German Erfurt Luger ID help

popcorn1334 · September 30, 2017, 01:14 PM

Hi, I was wondering if anyone could shed some info on this luger. It's been in my family but the only thing we know is that a relative (now passed away) acquired it in Germany "back in the day". It seems to be partly plated in gold. The serial number is 198 (on one part it looks like 198 and a 1 is sideways). Maker's mark is Erfurt with what looks like a tiny horizontal crown "B" on a sled to the left of it. I don't see a chamber mark. The barrel is short - about 3 1/4". A very faint proof mark is near the locking bolt (? not sure if that's the right part). Maybe this is a Navy gun? Looking online I think I've found that the magazine is from 1939-1945, and is aluminum - serial number is 2986. Any insight would be greatly appreciated! Here is an album https://imgur.com/a/NEaRL

**44 AMP** · September 30, 2017, 02:03 PM

Well, its certainly pretty!

My Luger book has gone walkabout, and I'm not going to search now, but I can tell you a few things off the top of my head.

The gun has been refinished. I've never seen one done quite that way, but it is pretty. Collector value is ZILCH. Zero, nada... despite having matching numbers (except for the magazine) the refinish removes it from collector interest (and high value). Value wise, it's a very pretty "shooter", not a collectible (other than being a Luger, which has some value on its own).

9mm, the barrel should be 4" (100mm) stick a rod down the barrel to the boltface (chamber EMPTY) and mark it at the muzzle, then measure. It should be approximately 4".

Navy contract Lugers had 6" (150mm) barrels. Also specific markings yours lacks.

The magazine is, obviously, from another gun.

Hope this helps

popcorn1334 · September 30, 2017, 02:35 PM

Thank you! Yes was suspecting it wasn't worth anything after being refinished. Do you have an idea when it was made?

Emerson Biggies · September 30, 2017, 07:08 PM

any run of the mill Luger shooters will probably give you $700-$800 for the souvenir. Thats not cheap.

Jim Watson · October 1, 2017, 08:32 AM

Erfurt was the Imperial German arsenal. According to Blue Book, they made Lugers from 1911-1918. The name will show up on post WWI guns made out of parts on hand or refurbished surplus.

There was a shop in my home town that specialized in such gaudy finishes. Blue, nickel, gold. I saw a lot of two-tone guns there but do not recall a three-tone. But I bet they did some on request. This ca 50 years ago when military surplus and used guns were cheap relative to new and nobody worried about "collector's items" if they were not Colts or Winchesters.

popcorn1334 · October 1, 2017, 12:15 PM

Thank you all for the info! Feel better knowing a little more.

**44 AMP** · October 1, 2017, 10:44 PM

I didn't mean to imply that it "wasn't worth anything", because it is, its a Luger, in excellent condition and a good refinish. It just lost its historical collector value.

so maybe $1000 gun not a $2500 gun. I'm afraid I don't have a feel for current Luger prices. Sorry.

RickB · October 2, 2017, 11:41 AM

Is the serial repeated on the barrel?
The last two digits should be repeated on top of the breechblock, between the Erfurt stamp and "knuckle" in the toggle assembly.
If there's no stamp on the barrel or the breechblock, the absence not being unusual at all among Lugers that have "been around", then it's something of a parts gun, which contributes to its value as a only a shooter and not a collectible.

Jim Watson · October 2, 2017, 11:59 AM

I think the font and alignment of the "198s" are kind of spooky, perhaps a "force numbered" parts gun.

Lack of a stock lug indicates 1913 or earlier.
Lack of a chamber date indicates a parts gun, military Lugers 1910 on were dated.

September 30, 2017, 01:14 PM	#1
popcorn1334 Junior Member Join Date: September 29, 2017 Posts: 3	German Erfurt Luger ID help Hi, I was wondering if anyone could shed some info on this luger. It's been in my family but the only thing we know is that a relative (now passed away) acquired it in Germany "back in the day". It seems to be partly plated in gold. The serial number is 198 (on one part it looks like 198 and a 1 is sideways). Maker's mark is Erfurt with what looks like a tiny horizontal crown "B" on a sled to the left of it. I don't see a chamber mark. The barrel is short - about 3 1/4". A very faint proof mark is near the locking bolt (? not sure if that's the right part). Maybe this is a Navy gun? Looking online I think I've found that the magazine is from 1939-1945, and is aluminum - serial number is 2986. Any insight would be greatly appreciated! Here is an album https://imgur.com/a/NEaRL

September 30, 2017, 02:03 PM	#2
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,791	Well, its certainly pretty! My Luger book has gone walkabout, and I'm not going to search now, but I can tell you a few things off the top of my head. The gun has been refinished. I've never seen one done quite that way, but it is pretty. Collector value is ZILCH. Zero, nada... despite having matching numbers (except for the magazine) the refinish removes it from collector interest (and high value). Value wise, it's a very pretty "shooter", not a collectible (other than being a Luger, which has some value on its own). 9mm, the barrel should be 4" (100mm) stick a rod down the barrel to the boltface (chamber EMPTY) and mark it at the muzzle, then measure. It should be approximately 4". Navy contract Lugers had 6" (150mm) barrels. Also specific markings yours lacks. The magazine is, obviously, from another gun. Hope this helps __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

September 30, 2017, 07:08 PM	#4
Emerson Biggies Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2014 Posts: 163	any run of the mill Luger shooters will probably give you $700-$800 for the souvenir. Thats not cheap. __________________ Keep your guns clean.... the kids may put them in their mouths!

October 1, 2017, 10:44 PM	#7
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,791	I didn't mean to imply that it "wasn't worth anything", because it is, its a Luger, in excellent condition and a good refinish. It just lost its historical collector value. so maybe $1000 gun not a $2500 gun. I'm afraid I don't have a feel for current Luger prices. Sorry. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

October 2, 2017, 11:41 AM	#8
RickB Senior Member Join Date: March 1, 2000 Location: Boise, ID Posts: 8,517	Is the serial repeated on the barrel? The last two digits should be repeated on top of the breechblock, between the Erfurt stamp and "knuckle" in the toggle assembly. If there's no stamp on the barrel or the breechblock, the absence not being unusual at all among Lugers that have "been around", then it's something of a parts gun, which contributes to its value as a only a shooter and not a collectible. __________________ Runs off at the mouth about anything 1911 related on this site and half the time is flat out wrong.

September 30, 2017, 02:35 PM	#3
popcorn1334 Junior Member Join Date: September 29, 2017 Posts: 3	Thank you! Yes was suspecting it wasn't worth anything after being refinished. Do you have an idea when it was made?

October 1, 2017, 08:32 AM	#5
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,528	Erfurt was the Imperial German arsenal. According to Blue Book, they made Lugers from 1911-1918. The name will show up on post WWI guns made out of parts on hand or refurbished surplus. There was a shop in my home town that specialized in such gaudy finishes. Blue, nickel, gold. I saw a lot of two-tone guns there but do not recall a three-tone. But I bet they did some on request. This ca 50 years ago when military surplus and used guns were cheap relative to new and nobody worried about "collector's items" if they were not Colts or Winchesters.

October 1, 2017, 12:15 PM	#6
popcorn1334 Junior Member Join Date: September 29, 2017 Posts: 3	Thank you all for the info! Feel better knowing a little more.

October 2, 2017, 11:59 AM	#9
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,528	I think the font and alignment of the "198s" are kind of spooky, perhaps a "force numbered" parts gun. Lack of a stock lug indicates 1913 or earlier. Lack of a chamber date indicates a parts gun, military Lugers 1910 on were dated.

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