Issues with crimp on colt 45

[jpalmer67]

So im new to reloading, ive run several blanks and a few 10 round batches. Im using mostly RCBS products, inlcuding steel RCBS dies. Im loading the 45 colt round (long colt) using remington brass, HSM 200 grain round nose flat point lead bullets with a tapered cannelure or groove to butt the brass to which makes a perfect OAL bullet.

I read a few notes about crimping that stated that an over crimp will create a buldge in the brass below the bullet, and that is what I have and makes me believe that I am over crimping.

I started by only crimping the brass so that it is straight or square (remove the bell) but that leave almost a gap between the bullet and the brass right at that groove built in the bullet. I know the brass should line up on that groove based on the OAL, and it looks good. you can feel the gap with your finger and it does not look like factory ammo.

So i started adding crimp so that it closes that gap and hugs the lead but when I do that it makes the buldge below the bullet show up more. Ive backed it down a bit so it is just at the minimum which almost matches the factory ammo but that buldge is there.

Now I also wonder if it is because the brass is sized smaller than the factory ammo. before sizing, the middle of the brass is 0.4740", after sizing it is 0.4700", and the factory ammo is 0.476 across the length of the bullet. After the bullet is seated, the brass at that point is 0.4735, real close to the factory ammo. So is it possible the dies are over sizing (making brass too small) and inserting a bullet makes the buldge, and a correct crimp just makes it more pronounced? Is this normal or acceptable?

Also if I put a heavier crimp on, it sounds more like a roll crimp than a taper crimp, and is more steep an angle than the factory ammo crimp. The dies do not specify whether it is a roll or taper, it sounds like it is actually both, ie a light crimp = taper crimp, a heavier crimp = roll crimp. But I thought these would be different dies.

[triumph666]

try buying a "lee factory crimp die" and use you bullet seating/roll crimp die to just seat the bullet.... back out the seating die but turn back in the seating adjustment knob to get your proper OAL....45lc can be a finicky round cuz most brass is sized for a larger dia bullet and really needs a factory crimp die especially if you are using 45 acp bullets which are 1-3 thousandths narrower.... and you may not be opening the case mouth enough prior to inserting lead after using powder/expander die

[twobit]

the above, plus try starline brass in the future. It seems to be the best brass to use.

[LDBennett]

Years ago cases were sized with the dies sets of that era so that the bullet almost dropped in and the crimp was the only thing keeping the bullet in the case. You could actually spin the bullet in the case. That was virtually NO case tension.

Through years of testing, die manufactures determined that accuracy got a lot better with increased case tension and started providing reloading die sets that gave lots of case tension. in fact, current die designs often over size the cases so that finished rounds exhibit a bulge from the base of the bullet and a waisting effect below the bullet. That is the current thinking on how reloading dies should work for best accuracy and virtually all pistol reloads often exhibit the waisting. Some brass is so thick it does not exhibit the waisting but most does and it is no problem at all.

LDBennett

[Sport45]

If they are old steel dies (not carbide) they may be sizing the case for a .454" bullet. Your bullets are probably .452" so you may be loosing some neck tension there.

If you have plenty of neck tension you may not need a crimp, as mentioned above. Load six in your revolver. Shoot five and then check the last one to see if the bullet is walking out of the case. (Check it after each shot and you'll avoid the chance of tying up the gun) If the bullets aren't trying to jump crimp, you're doing fine.

[Ozzieman]

One question. Are you getting a slight bulge at just the bottom of the bullet? This is normal.
When you run the case through the sizing die you will make the case smaller than the bullet. Belling the case makes it easier to start the bullet. When you seat the bullet into the case the case will stretch to the diameter of the bullet. This is normal. When you over crimp the case to the bullet you will get a bulge just below the crimp or several bulges along the case.
When I load with lead almost all cases have this same bulge at the bottom of the bullet.
It’s a little hard to see the bulge in this photo but the arrow shows it.
This is a 44 mag with a 240 Gr semi wad cutter and I use a very firm crimp.
If this is what you are seeing then it’s normal. Also if it will fit in the chamber of the gun then you’re all right.
I have never seen a 45 LC with a taper crimp, only roll crimp which is the correct crimp for revolvers. Taper crimp is great for autos since the case seats in the gun on the edge of the case mouth.
One other thing to try is to seat a bullet into the case without crimping. If you still see the bulge then it’s the bullet and not the crimp.

[zippy13]

I started by only crimping the brass so that it is straight or square (remove the bell) but that leave almost a gap between the bullet and the brass right at that groove built in the bullet.

As LDBennett noted, the .45 Colt used to be larger than it is today, and the different die makers may use different approaches on their dies when it comes to the expander. If there is a gap between the bullet and the case, you may be over expanding, have you measured your expander die? If it exceeds your bullet diameter, then you are expecting too much from your crimper, and need a smaller expander.

[Stargazer]

I second the Lee Factory Crimp die. It also has in it a carbide ring that "post" sizes the case after the bullet is seated and crimped. It "irons" out the bulges on the down stroke of the ram so they are sized correctly for the cylinder/chamber.