Why are Kahrs made so tight?

[lee n. field]

Originally Posted by JohnKSa

Detail stripping involves a complete disassembly of the firearm. Or, at least as complete as is reasonable. Generally dovetailed sights are not driven out, some pinned/staked parts may be left in place, and some assemblies may not be taken apart.

Detail stripping a firearm is not usually necessary for normal maintenance. Field stripping is all that is required the vast majority of the time. However, it makes sense to periodically do a complete disassembly and inspection of a gun that is used heavily and/or carried daily. How often depends on the usage level and the conditions of carry.

For a striker fired gun it makes sense to occasionally take down the slide and clean out the striker channel, lest it get gunked up, which is a little beyond a field strip.

[HighValleyRanch]

Agree, but Kahr's have a special hole that allows you to spray cleanear from a nozzle spray just for the striker channel. So diassembly is not always necessary to get it spic and span.

[wild cat mccane]

Most accurate factory gun on the market today is a rattle trap for fitment (Walther PDP).

Having owned 5 Diamondback DB9s, I don't know if you know this, but Diamondback copying your design isn't a compliment. Also, that was more than a decade ago.

Every gun manufacturer holds a patent.

Again. Circular.

The op asked why is it so tight. Easy, they designed it that why. Does it benefit Kahr over another brand? no.

Kahrtalk has an "approved list" for 380 that will and will not function in the CW380. Name another gun with this problem. Kel Tec PMR30 is the only I can think of.

[HighValleyRanch]

Most accurate factory gun on the market today is a rattle trap for fitment (Walther PDP).

Where is the proof of this statement. You mean in your own hands?


Seecamps had an approved list for their .32's. Not sure of their .380's.

[Carl the Floor Walker]

Post off going off topic. I do not see where he asked if there was anyone who disliked his choice of a firearm.

[BCR1]

Thanks guys, I thought that is what you meant. I don't trust me, even with video help, to completely tear down the frame and remove the breech block in my Sig 228.

When I used to carry my P6, normal take down and removing the grips to blow out the lint from the hammer spring was as far as I ever went. I'll talk to a good friend and see what he would charge me for the job.

Bill

[TunnelRat]

Originally Posted by wild cat mccane

Most accurate factory gun on the market today is a rattle trap for fitment (Walther PDP).

The PDP I own isn’t fit as tightly as say the Wilson Combat 1911 I owned, but it’s not what I would call a rattle trap. I’d say it’s as tight as most production polymer framed pistols I own, more than some and less than others.

I get you’re trying to make a point that tightness to the point where it impedes function isn’t needed for accuracy, but you’re letting your desire to make a point get away from the truth a bit, imo.

I also think this thread has a dubious purpose and future.


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[lee n. field]

Originally Posted by Carl the Floor Walker

YOU FAILED TO MAINTAIN YOUR WEAPON SON


Kahr disassembly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mi3VFRll2L4

Slide's easy. Very familiar to anyone who's ever messed with a Glock.

Full takedown, not so much. Kahr Arms MK40 Complete disassembly and reassembly

[OneFreeTexan]

Recently got anew Kahr CW45, without a doubt my sweetest gun…My number one had been a Beretta 92, which still is one fine gun,
The Kahr is so easy to rack,,nice trigger pull, and the recoil seems less than that of a 9. I am looking at other Kahr’s now also. their quality is very very good, and I like the tight fitment.

[Recoil spring]

After 2.5 years of not having my CW 380 apart, I did it. Was so hard to get a grip on that small slide, had to use an oven mit, I imagine the larger framed Kahrs are easier, man, you have to have super strong hands to do it though.

There was still oil throughout internally, despite all those years of pocket carry in 100 plus heat in TX, but the gun grease had bled off. I was using Outer's Gun Grease, I don't really like it, too watery. I may go back to using automotive bearing grease, stays put much better. Any suggestions on gun grease that you folks like?

[dogtown tom]

Carl the Floor Walker
Quote:

Sorry, but I have to laugh at that one.

Why? It's not exactly a secret that the Kahr mag design is problematic to say the least.

Kahr still sells the same mag. and I have no problem with them. And I have about a dozen in 380 and 9mm ea. If some one desires to get the other mag follower it sure is easy and simple to do.

Lucky you.
I've owned K9, Mk9, P9, P380 and CW9's ...........thats around five .380 mags and twenty 9mm mags. Not a one can retain the top round in a spare magazine.

If some one hates a gun for such a lame reason, then too bad for them.

Seriously? I consider a mag that spits out the top round a serious issue on any gun. With a pocket pistol its more so.

Makes you wonder how much they shoot any guns.

Or makes us wonder how often you shoot yours.

Kahr sell both followers right on their website. You would have to be pretty dumb not to find a simple follower if that were really a issue. And not many out there that do not have the intelligence to change out a follower.

I dumped Kahr as a carry gun for several reasons, but the fragility of the magazine and its inability to retain rounds was number one.

[Carl the Floor Walker]

To the OP, I am sorry you asked a simple question and had to get this kind of nonsense that seems to go on some forums. It sounds like you may be a little inexperienced. Not trying to insult you.
Bottom line, YOU HAVE A GREAT FIREARM. One cherished by many and thousands of dedicated, experienced, fans over the years. If you have any questions about the Kahr's, I am sure myself or others that you can see here posting will answer your question. Again, sorry to see it have to turn into this nonsense.
You do need to clean your firearm more often. Again, if you need help just PM. Otherwise the same group of people will just start the same old thing.

