Back up guns and the benefits, if you want them.. - Page 2

BlueTrain · September 11, 2015, 11:57 AM

There went my desire for another Glock.

samsmix · September 11, 2015, 02:01 PM

In the summer, my P3AT is occasionally my primary due to size and clothing restrictions, but when my 15-3 is holstered it really is a small matter to throw the .380 in a pocket or tuck it in somewhere about my waist. Might as well. I have buddies I would are, and others I wouldn't, but. Also a wife and daughter that I certainly would. It is also a great "NYC reload" or true backup should my primary become lost or damaged.

boltomatic · September 17, 2015, 12:39 PM

I've never been a fan. In reality, out of the up to 3 million self defense uses of firearms in the US every year, only a handful involve more than 2 or 3 shots being fired. The odds of a civilian ever needing a backup gun are just too small to justify the risk and hassle in my opinion.

As for the fear that someone will take your main gun to use against you, understand that if they do that it will be very unlikely that you would be able to draw your backup before they realize what you are doing and shoot you. In fact, you would probably have a much higher chance of survival at that point by begging for your life and complying with whatever they want. I know that's not what we want to hear, but its the truth.

Grant D · September 17, 2015, 01:19 PM

I carry a Model 637 Smith on my hip, and a LCP in my back pocket.
They're both light, and can carry them all day long without a problem.

I also carry a speed strip, and a spare mag for the LCP in my watch pocket.
If I empty the 637 I can pull the LCP and put it into action pretty quick.

**OldMarksman** · September 17, 2015, 05:35 PM

Posted by boltomatic:

Quote:

In reality, out of the up to 3 million self defense uses of firearms in the US every year, only a handful involve more than 2 or 3 shots being fired.

Can you substantiate that assertion with factual data?

Consider that many people train to shoot four or five shots very quickly.

Quote:

The odds of a civilian ever needing a backup gun are just too small to justify the risk and hassle in my opinion.

The odds of a civilian ever needing to threaten or use deadly force are very small indeed, but we have to consider the severity of the potential consequences. That leads many of us to choose to train, and to carry.

Regarding the back-up gun, the appropriate odds to consider relate to the likelihood of a firearm failure that occurs once the armed altercation has begun. That's what we call the conditional probability.

There are far too few actual defensive gun uses to support that analysis, but we can do it another way.

Just go to a couple of two day high performance defensive pistol training sessions and watch. Make note of the failures that occur, and see if you would consider it prudent to mitigate the risk, or not.

Quote:

In fact, you would probably have a much higher chance of survival at that point by begging for your life and complying with whatever they want.

I prefer an enforceable option.

Quote:

I know that's not what we want to hear, but its the truth.

Do you have a basis for that idea?

kraigwy · September 17, 2015, 06:01 PM

The only time I carried a back up was when I was in LE. Only then during the winter. It was Alaska and we had parka's. They had a zipper size to allow access to the service revolver, but it was slow.

I'd carry a 38 snubby in my coat pocket.

I also keep another revolver in my patrol car. Got caught without one.

I was EOD, and got a call out to a drug raid. Suppose to be booby traps. As I was driving to the scene, I realized I didn't have a gun.

I did a lot of shooting at the time and decided to check the truck to see if I left one in there. Ended up going on a drug raid with a 22 revolver and two bullets.

The extra was in my car from then on.

weldonjr2001 · September 18, 2015, 04:15 PM

I've gotten accustomed to carrying a .380 or .38 snub in my left front pocket as a second gun.

A gun available to either hand is nice. And there have been a few occasions where it would have been the faster to get into action.

DirtyHarold · September 18, 2015, 06:32 PM

I dont want to sound hypocritical, so let me first be transparent. I carry every single day 99.9999999999999999% of the time I am in public. I bought an LCP as a "backup" to my glock and beretta carry guns. After almost a year I find myself carrying JUST the LCP almost as often as I do my main carry guns. If I have pocket space for a second gun, I will use it but I dont all the time.

That being said, lets take a step back.

1. We can all 100% agree that it is a thing that guns can malfunction; although the likeliness a revolver will fail is essentially naught, [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color] happens. And as for semi-auto, the magazine isnt always the issue.

2. We can all 100% agree that because of the fact that we are carrying in the first place, we have accepted the fact that we may in fact have to use our weapons in a self defense scenario.

See where I'm going with this? On a day to day basis, the odds are against you getting attacked. Better hope if those odds turn, the odds your only gun wont malfunction dont turn with it.

However one could argue a paradox where if you carry a backup to the primary, should you carry a backup to the backup? and a backup to that backup?

