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Old July 26, 2018, 12:27 AM   #1
prof marvel
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a scam artist on armslist

Greetings Fellow Black Powder Fans -

if you want a laugh, check out this scam artist from missouri. he's had this ad up in various forms for over 8 months.

http://www.armslist.com/posts/787045...p--make-offer-

Remington and Sons 1858 Rifle, New Model. 44 Ball/Cap "Make Offer" $ 4,500

he started out posting it as an "original piece of the old west" and presented it as an original.

I emailed him several times to tell him that he had a beat-up italian replica,
and pointing out ALL the differences between an original and that replica.

when he ignored 3 direct emails I contacted armslist and told them if he kept it up
i'ld call missouri state A.G. and FBI for interstate antique fraud.

then he changed the listing to what you see now.

since it's still up, but with false references removed, I emailed him letting him know that I am posting on about a dozen BP forums so we can share the laugh.

yhs
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Old July 26, 2018, 07:05 AM   #2
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Did Remington make any of these in Italy?
If not it’s not a “Remington”.
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Old July 26, 2018, 12:00 PM   #3
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That's in Brushippie's back yard. He should go check it out, and laugh in person.
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Old July 26, 2018, 12:06 PM   #4
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There is a scam artist on ArmsList? Say it ain't so!

I'm card carryin' ArmsList hater.
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Old July 26, 2018, 12:08 PM   #5
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Armslist is ok if you do it right. Local only. Face to Face only. Be ready to shoot back.
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Old July 26, 2018, 09:00 PM   #6
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Instead of posting this on as many boards as you can -I saw the same posting on another board this morning so am assuming it was you - have YOU notified ArmsList and filed a complaint?

Ive known many "experts" in my 55 years of collecting who "thought" they had an antique . . . and we see it on here every once in a while in posts of "what is my antique gun" . . . when it turns out to be a marriage of parts or a report from the 1960's. I'm not defending the person who is listing the item . . I know nothing about him . . . but it's like any other thing that a person has up for sale . . . caveat emptor. Doesn't make any difference if it's a piece of "antique" furniture, a car or a gun.

IF you have filed a complaint with ArmsList and they don't want to remove it - that's their business as it's their site. With the price he has on it, it is going toilet it to serious collectors who will take one look at it and smile and walk away.

" I emailed him letting him know that I am posting on about a dozen BP forums so we can share the laugh." Really? IF this seller is attempting to defraud or mis-identify - that's on him. However, when a person posts on a "dozen" sites and says things about another - a d you have posted on all the sites you've posted this on that he is a "scam artist" - and you seem to think we all should share the "laugh" since you told him so - that's on you . . . and someday you'll do it to the wrong person and it's going to cost you. And once you've posted it, it's posted forever and easily retrieved.

As my Dad always said, "If you can't say something nice about someone, then don't say anything at all." Or, another of his sayings, "If it doesn't concern you, then it doesn't concern others."
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Old July 27, 2018, 12:07 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bedbugbilly View Post
...have YOU notified ArmsList and filed a complaint?
Have YOU read the OP's post?

Quote:
Originally Posted by prof marvel View Post
...when he ignored 3 direct emails I contacted armslist...
The OP was up-front enough to have contacted the listing owner directly by email to inform/confront them about the sketchy listing. The ignorance on the part of the person listing the item is just begging for a trolling if they're going to continue on with it. The person went from having an incorrect listing (whether intentional or not) to a misleading listing (likely intentional at this point). Shame on them.


On a different note:

Quote:
Originally Posted by bedbugbilly View Post
"If it doesn't concern you, then it doesn't concern others."
I disagree completely.
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Old July 27, 2018, 01:16 AM   #8
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My Good Unconventional -

thank you for pointing out the points that BedBug apparently missed!

My Dear BedBug, ( aka Geezer on castboolits ?)

I appreciate your concern and I believe you are writing with a good heart and out of
concern of possible backlash, and that you are not trying to defend a scammer and fraud .

I will repeat here, what I wrote to you on castboolits:
snip--------------------
My Dear Geezer -
I do not consider posting in about 6 other forums as "spamming".

what I consider "not cool" is a gun shop attempting to continue to commit fraud on the unsuspecting public after
I wrote to them in great detail 3 separate times.

there are many folk in the BP world who do not read the castboolits forums, thus I consider it my duty to inform others in the forums that I cherish of scalawags and scoundrels.

your milage may vary, and you are entitled to your own opinion.
endsnip-----------------------------

By the way, the seller is not just "some guy" but a brick and mortar gunshop!

I will further expound upon the subject, and address each of your concerns:

BedBug wrote:
>have YOU notified ArmsList and filed a complaint?

As Unconventional already pointed out to you, if you had read the post you will see that I first contacted the vendor 3 separate times.

To expand, Iwas pointing out the faults and differences between
his fake and a genuine antique. I was quite polite and patient the first two times, since
some folks can be easily fooled.

Then I notified Armslist more than once. Only After I mentioned telling the local authorities did anything happen.

Since you seem to think it's none of my business, I must disagree-

All it takes for bad guys to win is for good guys to remain silent.

When I find a questionable listing for sale, I always give them the benefit of the doubt,
explain to them in detail exactly what they actually have, with proof.

Then I offer the opportunity for them to correct themselves .
If they do not and blatantly continue , it is then a case of attempted criminal fraud.
On the Internet it is attempted fraud crossing state lines, and thus becomes of interest to both local authorities, the local State Attorney General, and the FBI Internet Crime unit.

I explain and expose them using facts and their own posts.

BedBug wrote:
>and someday you'll do it to the wrong person and it's going to cost you.
>And once you've posted it, it's posted forever and easily retrieved.

Why, thanks for your concern for my well being and the warning!
But I am acquainted with the legal aspects and if need be can resort to using the courts,
and I can and do refer to the state, local and federal agencies as required.


BedBug wrote:
>As my Dad always said, "If you can't say something nice about someone,
>then don't say anything at all." Or, another of his sayings,
>"If it doesn't concern you, then it doesn't concern others."

When Fraud is concerned, that sentiment goes out the window.
Expose the Fraud, Expose the Fraudster and alert the authorities.

The vendor has modified his listing so it is no longer criminal fraud, but only a bad joke.

Thus, I share the joke with others.

go in peace.
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Last edited by prof marvel; July 27, 2018 at 01:43 AM.
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Old July 27, 2018, 01:26 AM   #9
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As proof that the carbine in question cannot be considered authentic, here is a photo the vendor posted of the so-called "Remington Address" followed by a screen snap of an original
posted by rock island auctions, Note the obvious differences.

here is the link to the Rock Island Auctions listing
https://www.rockislandauction.com/de...revolvingrifle

I hope this is educational and helps other to avoid being taken in.
The more we can expose fakes, and illuminate the truth, the better it is for everyone.

yhs
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Attached Images
File Type: jpg fake-rem.jpg (22.7 KB, 39 views)
File Type: png rockislandremy.png (192.7 KB, 41 views)
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Last edited by prof marvel; July 27, 2018 at 01:32 AM.
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Old July 27, 2018, 08:37 AM   #10
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I for one am glad Prof Marvel exposed a fraud. Caveat Emptor.
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Old July 27, 2018, 10:29 AM   #11
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The armslist letters on the barrel are of a different font and look to be stamped individually. Some of the "o's" are crooked.
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