Ammo and fire - Page 2

T. O'Heir · March 30, 2018, 11:50 AM

"...going off hitting everything..." Nope. When ammo cooks off in a fire, the bullet doesn't have much velocity. The bullet usually goes nowhere. Scary as all get out if one goes off near you, but it's not particularly dangerous.
Firefighters are more concerned with elderly CRT TV's and computer monitors than they are with ammunition.
Chicago Fire is a TV show. Nothing in TV shows or movies is remotely real. Even the sound of a gun shot is added in editing. TV people don't think real gun shots or blanks sound real enough.

dano1200r · March 30, 2018, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ricklin

Thanks for that, had not considered it. Yes, firefighters, I shall correct that in my vocabulary.

No problem, do it while you load your clips.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

Reloadron · April 3, 2018, 05:46 PM

I liked the reply by Kozak6 the SAAMI video is informative.

Quote:

Here we go, folks. Got 25 minutes?

SAAMI on ammo fires:
https://youtu.be/3SlOXowwC4c

Very low velocities are generated by unconfined ammo, so standard turnout gear is enough to protect firefighters at a reasonable working distance.

And then a little bit of water just shuts the fire right down. It's amazing.

Another link to the video.

My biggest nightmare would be chambered rounds in loaded guns in a fire. That and as mentioned those nasty little primers zipping around.

Ron

LilPewPew · April 3, 2018, 06:26 PM

It will simply just blow up the case and send the bullet a few feet and the most danger would be the metal case popping an eye out if you're close enough without eye pro... But they're firemen so they wear masks, therefore, they had nothing to worry about.

Dusty Rivers · April 8, 2018, 06:21 PM

Firefighters: If you don't want the firefighters to back off and not save your house, what is the approved firefighter method of storing ammo that would still allow you to enter a house and put out a fire? PS: you dudes and dudetts are some brave people! Thanks for all you do!

FrankenMauser · April 8, 2018, 11:08 PM

If they hear it popping, they're not going in.

So the best storage method is in a separate structure from the main living quarters.

thallub · April 9, 2018, 08:25 AM

i spent 50 years doing EOD type stuff including a career in US Army EOD. Have burned hundreds of millions, maybe a billion or two, of small arms rounds. When burned in the open, bullets and fragments of cartridge cases are seldom projected more than 20-30 feet.

12.7mm and 14.5mm cartridges with steel cases are dangerous when burned. But few folks have that ammo.

FAS1 · April 9, 2018, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reloadron

My biggest nightmare would be chambered rounds in loaded guns in a fire.
Ron

I have been asked this many times since keeping a loaded gun available in your home is what I help with.

Most handguns with a defensive round chambered will not penetrate 7GA (3/16") steel plate. Thinner steel could be an issue

Reloadron · April 9, 2018, 03:35 PM

Thanks for passing that along.

Ron

briandg · April 11, 2018, 04:48 PM

the army prepared documents regarding fire at a storage facility. the recommendations, iirc, protect other buildings from fire only if possible. get personnel several hundred yards away or behind a minimum four inch concrete barrier about 100 yards away. the army was discussing many tons of ammo in concrete walls of varying calibers. .50 explosive rounds are not to be taken lightly at short ranges. the general plan was let it take care of itself and be far enough away to keep debris from landing on people.

LogicMan · April 12, 2018, 01:05 AM

Good to know to alert firefighters about stored ammo, if a fire broke out where I live, I am not even sure I would think to do that (until now). So basically if you've got like 10, 20, 30,000 or so rounds stored inside, you should basically expect the firefighters to just let the place burn down?

briandg · April 12, 2018, 09:51 AM

Sometimes they will.

Lohman446 · April 12, 2018, 10:47 AM

Better to have them back off and have the well-insured structure be a total loss than to have it be salvageable anyways.

I'm with others. Without a chamber or a barrel this is a non-issue. MAYBE a semi-auto could cook off ammo without sustaining enough damage to not cycle but I doubt that. The local fire-chief, who I have asked about this in the past, seemed unconcerned about it actually be an issue.

Around here if the policy were to not attempt to stop a fire because of a concern of ammo most houses would be allowed to burn. Most people, around here at least, have at least some ammunition stored in the house.

I would be more concerned about cans of certain cleaning products and other pressurized cans. In my dumber days I have watched these exit fires at high rates of speeds

briandg · April 12, 2018, 04:13 PM

Any semiautomatic would fail so fire repeat rounds. Handguns would limp wrist. Rifles would almost certainly have have several rounds cook off in the magazine before the chamber would. For that matter, rifles are usually stored upright and maybe only one in six will be loaded, on average. The probability of a gun going off and accidentally hitting and injuring a firefighter is pretty low,I believe. It would probably go completely unnoticed.

