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Old June 11, 2021, 01:38 AM   #26
ballardw
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I think part of what you are seeing is why I asked about the black circle white dot target.

Round target (that you can see clearly) with a matching round reticle (or aperture for iron sights) align more naturally. Cross hairs, especially where the cross may cover the "dot" aren't the best for vertical and horizontal centering on a round object.

When I was shooting smallbore competition I never saw anyone use a square aperture to shoot the round targets and none of the higher scores shot post sites. Interchangeable front sights with different sizes of round apertures.
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Old June 11, 2021, 07:16 AM   #27
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Makes sense, I might try the inverted target to see if that makes any difference. I'm curious how you can actually focus clearly in on the smallest dots without having use of a top-tier scope--I can't even imagine using just irons.

BTW--I'm not entering any of these 17hmr targets (unless revolver guy creates a separate category for them) and will start looking around for a 22lr rifle I can use (though finding ammo I suspect is going to be a bigger problem).
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Old June 11, 2021, 02:04 PM   #28
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I may have a line on a CZ 457--any ideas where I can find good ammo?
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Old June 11, 2021, 03:59 PM   #29
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If you have a selection of 22lr ammo, you could get lucky and the gun likes what you have. If you have none, then lots of online dealers have it (maybe) but you won't know if the gun likes it until you shoot some. Now is not the time to start chasing ammo/gun combos. You take what you can get and hope for the best. RF ammo is very similar to reloading components inventories, now it's here, now it's gone.
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Old June 12, 2021, 04:28 PM   #30
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OK, you got me. This just looks like too much fun to pass up. I just printed out 10 targets and going to the range on Monday.
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Old June 12, 2021, 05:45 PM   #31
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It 's truly addictive and a ton of fun, the only thing I would add is that I think the top row is impossible without a top-tier, high power scope--but maybe someone will prove me wrong.

Today I went out and shot terribly, I could hardly hit ANY of the targets--let alone the top row ones. As reality check at the end I pasted a red dot target up to shoot a group at, normally I'd be happy with something like this but I realize that if you can't consistently group at at least .5 MOA at 50 yds--the going is going to be rough.

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File Type: jpg 17 hmr 51 yds.jpg (155.6 KB, 133 views)
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Old June 12, 2021, 08:27 PM   #32
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Wow does that 17 shoot it is alot of fun, the wife even joined the tightest group challenge today

https://dayattherange.com/?p=8911
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Old June 13, 2021, 06:00 AM   #33
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That is so cool your wife is out joining the fun!

I can't believe I'm actually contemplating yanking one of my top-tier scopes off of a long range rifle and using it to try and knock off that top row--but I'm obsessed with nailing them.
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Old June 13, 2021, 08:20 AM   #34
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Stag

No one asked you to comment it is not cool. All day yesterday on a 100 degree day she would get close and I thought ok a nice kiss or whisper sweet nothings and she would whisper -- "You SUCK" or "You need to get it together"

She comes out with me all the time just never goes on camera to much. Unfortunately with her occupation and the craziness surrounding it.

Please do not encourage her Stag.
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Old June 13, 2021, 08:24 AM   #35
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??

Didn't mean to offend (or are you afraid she might beat you?).
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Old June 13, 2021, 08:47 AM   #36
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Stag

Sir I was only kidding no offense at all.

Yes I am afraid she might whoop me, by the way she does with 22 alot. It's wierd stag.

22LR she beats me consistently
223 I own it
308 I play second fiddle
6.5 I own it

I think it is just a matter of how the rifles fit her.

Again was just kidding sir.
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Old June 13, 2021, 09:23 AM   #37
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I figured as much--but these days you never know. Consider yourself lucky you have a partner that shares your love of shooting!
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Old June 13, 2021, 10:02 AM   #38
Bart B.
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Prone with scope and ammo made in 1979.

X ring is .391 inch.

Shot in year 2005.

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Old June 13, 2021, 12:41 PM   #39
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Quote:
Prone with scope and ammo made in 1979.

