"Don't use Federal primers with Lee......"

dds51968 · March 25, 2015, 06:19 PM

I remember reading that you should not use Federal primers according to Lee, if you do, buy a blast shield they said. I thought it was silly that a major manufacturer like Federal would make a product that wasn't mostly universally usable amongst reloading equipment.

How wrong I was.

I Noticed this the other night on my LCT. I loaded and shot the first 100 a couple of weeks ago without a problem, never looked at them during loading. I forget why, but I looked at the bottom of one, and what the? ran through my head, inspected many others, all the same way.

After seeing this, no more Federals on my press, the remaining 1,500 will be sold to a Buddy with a LNL.

wild willy · March 25, 2015, 06:33 PM

I think you need to take a look at the end of your priming rod.

dds51968 · March 25, 2015, 06:49 PM

It is as it should be.

I'd say those aren't marks from something pressing into it, I believe they're the primer buckling.

CCI primers are unremarkable, I guess it's the soft primer cup that people speak of with Federal that makes them not suitable for the Lee design.

David

res45 · March 25, 2015, 07:07 PM

Well maybe it's just me but for more years than I can remember I've used Federal primers with Lee equipment and never had a problem. In fact I just primed 100 pieces of 9 x 18 brass with Federal primers and my 20+ year old Lee hand priming tool.

I've used Federal and every other brand of primer with everyone's priming equipment and never set a primer off even to the point of mashing some of them sideways in the primer pocket.

Seems I recall many years ago there was some riff going on between Lee,Federal and Speer regarding some of Lee's reloading equipment like the priming tools setting off primers and factory crimp die crushing bullets to the point it damaged the bullet jacket and caused accuracy problems or jacket separation but to this day I have yet to experience any of those issues.

I like federal primers especially for my handguns that have light hammer springs and I've never gotten a primer that looks like that after seating using Lee or anyone's priming system.

dds51968 · March 25, 2015, 07:41 PM

I liked them too, they seated easier than CCI, and they all went bang. As I stated earlier, all the CCI primers that ive used are perfect.

Not really sure of the why of this, I'm just not comfortable using these.

Wreck-n-Crew · March 25, 2015, 07:59 PM

It's Winchester, not federal primers that require a blast shield because they are so soft. The only 3 primers I have ever ignited during loading were all Winchester and 2 within a week.

Actually the shield is required for any primer other than CCI or Federal if my memory is working good today.

A pause for the COZ · March 25, 2015, 08:01 PM

Federal primers have a softer cup. You need to take that into account if your going to use them.

Most dont, they just move to CCI or some other harder cupped primer.
Unfortunately for me, Or fortunately depending on how you want the look at it.

I have a few S&W target revolvers that have lighter springs and require a softer primer. Also one of my .380 pistols likes them best.
Federals fit the bill and always go bang as they should.

I prime off the press any way, so its not a Huge issue for me.
I do use a RCBS APS strip primer or a LEE Auto Prime 2 that has a conversion to allow Federal primers to be used safely.

For the lee, I added the RCBS primer guides to the shell holder. This keeps every thing nice and strait. Other wise they can tip off the post and get wedged along the side and squished. No wonder they did not like Federal primers.
Works 100% with the mod, so I guess it was not the primers fault.

Still wear eye protection though. We are in fact playing around with things that do go BANG!!

reynolds357 · March 25, 2015, 08:04 PM

Federal is the premier primer. Lee is the bottom of the barrel reloading tool maker. Who has the problem? Not Federal.

the led farmer · March 25, 2015, 08:14 PM

Quote:

I Noticed this the other night on my LCT

the lee primer warning only pertains to the original Auto-Prime, Auto-Prime II, Pro1000 and Load-Master. The LCT uses the Safety Prime system so if your primers are coming out mangled i would look at the primer cup on your press, and not necessarily the primers.

here is everything everyone needs to know about lee gear and primers: Lee Primer Warning

McCarthy · March 25, 2015, 08:29 PM

That's just one reason why LEE isn't for me.

A pause for the COZ · March 25, 2015, 08:57 PM

Should not just discount any product. If you do your missing out on some good stuff.
I would say 85% of my reloading equipment is LEE and am super happy with it.

I had a Rock Chucker for years, Decided to try the Classic cast single stage.
Rock Chucker got sold post haste.

That Auto Prime 2 I show in above post. With the Mod I have added. It is with out any compare. The best priming tool I have ever used. Period... And I have used them all.

LEE is starting to come around, esp with their Classic series of equipment.

They have always had the best ideas, Just not the best processes to turn those ideas into what they could be.
They are still doing that. You can get some nice equipment if your willing to tinker to make it better.