Tactical Jackalope · September 18, 2015, 08:55 PM

Wow boltomatic... wow...

Are you aware that this is a gun forum?

September 11, 2015, 11:57 AM	#26
BlueTrain Senior Member Join Date: September 26, 2005 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 6,141	There went my desire for another Glock. __________________ Shoot low, sheriff. They're riding Shetlands! Underneath the starry flag, civilize 'em with a Krag, and return us to our own beloved homes! Buy War Bonds.

September 11, 2015, 02:01 PM	#27
samsmix Senior Member Join Date: June 29, 2006 Location: Montana (Montucky?) Posts: 1,273	In the summer, my P3AT is occasionally my primary due to size and clothing restrictions, but when my 15-3 is holstered it really is a small matter to throw the .380 in a pocket or tuck it in somewhere about my waist. Might as well. I have buddies I would are, and others I wouldn't, but. Also a wife and daughter that I certainly would. It is also a great "NYC reload" or true backup should my primary become lost or damaged. __________________ You'll probably never NEED a gun. I hope you never do. But IF you do, you will need it worse than anything you've ever needed in your life. IF we're not supposed to eat animals, howcome God made 'em outta meat?

September 17, 2015, 06:01 PM	#31
kraigwy Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2008 Location: Wyoming Posts: 11,061	The only time I carried a back up was when I was in LE. Only then during the winter. It was Alaska and we had parka's. They had a zipper size to allow access to the service revolver, but it was slow. I'd carry a 38 snubby in my coat pocket. I also keep another revolver in my patrol car. Got caught without one. I was EOD, and got a call out to a drug raid. Suppose to be booby traps. As I was driving to the scene, I realized I didn't have a gun. I did a lot of shooting at the time and decided to check the truck to see if I left one in there. Ended up going on a drug raid with a 22 revolver and two bullets. The extra was in my car from then on. __________________ Kraig Stuart CPT USAR Ret USAMU Sniper School Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071

September 17, 2015, 12:39 PM	#28
boltomatic Member Join Date: March 25, 2014 Posts: 98	I've never been a fan. In reality, out of the up to 3 million self defense uses of firearms in the US every year, only a handful involve more than 2 or 3 shots being fired. The odds of a civilian ever needing a backup gun are just too small to justify the risk and hassle in my opinion. As for the fear that someone will take your main gun to use against you, understand that if they do that it will be very unlikely that you would be able to draw your backup before they realize what you are doing and shoot you. In fact, you would probably have a much higher chance of survival at that point by begging for your life and complying with whatever they want. I know that's not what we want to hear, but its the truth.

September 17, 2015, 01:19 PM	#29
Grant D Senior Member Join Date: August 14, 2011 Location: Brazos County, Texas Posts: 1,038	I carry a Model 637 Smith on my hip, and a LCP in my back pocket. They're both light, and can carry them all day long without a problem. I also carry a speed strip, and a spare mag for the LCP in my watch pocket. If I empty the 637 I can pull the LCP and put it into action pretty quick.

September 18, 2015, 04:15 PM	#32
weldonjr2001 Senior Member Join Date: January 14, 2001 Location: San Antonio, Tx. Posts: 462	I've gotten accustomed to carrying a .380 or .38 snub in my left front pocket as a second gun. A gun available to either hand is nice. And there have been a few occasions where it would have been the faster to get into action.

September 18, 2015, 06:32 PM	#33
DirtyHarold Senior Member Join Date: July 23, 2015 Posts: 158	I dont want to sound hypocritical, so let me first be transparent. I carry every single day 99.9999999999999999% of the time I am in public. I bought an LCP as a "backup" to my glock and beretta carry guns. After almost a year I find myself carrying JUST the LCP almost as often as I do my main carry guns. If I have pocket space for a second gun, I will use it but I dont all the time. That being said, lets take a step back. 1. We can all 100% agree that it is a thing that guns can malfunction; although the likeliness a revolver will fail is essentially naught, [color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color][color=#FF0000]█[/color] happens. And as for semi-auto, the magazine isnt always the issue. 2. We can all 100% agree that because of the fact that we are carrying in the first place, we have accepted the fact that we may in fact have to use our weapons in a self defense scenario. See where I'm going with this? On a day to day basis, the odds are against you getting attacked. Better hope if those odds turn, the odds your only gun wont malfunction dont turn with it. However one could argue a paradox where if you carry a backup to the primary, should you carry a backup to the backup? and a backup to that backup?

September 18, 2015, 08:55 PM	#34
Tactical Jackalope Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2010 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 6,429	Wow boltomatic... wow... Are you aware that this is a gun forum?