Some people remain seriously concerned about powder or ammo. Consider this. A house is engulfed in flame containers are non explosive. Will even 20 pounds of powder do much during a complete burn? It doesn't burn hot, or explode. It can start a fire, but if there is a big one already going, 1,000 degrees, heavy flames, it's going to be a burp. I think that people should set sprinklers over their bench.

March 30, 2018, 11:50 AM	#26
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...going off hitting everything..." Nope. When ammo cooks off in a fire, the bullet doesn't have much velocity. The bullet usually goes nowhere. Scary as all get out if one goes off near you, but it's not particularly dangerous. Firefighters are more concerned with elderly CRT TV's and computer monitors than they are with ammunition. Chicago Fire is a TV show. Nothing in TV shows or movies is remotely real. Even the sound of a gun shot is added in editing. TV people don't think real gun shots or blanks sound real enough. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

April 8, 2018, 06:21 PM	#30
Dusty Rivers Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2008 Posts: 235	so how firefighters? Firefighters: If you don't want the firefighters to back off and not save your house, what is the approved firefighter method of storing ammo that would still allow you to enter a house and put out a fire? PS: *you dudes and dudetts are some brave people! Thanks for all you do!* __________________ Dusty: I'm kind of a big deal! Rob Pincus follower PDN NRA Lifetime Member, our only voice!

April 8, 2018, 11:08 PM	#31
FrankenMauser Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2008 Location: In the valley above the plain Posts: 13,424	If they hear it popping, they're not going in. So the best storage method is in a separate structure from the main living quarters. __________________ Don't even try it. It's even worse than the internet would lead you to believe.

April 11, 2018, 04:48 PM	#35
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	the army prepared documents regarding fire at a storage facility. the recommendations, iirc, protect other buildings from fire only if possible. get personnel several hundred yards away or behind a minimum four inch concrete barrier about 100 yards away. the army was discussing many tons of ammo in concrete walls of varying calibers. .50 explosive rounds are not to be taken lightly at short ranges. the general plan was let it take care of itself and be far enough away to keep debris from landing on people. __________________ None.

April 12, 2018, 01:05 AM	#36
LogicMan Senior Member Join Date: January 16, 2013 Posts: 280	Good to know to alert firefighters about stored ammo, if a fire broke out where I live, I am not even sure I would think to do that (until now). So basically if you've got like 10, 20, 30,000 or so rounds stored inside, you should basically expect the firefighters to just let the place burn down? Last edited by LogicMan; April 12, 2018 at 01:11 AM.

April 3, 2018, 06:26 PM	#29
LilPewPew Member Join Date: April 1, 2018 Posts: 42	It will simply just blow up the case and send the bullet a few feet and the most danger would be the metal case popping an eye out if you're close enough without eye pro... But they're firemen so they wear masks, therefore, they had nothing to worry about.

April 9, 2018, 08:25 AM	#32
thallub Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2007 Location: South Western OK Posts: 3,112	i spent 50 years doing EOD type stuff including a career in US Army EOD. Have burned hundreds of millions, maybe a billion or two, of small arms rounds. When burned in the open, bullets and fragments of cartridge cases are seldom projected more than 20-30 feet. 12.7mm and 14.5mm cartridges with steel cases are dangerous when burned. But few folks have that ammo.

April 9, 2018, 03:35 PM	#34
Reloadron Senior Member Join Date: June 8, 2016 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Suburbs Posts: 1,750	Thanks for passing that along. Ron

April 12, 2018, 09:51 AM	#37
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	Sometimes they will. __________________ None.

April 12, 2018, 10:47 AM	#38
Lohman446 Senior Member Join Date: April 22, 2016 Posts: 2,192	Better to have them back off and have the well-insured structure be a total loss than to have it be salvageable anyways. I'm with others. Without a chamber or a barrel this is a non-issue. MAYBE a semi-auto could cook off ammo without sustaining enough damage to not cycle but I doubt that. The local fire-chief, who I have asked about this in the past, seemed unconcerned about it actually be an issue. Around here if the policy were to not attempt to stop a fire because of a concern of ammo most houses would be allowed to burn. Most people, around here at least, have at least some ammunition stored in the house. I would be more concerned about cans of certain cleaning products and other pressurized cans. In my dumber days I have watched these exit fires at high rates of speeds

April 12, 2018, 04:13 PM	#39
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	Any semiautomatic would fail so fire repeat rounds. Handguns would limp wrist. Rifles would almost certainly have have several rounds cook off in the magazine before the chamber would. For that matter, rifles are usually stored upright and maybe only one in six will be loaded, on average. The probability of a gun going off and accidentally hitting and injuring a firefighter is pretty low,I believe. It would probably go completely unnoticed. Some people remain seriously concerned about powder or ammo. Consider this. A house is engulfed in flame containers are non explosive. Will even 20 pounds of powder do much during a complete burn? It doesn't burn hot, or explode. It can start a fire, but if there is a big one already going, 1,000 degrees, heavy flames, it's going to be a burp. I think that people should set sprinklers over their bench. __________________ None.