But with the success of their classic cast series of tools. They may have found out they have a market for the next step up in quality.
This is a good example:
http://www.titanreloading.com/powder...powder-measure

The early adopters I have talked to state it is with out a doubt the best powder measure they have ever used.

I am waiting for this one:

http://www.titanreloading.com/powder...powder-measure

RCBS and Lyman have been sitting on their butts for 20 years. Now maybe even they will update to some good ideas.

reynolds357 · March 25, 2015, 08:59 PM

I keep trying Lee. I keep getting consistently disappointed.

dds51968 · March 25, 2015, 09:19 PM

Quick follow up:

Just loaded 100 more and every single one is fine?

What if? I know this is a bit out there.

An employee put spent primers in a couple of the packages and took the good ones. Federal primers are sitting on their side in the package, so it's not readily visible. I purchased 4 bricks of CCI from a different store and when I got home to put them away, one brick had 5 packs missing. They thought possibly a customer may have lifted them as they do not sell by the 100.

So, weird things do happen.

I'll be going to my club on Sunday, so we'll see if they go bang or not.

Very strange

teeroux · March 25, 2015, 09:25 PM

I've used Federal in my Loadmaster without any issue. Other than an occasional sideways primer.

I have never had a primer detonate on either of my Lee presses with any brand primer. I never had one look like the picture either.

I will say this though. I do think the Federal uses a more sensitive compound. Why else would they package the primers in that large plastic case. The Federal primers are spread farther apart in its packaging than any of the other brands.

KEYBEAR · March 25, 2015, 09:35 PM

I use what ever the Rifles like best sometimes it is Federal . I have a bunch of Federal Primers and like them a lot never a problem . Yes they are soft and need to be handled with care as any primer should be .

the led farmer · March 25, 2015, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teeroux

I've used Federal in my Loadmaster without any issue...

And I'll bet 99.99% of the time nobody else has or will have a problem, just that .01% person who screwed the pooch and blew up his hand and sued Lee, so Lee placed a warning out.

Lee precision rocks, genius in its simplicity.

passtime · March 25, 2015, 09:44 PM

+ 1 on that A pause for the COZ. Me To.

Quote: " I am waiting for this one "

http://www.titanreloading.com/powder...powder-measure

KEYBEAR · March 25, 2015, 09:50 PM

I have bought very little that has the name LEE on it . But I know guys that it is all they buy . I have the LEE primer thingy that goes on top of the press and it is ok . Loading tools are an obsession for me I like good stuff .
I shot a lot of Trap over the years and LEE loaders just never could keep up . That is what great about this country you have a choice

F. Guffey · March 25, 2015, 10:21 PM

Quote:

here is everything everyone needs to know about lee gear and primers: Lee Primer Warning

Then there was that part where R. Lee wrote in his book he did not test Federal primers because they did not donate primers to be tested. I took Lee serious, seems the Federal primers are more powerful and more powerful is what I want.

I have no problem using Lee's auto primer as in the old one. I tried to bust a primer with one and finally gave up then started on a RCBS hand primer. Eventually I managed to mangle a primer enough to get one to bust off.

F. Guffey

axismatt · March 25, 2015, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Federal is the premier primer. Lee is the bottom of the barrel reloading tool maker. Who has the problem? Not Federal.

That's kind of a ding dong comment, considering the vast majority of innovation in reloading equipment was conducted by LEE. Sort of akin to saying GLOCK is nothing but Tupperware slop.

Back to the OP... adjust the priming arm so it doesn't press so hard when seating. I had a similar result when switching from Winchester to CCI or Federal... can't remember. But some are just a skosh taller, so when seating to the same depth, it seems as if they bottomed out and the face of the primer was depressed.

Honestly, and no offense, but you should never have run so many rounds without noticing and addressing the issue. But I assure you, it's not going to affect the usability of those rounds, and the remedy is simple.

FrankenMauser · March 26, 2015, 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dds51968

An employee put spent primers in a couple of the packages and took the good ones. Federal primers are sitting on their side in the package, so it's not readily visible.

No.
Those are not fired primers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dds51968

I'd say those aren't marks from something pressing into it, I believe they're the primer buckling.

No.

That's from debris on top of the primer ram. You probably had a flake of powder, some brass shavings, or a sprinkle from a jelly donut get loose and make its way into the primer cup.

Look at the nice radius around the edges. There's nothing wrong with the way that those primers were seated, except for the debris that was in the system.
Next time, make sure the process is happening correctly, while you're doing it ...not after the fact.

Greg Mercurio · March 26, 2015, 07:01 AM

OP: Pardon me for being a weenie, but if you can't diagnose the problem shown in the picture any better than this, you need to find a new hobby. Reloading is very clearly not for you.

schmellba99 · March 26, 2015, 12:21 PM

I don't use Federal primers, for no other reasons than A) they always seem to be significantly more expensive than every other brand and B) because I absolutely despise their packaging with every ounce of my being.

