Pasco Washington Police Officer Involved Death of Suspect

hartcreek · February 12, 2015, 05:45 AM

This just happened yesterday and it was on the local news tonight. Mods feel free to move it to where it may fit better. I picked here because from what I see in the video it shows lack of training by three police officers. We have officers and corrections staff here so it is important for you guys to take a look and comment.

The deceased was evidently throwing rocks but at who is not certain. The officers evidently attempted to tazer the man but that failed. I don't know if it was do to drug use by the deceased or incompitence of the officer with the tazer but what I can not see is how three officers could not handle one individual rocks or no rocks that did not posess a firearm or knife.

There are multiple Utube links so to make it the easiest I will post the search link and then you can go through the series of angles and tell what you see.

I want active and retired officers to comment especially as you have probably been in this kind of situation and what I see in the video makes no sence.

https://www.youtube.com/results?sear...shot+by+police

http://www.nbcrightnow.com/story/280...lved-shooting#

mete · February 12, 2015, 07:47 AM

Tazers are not always effective.
Rocks are not toys they can be lethal ! If you don't believe that then contact ISIS !
Immediately after the shots you see the curious wandering around the scene.
Darwinism at work !

FireForged · February 12, 2015, 05:39 PM

I have no idea what size these "stones" are but if they are large enough to cause significant injury and the badguy has already demonstrated that he is willing to hurl them at officers, I am not sure I would expect them to just run head long into that. I will reserve personal judgment until all the facts are made public.

KNDO23 news has a interesting "Updated" video which includes a witness account.

oldandslow · February 12, 2015, 09:54 PM

hc,

I used to work in a third world country where the weapons of choice were rocks. I saw many people injured- some with permanent neurologic damage, from being hit by rocks. I think the moral of the story is- don't try to injure or kill cops or you may get shot (justifiably), no matter what weapon you are using.

best wishes- oldandslow

hartcreek · February 12, 2015, 11:16 PM

I have been on the recieving end of rocks and it was the smaller rocks that could do more damage. The softball sized rocks simply have to much weight for most people to throw with any authority. What I see going on in the video looks odd to me. Sure the tazer did not work but pepperspray would have and what looks to me is a situation that would have been easy enough to resolve by using another form of non lethal deterant now has turned into a real mess.

There have been officer involved shootings of fools pointing airsofts at officers and those incidents I agree that the outcome should be the idiot being shot. This is why I asked for officers to look at this and for them to comment. I do private security and carry pepperspray and a pepper grenade just so this kind of situation will not occur because a taser is to easy to miss with.

Snyper · February 12, 2015, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Sure the tazer did not work but pepperspray would have and what looks to me is a situation that would have been easy enough to resolve by using another form of non lethal deterant now has turned into a real mess.

It's easy to sit at home behind a keyboard and second guess what happens on the street

g.willikers · February 13, 2015, 12:00 AM

Rocks can, indeed, be used as a weapon.
The ancient Romans, among others, had squads of slingers who used rocks effectively in battle.
And let's not forget the most famous rock slinger of all - David, who slew Goliath with a well placed shot to the head.

Buzzcook · February 13, 2015, 12:40 AM

Quote:

It's easy to sit at home behind a keyboard and second guess what happens on the street

This site too frequently tends to apologia for the police. Second guessing goes both ways, both for and against.

In the last couple years there has been too much police on citizen violence for the police to retain the presumption that they acted properly.

jrobin3360 · February 13, 2015, 02:36 AM

Found a couple of videos here:
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/02/v...g-to-run-away/

In the video of the actual shooting, it's kind of hard to tell EXACTLY what is happening before the shooting started, then you see what is probably the suspect running across the street, then the rest is blocked by cars in a parking lot. When the shooting ends is when the cameraman moves to a location where the suspect is down & officers gather.
Second video is of eye witnesses comments.

I'm not a LEO and I don't know if the LEO's involved acted improperly or not.
Eye witness statements aren't exactly "foolproof" evidence, as we all know from the Ferguson incidents.
Yes, rocks can be deadly weapons. Maybe lives were endangered by the person throwing the rocks & the police reacted as their training dictated.
Maybe the overstepped their training & fired when they shouldn't.
I'm pretty sure all of the facts aren't in yet & to me, the video isn't clear enough to make clear what actually happened.

Snyper · February 13, 2015, 03:28 AM

Quote:

In the last couple years there has been too much police on citizen violence for the police to retain the presumption that they acted properly.

Guilty until proven innocent now?

Reality is there are over 750,000 LEO's in the country, and a minute percentage sometimes do things wrong. The vast majority are good people

The constant police bashing is no different than blaming all gun owners when there's a random shooting.

Quote:

Second guessing goes both ways, both for and against.

Yes, and it's a foolish thing to do either way.
It certainly has nothing to do with "Tactics and Training"

jrobin3360 · February 13, 2015, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Posted by Snyper: Guilty until proven innocent now?

If you listen to some of the "eyewitness" comments, ABSOLUTELY.
If the media, Al & Jesse all get their heads together on this, WITHOUT A DOUBT.
When it comes to cops trying to do their duty & uphold the law vs low information voters, Obama supporters, liberal bleeding hearts & all of the "victims" our nation has created (all with smartphones, looking for cops to do something THEY don't like), Then by all means....YES!!! GUILTY!!! NO DUE PROCESS NEEDED!!! SCREW THE COURTS, GET A ROPE!!!

