Thinking about building a 6.5 grendel

[Django11]

I've been thinking about doing a AR build in something bigger than .223. The main use would be hunting deer-sized animals as well as fairly high emphasis on accuracy. I plan on getting at least a 20" barrel for it. So here's the thing, I have no hands on experience with either the 6.5g or the 6.8, but from everything I've read, it seems 6.5 is the direction I should go.. There seems to be more 6.8 fans out there so I'm open to hearing why that may serve me better. My two main parts I'm looking for ideas on right now are trigger and barrel. Looking for a good 2 stage trigger and seriously considering a carbon fiber barrel.

Any guidance or telling about your experiences would be greatly appreciated.

[sevt_chevelle]

Trigger....larue mbt or giesselle ssa-e

[ed308]

Larue MBT is my favorite trigger. Only $87. But it's a 2 stage if that matters.

Why a carbon fiber barrel? ARP got great 20" Grendel barrels for $179. Every barrel I used from ARP can easily shot 1/2" groups. I've got one ordered.

With that said, I'm a big fan of the 6.8. If target shooting, I probably go with the G based on bullet selection. But for hunting, the 6.8 is my favorite for the same reason. Plus those fatter bullets are easier to reload in my opinion. The G and 6.8 are very close in performance.

https://www.ar15performance.com/inc/sdetail/38016/41933

[bamaranger]

I'm watching to see how this thread progresses. I've toyed with the idea of a lightweight Gendel upper, to clip onto my existing .223 carbine lower and yield some type of LW rough and tumble whitetail carbine.

My take is that the Grendel may be a bit more popular these days and the 6.8 SPC fading. Howa and Ruger have both released new rifles (bolt actions) in the Grendel , not sure what is going on with the 6.8. Casual browsing at the stores seems to indicate that Gendel ammo is now more common (than 6.8) over the counter as well, but I could be wrong about that

[Django11]

As far as carbon fiber barrels go, again, I have no hands on experience with them and would like to get some info on them. They would probably cut down on weight just a little bit too, but that's not a big concern. I have one ARP barrel and I agree, they are excellent.

[Mobuck]

"The main use would be hunting deer-sized animals as well as fairly high emphasis on accuracy."

I have an ARP 16" barrel 6.8 and can honestly say it's a great hunting set-up. I just assembled a similar upper for Son. When it came time to accuracy test for ammo preference, the choice was impossible since every type of ammo I had on hand was impressively accurate. I've shot several deer out to approx 225 yards with the 6.8 with positive results. I don't consider it a long range deer round as I already have much better suited choices.
The 6.5G is sort of the quirky, delusional cousin of the 6.8. I have two (18" & 20") that are neither as accurate or functional as the ARP 6.8. At this point, I've not used it on game simply due to mechanical quirks that cool my confidence for hunting use.
Sure, I might have different results with an ARP 6.5G barrel but the 6.5G uppers I have are quite ammo specific--a one trick pony so to speak.

[ed308]

My take is that the Grendel may be a bit more popular these days and the 6.8 SPC fading. Howa and Ruger have both released new rifles (bolt actions) in the Grendel , not sure what is going on with the 6.8. Casual browsing at the stores seems to indicate that Gendel ammo is now more common (than 6.8) over the counter as well, but I could be wrong about that.

I bought my first 6.8 back in 2011. I've heard the 6.8 is fading for years. The 6.8 has always had a strong following among hunters. With the .224 Valkyrie using the 6.8 case, I've seen increased interest in the 6.8. That will likely grow even more if a 6mm Valkyrie is introduced by Federal.

Unlike the Grendel or the Blk Out, the caliber doesn't have a manufacturer pushing the caliber for sales. Growth for the caliber is generated by word of mouth. I recently read where a major bolt gun manufacture has plans to release 6.8 bolt. I also read where another country plans to adopt the 6.8 caliber for its military. The caliber is definitely not fading.

[LineStretcher]

6, 6.5, 6.8... If you like small caliber hunting then get yourself a sweet Weatherby Vanguard in .257 Roy. There's 13 models to choose from. Nice and light and not a bad range gun either. In my honest opinion, keep the AR rifles for flat ranch hunts, chasing pigs on a quad or varmints and yotes from a stand. For deer hunting where your first shot has to count, stick with a bolt gun. That said, the 6.5 Grendel is a hard hitter out to 500 yards and keeps you on a AR-15 platform so all you need to do is get a complete upper and you're good to go if you don't mind swapping lowers. Hunting rifles typically use single stage triggers. I'd go with a drop in. I use Elfman but there's plenty of others now.

[Double Naught Spy]

My take is that the Grendel may be a bit more popular these days and the 6.8 SPC fading. Howa and Ruger have both released new rifles (bolt actions) in the Grendel , not sure what is going on with the 6.8. Casual browsing at the stores seems to indicate that Gendel ammo is now more common (than 6.8) over the counter as well, but I could be wrong about that

This is sort of like saying Tesla is more popular these days and Toyota is fading.

As a Grendel shooter (I have 4 with a 5th on the way) and NOT a reloader, please tell me in what part of the world Grendel ammo is more common than 6.8 spc. There are only a few commercial offerings. There are 2 from Hornady, 3 from Federal of which one is gone until April, Nosler has 1 target load out ($2.17 per round) with 2 more loads to be offered. PPU supposedly will get around to shipping around the end of the year to the US, probably just ball ammo. Wolf has very limited distribution. Alexander Arms has their specialty ammo at $1.50 per round (5 loads). Of these, I have never seen more than 2 offered at the LGSs, Academy Sports, and our local Cabelas carries ZERO Grendel ammo. Then there are a couple boutique offerings with really high priced ammo such as from Precision Firearms (several offerings, well made, not timely, ~$2 per round).