Seriously - their packaging is horrible. 2x the space for the same number of primers, and that stupid sideways packaging makes getting them aligned cup down a PITA.

sawdustdad · March 26, 2015, 12:34 PM

Quote:

That's from debris on top of the primer ram. You probably had a flake of powder, some brass shavings, or a sprinkle from a jelly donut get loose and make its way into the primer cup.

This is the reason. I've seen similar dents in primers mid-run while reloading, looked at the primer seating ram, there is a scrap of brass or lead, or, a jelly donut sprinkle..

Sevens · March 26, 2015, 01:09 PM

A JELLY DONUT?!

Sir, yes sir!

ARE YOU ALLOWED TO HAVE FOOD IN THE BARRACKS, PRIVATE?!

Sir, no sir!

ARE YOU ALLOWED TO EAT JELLY DONUTS, PRIVATE?!

Sir, no sir!

AND WHY IS THAT?!

Sir... because I'm too heavy, sir!

NO PYLE! BECAUSE YOU ARE A DISGUSTING FATBODY!

March 25, 2015, 07:07 PM	#4
res45 Senior Member Join Date: September 15, 2007 Location: NC Posts: 753	Well maybe it's just me but for more years than I can remember I've used Federal primers with Lee equipment and never had a problem. In fact I just primed 100 pieces of 9 x 18 brass with Federal primers and my 20+ year old Lee hand priming tool. I've used Federal and every other brand of primer with everyone's priming equipment and never set a primer off even to the point of mashing some of them sideways in the primer pocket. Seems I recall many years ago there was some riff going on between Lee,Federal and Speer regarding some of Lee's reloading equipment like the priming tools setting off primers and factory crimp die crushing bullets to the point it damaged the bullet jacket and caused accuracy problems or jacket separation but to this day I have yet to experience any of those issues. I like federal primers especially for my handguns that have light hammer springs and I've never gotten a primer that looks like that after seating using Lee or anyone's priming system. Last edited by res45; March 25, 2015 at 07:22 PM.

March 25, 2015, 07:59 PM	#6
Wreck-n-Crew Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,820	It's Winchester, not federal primers that require a blast shield because they are so soft. The only 3 primers I have ever ignited during loading were all Winchester and 2 within a week. Actually the shield is required for any primer other than CCI or Federal if my memory is working good today. __________________ If you ever have to use a firearm, *you don't get to pick the scenario!*

March 25, 2015, 08:01 PM	#7
A pause for the COZ Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 2012 Location: Braham, Minnesota Posts: 1,314	Federal primers have a softer cup. You need to take that into account if your going to use them. Most dont, they just move to CCI or some other harder cupped primer. Unfortunately for me, Or fortunately depending on how you want the look at it. I have a few S&W target revolvers that have lighter springs and require a softer primer. Also one of my .380 pistols likes them best. Federals fit the bill and always go bang as they should. I prime off the press any way, so its not a Huge issue for me. I do use a RCBS APS strip primer or a LEE Auto Prime 2 that has a conversion to allow Federal primers to be used safely. For the lee, I added the RCBS primer guides to the shell holder. This keeps every thing nice and strait. Other wise they can tip off the post and get wedged along the side and squished. No wonder they did not like Federal primers. Works 100% with the mod, so I guess it was not the primers fault. Still wear eye protection though. We are in fact playing around with things that do go BANG!! Last edited by A pause for the COZ; March 25, 2015 at 08:20 PM.

March 25, 2015, 09:19 PM	#13
dds51968 Member Join Date: May 4, 2009 Location: Loganville, GA Posts: 36	Quick follow up: Just loaded 100 more and every single one is fine? What if? I know this is a bit out there. An employee put spent primers in a couple of the packages and took the good ones. Federal primers are sitting on their side in the package, so it's not readily visible. I purchased 4 bricks of CCI from a different store and when I got home to put them away, one brick had 5 packs missing. They thought possibly a customer may have lifted them as they do not sell by the 100. So, weird things do happen. I'll be going to my club on Sunday, so we'll see if they go bang or not. Very strange Last edited by dds51968; March 25, 2015 at 09:25 PM.

March 26, 2015, 07:01 AM	#22
Greg Mercurio Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2010 Posts: 151	OP: Pardon me for being a weenie, but if you can't diagnose the problem shown in the picture any better than this, you need to find a new hobby. Reloading is very clearly not for you. __________________ Old guy and NRA Life Member

March 25, 2015, 06:33 PM	#2
wild willy Senior Member Join Date: March 8, 2006 Posts: 404	I think you need to take a look at the end of your priming rod.