X ring is .391 inch.
Awesome!--and this means you're entering the know your skills challenge? The smallest target is something like .04"
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Old June 13, 2021, 10:30 PM   #40
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Tried a SWFA scope today cause it has a nice thin reticle, but the glass wasn't as clear as the Nikon's so that didn't help. I also tried some 15 and 17 gr ammo --very interesting in that they both were key-holing the targets at 50 yds while the 20 gr xtp's did not. It was a bit windy today but I don't see how it could be knocking the spin of a bullet.
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Old June 14, 2021, 05:31 AM   #41
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I've started producing quite a pile of spent targets--and the idea of a "Open Green Class" came to me--1 shot on each of all the targets (15 total). Whaddaya think?
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Old June 14, 2021, 05:57 PM   #42
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Darn you for posting this Stag, I wasted half the afternoon testing various 22 ammo and these were my best

Kidd 22, Weaver T 24 scope, Magpull bipod

SK pistol Match Special - 85
Lapua Midas + - 75

borderline shots with P beside them were checked with scoring plug

Runners up were CCI Std Velocity and SK Rifle Match

Now I need to get my CZ 52 down there and see how it does

oh an interesting side note was that while shooting I felt something on my left foot and ankle, looking under the bench there was a 4 foot blacksnake headed for the bushes. Startled the you know what out of me. Had to take a Dr Pepper break and change my underoos
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Lapua Midas Plus.jpg (683.5 KB, 26 views)
File Type: jpg SkPistolmatchSP.jpg (86.0 KB, 24 views)
File Type: jpg rifle2june.jpg (254.1 KB, 22 views)
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Old June 14, 2021, 06:15 PM   #43
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not to derail but here is the same rifle doing ten shot groups at A 23 targets. The X ring is .39 inch, the 10 ring is .89 inch, also a pic looking downrange from the bench to the berm. This is our 50 yard range, primarily used by the Bullseye Pistol shooter but I like it for .22 practice
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File Type: jpg 50 yard 4 ten shot groups.jpg (97.6 KB, 25 views)
File Type: jpg rifleJune.jpg (360.6 KB, 18 views)
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Old June 14, 2021, 07:05 PM   #44
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Nice shooting houndog! I hope I can shoot that well if I ever get my hands on a 22lr. Maybe in about two weeks.

Blame revolver guy for the idea.
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Old June 14, 2021, 07:39 PM   #45
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It ain't me Stag it's the rifle. Darn thing likes almost every flavor SK ammo and will shoot $3 a box CCI Std Vel almost as well. Hates everything made by Eley or RWS. Gotta love a cheap date.

I was shooting some Fiocchi Winter Match today. That is some weird stuff if you ever get ahold of any, most shots are very accurate except every 4th or 5th shot is a flyer out in la la land. It has a completely different sound compared to every other .22 LR ammo I have ever shot. Almost sounds like a pistol, a very loud popping sound. Anyway I nailed 4 of the 5 top row targets and the 5th was a flyer completely out of the circle. I was so disgusted I tossed the target in the trash. The score would have been over 100 even with the flyer but that flyer just ripped my rear end outta the frame
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Old June 15, 2021, 01:10 AM   #46
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You kinda confirmed that a 22lr can hang competitively with a 17 hmr at close range, that must be some awesome shooting to nearly sweep that top row! I've only managed to get two of them with the 17 hmr.
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Old June 15, 2021, 05:04 AM   #47
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22's are just like centerfires, #1 factor is a good barrel and #2 is a smooth trigger Then you have to find ammo it likes. Use your Hornady comparator on various brands of 22LR. You will be surprised at the differences. Just like a centerfire you will find a "jump" you barrel likes. That Kidd likes a BTO of .761 to .765

Code:
	
	R100         	CCI Std Vel    Blazer        SK+ (new)	
								
BTO	0.758		0.755		0.775		0.771	
	0.758		0.767		0.786		0.768	
	0.758		0.761		0.783		0.764	
	0.758		0.758		0.777		0.768	
	0.758		0.756		0.776		0.764	
	0.756		0.763		0.780		0.768	
	0.758		0.762		0.776		0.767	
	0.757		0.761		0.776		0.767	
	0.756		0.761		0.787		0.770	
	0.757		0.758		0.781		0.766	
	0.755		0.761		0.795		0.767	
	0.756		0.762		0.779		0.767	
	0.758		0.763		0.781		0.769	
	0.757		0.761		0.785		0.771	
	0.757		0.764		0.786		0.767	
								