Just saying.

**Frank Ettin** · February 13, 2015, 06:29 AM

Don't see what all this has to do with Tactics and Training.

February 12, 2015, 05:45 AM	#1
hartcreek Junior member Join Date: April 22, 2014 Location: Washington Posts: 1,549	Pasco Washington Police Officer Involved Death of Suspect This just happened yesterday and it was on the local news tonight. Mods feel free to move it to where it may fit better. I picked here because from what I see in the video it shows lack of training by three police officers. We have officers and corrections staff here so it is important for you guys to take a look and comment. The deceased was evidently throwing rocks but at who is not certain. The officers evidently attempted to tazer the man but that failed. I don't know if it was do to drug use by the deceased or incompitence of the officer with the tazer but what I can not see is how three officers could not handle one individual rocks or no rocks that did not posess a firearm or knife. There are multiple Utube links so to make it the easiest I will post the search link and then you can go through the series of angles and tell what you see. I want active and retired officers to comment especially as you have probably been in this kind of situation and what I see in the video makes no sence. https://www.youtube.com/results?sear...shot+by+police http://www.nbcrightnow.com/story/280...lved-shooting# Last edited by hartcreek; February 12, 2015 at 11:21 PM.

February 12, 2015, 07:47 AM	#2
mete Senior Member Join Date: June 14, 2004 Location: NY State Posts: 6,575	Tazers are not always effective. Rocks are not toys they can be lethal ! If you don't believe that then contact ISIS ! Immediately after the shots you see the curious wandering around the scene. Darwinism at work ! __________________ And Watson , bring your revolver !

February 12, 2015, 05:39 PM	#3
FireForged Senior Member Join Date: November 4, 1999 Location: Rebel South USA Posts: 2,074	I have no idea what size these "stones" are but if they are large enough to cause significant injury and the badguy has already demonstrated that he is willing to hurl them at officers, I am not sure I would expect them to just run head long into that. I will reserve personal judgment until all the facts are made public. KNDO23 news has a interesting "Updated" video which includes a witness account. __________________ Life is a web woven by necessity and chance... Last edited by FireForged; February 12, 2015 at 05:51 PM.

February 13, 2015, 12:00 AM	#7
g.willikers Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2008 Posts: 10,442	Rocks can, indeed, be used as a weapon. The ancient Romans, among others, had squads of slingers who used rocks effectively in battle. And let's not forget the most famous rock slinger of all - David, who slew Goliath with a well placed shot to the head. __________________ Walt Kelly, alias Pogo, sez: “Don't take life so serious, son, it ain't nohow permanent.”

February 13, 2015, 06:29 AM	#12
Frank Ettin Staff Join Date: November 23, 2005 Location: California - San Francisco Posts: 9,471	Don't see what all this has to do with Tactics and Training. __________________ "It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper

February 12, 2015, 09:54 PM	#4
oldandslow Senior Member Join Date: October 2, 2007 Posts: 641	hc, I used to work in a third world country where the weapons of choice were rocks. I saw many people injured- some with permanent neurologic damage, from being hit by rocks. I think the moral of the story is- don't try to injure or kill cops or you may get shot (justifiably), no matter what weapon you are using. best wishes- oldandslow

February 12, 2015, 11:16 PM	#5
hartcreek Junior member Join Date: April 22, 2014 Location: Washington Posts: 1,549	I have been on the recieving end of rocks and it was the smaller rocks that could do more damage. The softball sized rocks simply have to much weight for most people to throw with any authority. What I see going on in the video looks odd to me. Sure the tazer did not work but pepperspray would have and what looks to me is a situation that would have been easy enough to resolve by using another form of non lethal deterant now has turned into a real mess. There have been officer involved shootings of fools pointing airsofts at officers and those incidents I agree that the outcome should be the idiot being shot. This is why I asked for officers to look at this and for them to comment. I do private security and carry pepperspray and a pepper grenade just so this kind of situation will not occur because a taser is to easy to miss with.

February 13, 2015, 02:36 AM	#9
jrobin3360 Senior Member Join Date: June 30, 2013 Location: Kentucky, near Ft Knox Posts: 153	Found a couple of videos here: http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/02/v...g-to-run-away/ In the video of the actual shooting, it's kind of hard to tell EXACTLY what is happening before the shooting started, then you see what is probably the suspect running across the street, then the rest is blocked by cars in a parking lot. When the shooting ends is when the cameraman moves to a location where the suspect is down & officers gather. Second video is of eye witnesses comments. I'm not a LEO and I don't know if the LEO's involved acted improperly or not. Eye witness statements aren't exactly "foolproof" evidence, as we all know from the Ferguson incidents. Yes, rocks can be deadly weapons. Maybe lives were endangered by the person throwing the rocks & the police reacted as their training dictated. Maybe the overstepped their training & fired when they shouldn't. I'm pretty sure all of the facts aren't in yet & to me, the video isn't clear enough to make clear what actually happened.