March 25, 2015, 06:49 PM	#3
dds51968 Member Join Date: May 4, 2009 Location: Loganville, GA Posts: 36	It is as it should be. I'd say those aren't marks from something pressing into it, I believe they're the primer buckling. CCI primers are unremarkable, I guess it's the soft primer cup that people speak of with Federal that makes them not suitable for the Lee design. David

March 25, 2015, 07:41 PM	#5
dds51968 Member Join Date: May 4, 2009 Location: Loganville, GA Posts: 36	I liked them too, they seated easier than CCI, and they all went bang. As I stated earlier, all the CCI primers that ive used are perfect. Not really sure of the why of this, I'm just not comfortable using these.

March 25, 2015, 08:04 PM	#8
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	Federal is the premier primer. Lee is the bottom of the barrel reloading tool maker. Who has the problem? Not Federal.

March 25, 2015, 08:29 PM	#10
McCarthy Junior member Join Date: January 1, 2015 Posts: 312	That's just one reason why LEE isn't for me.

March 25, 2015, 08:57 PM	#11
A pause for the COZ Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 2012 Location: Braham, Minnesota Posts: 1,314	Should not just discount any product. If you do your missing out on some good stuff. I would say 85% of my reloading equipment is LEE and am super happy with it. I had a Rock Chucker for years, Decided to try the Classic cast single stage. Rock Chucker got sold post haste. That Auto Prime 2 I show in above post. With the Mod I have added. It is with out any compare. The best priming tool I have ever used. Period... And I have used them all. LEE is starting to come around, esp with their Classic series of equipment. They have always had the best ideas, Just not the best processes to turn those ideas into what they could be. They are still doing that. You can get some nice equipment if your willing to tinker to make it better. But with the success of their classic cast series of tools. They may have found out they have a market for the next step up in quality. This is a good example: http://www.titanreloading.com/powder...powder-measure The early adopters I have talked to state it is with out a doubt the best powder measure they have ever used. I am waiting for this one: http://www.titanreloading.com/powder...powder-measure RCBS and Lyman have been sitting on their butts for 20 years. Now maybe even they will update to some good ideas.

March 25, 2015, 08:59 PM	#12
reynolds357 Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Posts: 6,165	I keep trying Lee. I keep getting consistently disappointed.

March 25, 2015, 09:25 PM	#14
teeroux Senior Member Join Date: December 12, 2006 Posts: 1,512	I've used Federal in my Loadmaster without any issue. Other than an occasional sideways primer. I have never had a primer detonate on either of my Lee presses with any brand primer. I never had one look like the picture either. I will say this though. I do think the Federal uses a more sensitive compound. Why else would they package the primers in that large plastic case. The Federal primers are spread farther apart in its packaging than any of the other brands.

March 25, 2015, 09:35 PM	#15
KEYBEAR Senior Member Join Date: January 11, 2012 Location: Indiana Posts: 1,059	I use what ever the Rifles like best sometimes it is Federal . I have a bunch of Federal Primers and like them a lot never a problem . Yes they are soft and need to be handled with care as any primer should be .

March 25, 2015, 09:44 PM	#17
passtime Senior Member Join Date: August 15, 2013 Location: NC Posts: 237	+ 1 on that A pause for the COZ. Me To. Quote: " I am waiting for this one " http://www.titanreloading.com/powder...powder-measure

March 25, 2015, 09:50 PM	#18
KEYBEAR Senior Member Join Date: January 11, 2012 Location: Indiana Posts: 1,059	I have bought very little that has the name LEE on it . But I know guys that it is all they buy . I have the LEE primer thingy that goes on top of the press and it is ok . Loading tools are an obsession for me I like good stuff . I shot a lot of Trap over the years and LEE loaders just never could keep up . That is what great about this country you have a choice

March 26, 2015, 12:21 PM	#23
schmellba99 Senior Member Join Date: January 8, 2008 Posts: 803	I don't use Federal primers, for no other reasons than A) they always seem to be significantly more expensive than every other brand and B) because I absolutely despise their packaging with every ounce of my being. Seriously - their packaging is horrible. 2x the space for the same number of primers, and that stupid sideways packaging makes getting them aligned cup down a PITA.

March 26, 2015, 01:09 PM	#25
Sevens Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 11,756	A JELLY DONUT?! Sir, yes sir! ARE YOU ALLOWED TO HAVE FOOD IN THE BARRACKS, PRIVATE?! Sir, no sir! ARE YOU ALLOWED TO EAT JELLY DONUTS, PRIVATE?! Sir, no sir! AND WHY IS THAT?! Sir... because I'm too heavy, sir! NO PYLE! BECAUSE YOU ARE A DISGUSTING FATBODY! __________________ *Attention Brass rats and other reloaders:* I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.