Average	0.757		0.761		0.782		0.768	
high	0.758		0.767		0.795		0.771	
low	0.755		0.755		0.776		0.764	
spread	0.003		0.012		0.019		0.007	
std dev	0.001		0.003		0.006		0.002	
								
								
	Eley Tgt	Eley Tenex 	Eley Match OSP	   Lapua Midas +	
								
BTO	0.768		0.752		0.756		0.766	
	0.771		0.753		0.753		0.765	
	0.776		0.752		0.757		0.764	
	0.771		0.751		0.752		0.765	
	0.766		0.752		0.751		0.765	
	0.769		0.753		0.752		0.766	
	0.765		0.753		0.753		0.766	
	0.764		0.752		0.754		0.766	
	0.775		0.752		0.754		0.764	
	0.771		0.751		0.755		0.764	
	0.768		0.752		0.753		0.765	
	0.773		0.752		0.754		0.766	
	0.770		0.753		0.754		0.765	
	0.768		0.753		0.755		0.766	
	0.774		0.753					
								
Average	0.770		0.752		0.754		0.765	
high	0.776		0.753		0.757		0.766	
low	0.764		0.751		0.751		0.764	
spread	0.012		0.002		0.006		0.002	
std dev	0.004		0.001		0.002		0.001
Code:
SK Std (old)	Fed Ultra Match	Fed GM match	SK Pistol Match Sp
						
0.768		0.757		0.767		0.765
0.765		0.757		0.767		0.765
0.762		0.756		0.766		0.765
0.773		0.756		0.769		0.765
0.772		0.758		0.769		0.765
0.762		0.759		0.766		0.765
0.766		0.758		0.767		0.765
0.761		0.757		0.769		0.765
0.768		0.759		0.769		0.765
0.772		0.759		0.768		0.766
0.763		0.759		0.766		0.765
0.762		0.757		0.769		0.765
0.767		0.758		0.768		0.767
0.766		0.758		0.767		0.765
0.768		0.757		0.769		0.765
						
0.766		0.758		0.768		0.765
0.773		0.759		0.769		0.767
0.761		0.756		0.766		0.765
0.012		0.003		0.003		0.002
0.004		0.001		0.001		0.001
						
						
Lapua Center X	Lapua Polar	SK Tgt Match Pistol		
						
0.764		0.760		0.763		
0.765		0.760		0.763		
0.767		0.761		0.764		
0.765		0.760		0.763		
0.765		0.759		0.764		
0.764		0.759		0.764		
0.764		0.760		0.763		
0.768		0.760		0.763		
0.763		0.761		0.764		
0.762		0.761		0.763		
0.768		0.760		0.764		
0.767		0.761		0.764		
0.765		0.761		0.761		
0.765		0.758		0.761		
						
						
0.765		0.760		0.763		
0.768		0.761		0.764		
0.762		0.758		0.761		
0.006		0.003		0.003		
0.002		0.001		0.001
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Last edited by hounddawg; June 15, 2021 at 05:14 AM.
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Old June 15, 2021, 07:00 AM   #48
stagpanther
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That Kidd rifle looks like a heck of a rifle--and reasonably priced for something that is entirely custom made. Looks like I'm pretty much out of luck finding good ammo--I did find some hunting lead ammo and a couple of hollow points.
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Last edited by stagpanther; June 15, 2021 at 07:12 AM.
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Old June 16, 2021, 06:46 AM   #49
stagpanther
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houndddawg--what is "BTO"--is that a measure of the cartridge's base to ogive? Do competitive shooters pull bullets and set them themselves?
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Old June 16, 2021, 07:12 AM   #50
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After googling for some more information on the possibility of reloading your own ammo I found this at cutting edge bullets. I realize that I might be suffering from PD myself.
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