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Old April 8, 2021, 11:30 AM   #1
wizrd
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Best verbal instruction I ever got...anywhere

Over 30 years ago, when I got my first handguns, permit, etc. One of my first purchases were a couple of S & W revolvers, model 66. One 4" bbl. and one with a 6" bbl. -- Both were in like new, excellent condition. Sadly, and much to my frustration - my first few trips to the range with them were very disappointing, - my groups looked like I was patterning some #4 buck shot at 25 yards thru an open choked barrel. (we are talking shooting at 50' range here)
A call to my brother-in-law, an Army Ranger, assigned to a spec-ops unit, who was also a small arms instructor. His advice: - "You know the basics - handguns are not less accurate than long guns, - they're just more difficult to shoot at distances." - He said - "Start shooting at 7 foot distance, - when you're shooting one raggedy hole - move to 10 feet, - when you got one raggedy hole at 10 feet - move up to twelve feet, etc. increasing your distance while striving for that 'one hole' group. -- move your target 3 feet or so, every time you get that 1 hole group." -- Within a week and a half - one hole groups (in the X-ring) were the norm with those two revolvers. Moral of the story - learn your basics of pistolcraft - and PRACTICE!
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Old April 8, 2021, 12:10 PM   #2
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Best verbal instruction I ever got- “find the army marksmanship unit manual and download it”!
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Old April 8, 2021, 02:01 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stinkeypete View Post
Best verbal instruction I ever got- “find the army marksmanship unit manual and download it”!
RIFLE AND CARBINE

and..

Rifle marksmanship M16 -M4
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Old April 8, 2021, 05:32 PM   #4
Mike38
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- handguns are not less accurate than long guns, -
Well....I'm not so sure about that. But the rest of the advice is ok.
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Old April 8, 2021, 07:48 PM   #5
Shadow9mm
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Well....I'm not so sure about that. But the rest of the advice is ok.
I would say that can be equally accurate. However the user interface is not as good. you get 2 points of contact instead of 3. and if you are running irons the sight radius is generally much shorter. If you put a red dot or scope on a pistol I think it significantly improves the user interface as it eliminates the short sight radius issue, but it can require more training to use these systems effectively. they have more maintenance issues. and are bulkier.

Everything comes down to good fundamentals and practice in my mind. yes that is good advice. start closer up and get the fundamentals down. then start stretching it out and refining your skills.
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Old April 9, 2021, 01:29 PM   #6
stinkeypete
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https://www.lakeis.org/documents/arm...g%20manual.pdf

The pistol training guide. The next verbal instruction was "Squeeze the hell out of it, and squeeze tennis balls to increase your hand strength."

There is nothing inherently the firearm more accurate in making the barrel longer, so the pistol can be as accurate as the rifle. Unsupported, no way the pistol shooter is as accurate as the rifle shooter. The wobble zones are simply not comparable. No one shoots pistol at a thousand yards.
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Old April 9, 2021, 06:48 PM   #7
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handguns are not less accurate than long guns? yeah, ok.

Are talking handguns with 10"+ barrel length?
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Old April 10, 2021, 07:02 AM   #8
Carl the Floor Walker
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My Mentor and running coach would always say. "Frequent Moderate Training" (practice).
I took that advice and used it for shooting many decades ago. Two times a week at the Range were the norm. Not a whole lot of ammo spent, at each session. A lot of frequent short drawing and dry fire practice for about 5 min each day.
Two or three sessions of shooting Air guns in garage or back yard.
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Old April 11, 2021, 12:09 PM   #9
Mike38
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Results of testing from the web site bullseyepistol.com. "The .45acp out of a barrel test fixture using Bar-Sto barrels groups have consistently run between .975" to 1.5" at 50 yards." That's eliminating the loss in mechanical accuracy and shooter error. That's ~2 to 3 MOA. A $300 Walmart rifle will shoot better than 3 MOA.
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Old April 11, 2021, 06:01 PM   #10
stinkeypete
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My TT Olympia clone is more accurate than most 10/22's.
My Contender was fairly accurate but not as accurate as my sub-moa AR.

I bet one of the single shot remintons is as accurate as most anything.

Things like autoloading pistols or revolvers are another story.

When you talk about practical accuracy from the man/firearm system.. we all know what is more accurate when fired standing on two feet as god intended.
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Old April 11, 2021, 06:05 PM   #11
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I think we’re missing the forest for the trees here.


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Old April 12, 2021, 08:45 AM   #12
4V50 Gary
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I use the same technique of starting new shooters at shorter distances and then increasing the distance as their skill improves.

I agree that a handgun isn't any less accurate than a longarm. It is unsupported (unless there's a brace) and more difficult to hold steady. Longarms with iron sights have longer sight radius which allows the user to have more precise shot placement.

Some things I suggested to challenged shooters.

With the revolver loaded with snapcaps, put a coin on the barrel (must have sight rib) and while holding the gun on a target, squeeze the trigger in the double action mode. The coin should stay on the barrel even after the hammer drops.

Put a rubber tipped erases and a pencil down the barrel. Same drill but you'll catch yourself flinching.

Ball & dummy (range exercise).

If you can master a DA revolver, you can shoot most handguns. With a semi, practice a lot with the long DA trigger. So, decock after every shot.
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Old April 13, 2021, 03:40 PM   #13
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The distance does not matter. Improper application of the fundamentals is why you cannot shoot a group.

Focus
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Old May 5, 2021, 12:38 PM   #14
Long Beard
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Very true. It also goes without saying that hand position (grip) factors in as well. I usually shoot my M&P at about twenty-five yards, indoor average for self defense purposes, but have maxed out at about sixty with somewhat accuracy.
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