[Moonglum]

Originally Posted by Recoil spring

Will be stripping it down soon even though it has not been shot in 3 years, but carried daily.

Why would you trust your life (really to a Kahr) to a gun you can't be bothered to shoot or maintain?

Is it a self defense tool or a good luck charm?

[Carl the Floor Walker]

OP, I will leave you with this. It is a file I have had for a long time. I suggest if interested you make a copy. I am sorry, I do not have the author, or his expertise, but some for you to think about. I may have to delete it. But just trying to find a way to help you understand your question.

I'd like to see us stop confusing "tolerance" with "clearance." Tolerance is the allowed variance of a machined dimension to it's designed dimension. In other words, .500" +/- .002 is a tolerance reference where +/- .002" is the tolerance. The part can be anywhere from .498" to .502" and be within tolerance. Clearance is the space between 2 mating surfaces. so while Kahr may make parts that are .500" that mate with a part that's .498" that's .002" clearance not .002 tolerance. Other manufacturers than Kahr make their firearms with looser clearances, Kahr makes theirs with tighter clearances. If you say something is built to tight tolerances (a VERY, VERY good thing in machining) it means nothing in terms of how loose or tight the fitment of the parts is. Some will design and manufacture to loose clearances because they can't/don't/won't machine to tight tolerances (the tighter the tolerance the more expensive the machining is) and so must design in more clearance to make up for it. Ever held a gun that seems to rattle? That gun has wider clearances than the one that doesn't rattle. It may be made from parts with tolerances in the +/- .0002's but the clearances are much more open. My $.02 as a manufacturer, although I think people who don't understand the difference will always refer to tight "clearances" as tight "tolerances". My semantics rant over...carry on.
I don’t care about the naysayers’ criticism of Kahr’s break-in recommendation. It’s only common sense to make sure that a self protection firearm, or any mechanical device for that matter, should be broken in by the end user to assess its functionality.
Kudos to Kahr for being pragmatic.
Judging from what I have read in multiple gun forums over the past 20 years, it might behoove all firearms manufacturers to be honest and do the same."

unknown

All, I can tell you is this. I do have plenty of experience with mine and they are NOT going anywhere. All have proven to be exceptionally dependable, easy to shoot and easy to EDC. Yes, I am a fan boy and most likely will not be buying many more Pistols. Just totally happy with what I have.

[bedbugbilly]

One of the few times I have ever heard a person complain about "tight tolerances" - usually it's about "crappy fit and finish" or "OMG, you can drive a truck through the gap in . . . . ."

Too tight? Too close of a tolerance? Just exactly is the issue? How many rounds have you put through it? How often do you shoot it? If it is your carry gun - I would assume that you have put a couple of Ks of rounds through it and you clean it after a shooting session and on a regular basis . . .

There are ways of smoothing handguns out regardless of if it is a semi or a revolver. I have used such things as auto paint buffing compound to smooth slides and rails out, etc. - but you have to CLEAN it completely afterwards.

I'm sorry . . . . but when I hear someone complain about "tight tolerances", it reminds me of a friend who was issued a 1911 in Nam . . . it was put together from parts and there were no "tolerances" - - - he said it rattled so badly that he was afraid to shoot it as well as carry it because you could hear it with every step. Unfortunately, not got "lost" in a firefight . . . his folks sent him a 357 Smith that DID have tight tolerances . . . they got ammo to him by sending it in a loaf of homemade bread - a loaf every few weeks.

[wild cat mccane]

There is a pretty big issue if a lot of factory 380 doesn't function in the gun. The CW380 isn't just tight, it doesn't function with some factory rounds all thanks to the striker design. And then the smilies on the rounds? haven't mentioned those yet.

The OP asked why is it so tight. I respond, profoundly, yeah, great question-- cause you got no benefit out of that tightness. The gun is larger than the smaller LCP. The gun trigger isn't better than the LCP. So yeah, why is it so tight?

Note, I responded that Kahr updated their mag followers after 20 years. I responded I owned one. I responded that the LCP barrel is longer but the CW380 is larger.

All unanswered, but plenty-o-nothing so far for follow up on me just knowing nothing about Kahrs.

[Carl the Floor Walker]

deleted - realized where this is going and out of here. My bad for posting away from topic.

[dogtown tom]

Carl the Floor Walker ....
And I am going to bet I shoot 380's much more than the average owner. Not Bragging but have been a member of a 380 shooting club for over 10 years.....

I too love .380's and have owned or currently own quite a few. Among them:
Remington 51 (first gun I ever bought)
Browning BDA
Kahr P380
NAA Guardian
Colt Government Model
Ruger LCP
FN/Browning 1910/55
FN/Browning 1922
Mauser Hsc
Mauser Hsc Super
Sig P230
Sig P232
Star S
Star SM
Star SM Super

my favorite......the Star SM Super.

[JustJake]

Carl the Floor Walker ....
And I am going to bet I shoot 380's much more than the average owner. Not Bragging but have been a member of a 380 shooting club for over 10 years.

9mm Mak (9x18) is where it's at in the sub-9x19 world.

[Aguila Blanca]

Once the discussion shifts from "Why is my gun too tight?" to another caliber war debate, it's time to call an end.