G32 and G33 are pushing a 357SIG bullet at more than 960R velocities, and doing so with the same slide weight as the G19 and G26. So, IMHO, these pistols are way over engineered (since the same slide weight is used for 9mm, 357 Sig, and 40S&W), and I am thinking that Im unlikely to be able to take off enough weight in these more modest calibers, that it could make a catastrophic difference (at least not that couldn't be mitigated by a heavier spring to slow down the slide) Might be a different story with the 10mm though... and I would like to hear any real anecdotal evidence from anyone who has dramatically lightened a G29 slide...

In my conversations with 460R, they seem to care a lot more about the structure of the barrel than the type of frame or slide you use when it comes to the 960R conversions.

Anyone have any experience to the contrary?
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Old January 7, 2019, 11:18 PM   #21
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Quote:
I would also consider that the folks at 460Rowland don't have a problem with reaming out barrels for the G26 to my knowledge...
According to their website they only offer the conversion on "medium to full size" 9mm pistols.
Quote:
So, IMHO, these pistols are way over engineered...
I would agree that they're over-engineered for 9mm as they come from the factory. That doesn't necessarily mean that you can get away with running them with lighter slides and hotter than typical +P+ ammo though. Like I said, it would be worthwhile to talk to Rowland about your plans. Maybe they will tell you it's not a problem.
Quote:
...I am thinking that Im unlikely to be able to take off enough weight in these more modest calibers, that it could make a catastrophic difference (at least not that couldn't be mitigated by a heavier spring to slow down the slide...
Well, you can think, or you can ask the folks who developed the conversion what they think, and what they have found with their experimentation during the development process. It's not like they're going to charge you for the advice so you really have nothing to lose.

By the way, slide velocity during rearward travel is affected a surprisingly small amount by recoil spring weight. Here's an interesting article on the topic.

http://www.shootingtimes.com/editori...-timing/99604#
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Old January 8, 2019, 06:09 PM   #22
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As I have indicated, I have had quite a bit of interaction with the folks over at 460R. Unfortunately, I don't believe they have put in the same level of thought and testing into the 960R that went into the original 460R. Just my impression. I believe a lot went into their "rowlandator" mod to compensate the slide speed with the G30... but that level of detail seems to be lacking in the recent 960R. By the way, there is nothing particularly special about a "conversion" it is just the barrel reemed out the extra fraction of an inch to accommodate their longer case. With some offerings, they recommend the use of a heavier spring. But the rowland folks are first to admit that the only real reason they made the case length different, was not for the extra case capacity, but to keep yahoos from inadvertently loading the hotter round in a barrel that lacked the wall thickness they believed necessary for safety. To my understanding (I haven't reloaded either 9mm or 45acp to these levels) the 460r and 960r loadings/velocity can be achieved with by handloaders willing to push the envelope to its max.
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Old January 8, 2019, 06:48 PM   #23
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The factory 960 Rowland ammo was reviewed shortly after it was introduced. The 147 grain ammo fell short of published speed.
https://www.firearmsnews.com/editori...-review/77904#

Handloading can get you closer to published ballistics if the proper precautions are taken.
http://www.shootingtimes.com/editori...-rowland/99387

The original 960 Rowland conversions had a compensator, which effectively slowed down the slide. I see now they have dropped that and just ream the chamber for the 960 (9X23 Winchester case).
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Old January 8, 2019, 06:59 PM   #24
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For true speed in a 9mm one could shoot 9 Major.

But you'd need to make sure your gun and barrel are up to required standards or bad things could happen.
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Old January 9, 2019, 01:29 AM   #25
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great articles. I had not found those in my own searches. Thank you
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