Grendel popularity is growing, but it is a slow growth, which is part of the reason why (ammo) manufacturers have been slow to embrace it. 6.8 spc is still more popular.

Comparing ammo from ammoseek.com, Grendel has all of 217 listings right now from just a few manufacturers...
https://ammoseek.com/ammo/6.5mm-grendel

6.8 spc has many hundreds from a whole bunch of manufacturers.
https://ammoseek.com/ammo/6.8mm-remington?ca=brass

The 6.5G is sort of the quirky, delusional cousin of the 6.8. I have two (18" & 20") that are neither as accurate or functional as the ARP 6.8.

This isn't a caliber issue. That is a gun/barrel/ammo issue.

Unlike the Grendel or the Blk Out, the caliber doesn't have a manufacturer pushing the caliber for sales.

Every company that makes 6.8 spc is pushing the caliber for sales. It is how the business works.

I also read where another country plans to adopt the 6.8 caliber for its military. The caliber is definitely not fading.

When you talk about "the caliber" of 6.8 and the discussion here is of 6.8 spc, which country has already adopted it and which country is planning on adopting it? The US isn't adopting 6.8 SPC and I don't see where any other countries have either.

Looking at Wiki's page on military calibers, I don't see a single 6.8 listing. There are 6 for 6.5, but none are Grendel.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catego...ary_cartridges

[ed308]

I'm not implying the US has any plans to adopt the 6.8 SPC. As all of us should know, the US is developing a 6.8 caliber weapon(s) for possible use at some in the future.

The 6.8 SPC is already in use by both the Jordanian and Saudi armies. Remember the Six8? The 6.8 is also being produced for use in a Squad Automatic Weapon (SAW) by U.S. Machine Gun Armory and has been shipped to US allies.

Regarding future military use of the 6.8 SPC, I've read where another country plans to adopt the 6.8 SPC but they haven't been identified at this point. I've also read where several companies have plans to introduce 6.8 SPC bolt actions rifles. Ruger and Remington had 6.8 bolts in the past. So not surprised to hear more are coming.

[Double Naught Spy]

Okay, so in reality, invoking the 6.8 of the US military has no bearing on the OP. It doesn't even exist yet and it isn't 6.8 SPC.

I see where Jordan and Saudi did some 6.8 SPC testing, but nothing about either country adopting the round. Maybe your Google-fu is better than mine? Again, significance to the OP doesn't seem to exist. He isn't likely to be hunting in either of those places.

[Django11]

Thanks for all the posts. I'll expand on my OP; I'm looking for the best potential for longer range capabilities which is -from what I've read- where the grendel shines a bit brighter with 20"+ barrel length. Reloading will be in the future with whatever caliber I decide on. With that being said, this build will not be so much of a budget build as it is for performance. I would much prefer to stay in the AR 15 platform. If anyone has any experience with carbon fiber barrels, I would love to hear your experience with them. I'm not sure I'll go that route but I'm awfully curious about how much they enhance performance/longevity.

[bamaranger]

Double Naught,

My comments on Grendel ammo are based on what I am observing in local stores and shops in north Alabama. Our local Academy carries Wolf, Hornady and Federal in Grendel. I am not noticing 6.8, but I am not really looking for it either.

What I am seeing are Grendel chambered firearms. Larry's Guns in Huntsville, had a Howa Mini-action and a Ruger American on my most recent visit to the big city last month, and I have seen two other 6.5 GR 's in other shops in recent months. I have not seen any 6.8 bolt rifles, ever, anywhere, in my area.

Please note that I prefaced my comments with the phrase "My take...." .
That qualifies it as an opinion, not stated as gospel. I darn sure can be wrong and it is clear some of you folks think so. My observations locally remain as noted.

[Mobuck]

"Weatherby Vanguard in .257 Roy."

Sounds like a "lead in" for a 1960's gun rag hack writer. I have a Vanguard in 257 Wby with a 24" barrel. It's little more than a louder, harder recoiling 25/06. A 257 Wby with less than 26" barrel is a big waste.

[ed308]

Okay, so in reality, invoking the 6.8 of the US military has no bearing on the OP. It doesn't even exist yet and it isn't 6.8 SPC.

I see where Jordan and Saudi did some 6.8 SPC testing, but nothing about either country adopting the round. Maybe your Google-fu is better than mine? Again, significance to the OP doesn't seem to exist. He isn't likely to be hunting in either of those places.

Where in my post do I mention the 6.8 and the US Military? Read my post again. I stated "another country" plans to adopt the 6.8 (SPC) for use in their military. No where do I imply the new 6.8 bullet being developed is a 6.8 SPC. But since you brought it up, who knows. Maybe it will be a bullet you can use in the 6.8 SPC. I kinda doubt, but we'll see.

Regarding the 6.8 SPC use in the Jordanian and Saudi Armies, both adopted and purchased LWRC's Six8 in quantity. Remember that XM60GD that Federal was pumping out and which was in high demand with your buddies for their 6.8 rifles? And which could be purchased for $5.99.box? Surplus ammo from Federal's contract to supply the ammo for those Six8 purchased by the Saudi's and Jordanians. Ask your buddies. Maybe you'll believe them. Frankly, I'm a little surprised you weren't aware of this information already.

But why bring this up? Like you said, it has nothing to do with the OP's post.

[LineStretcher]

Originally Posted by Mobuck

"Weatherby Vanguard in .257 Roy."

Sounds like a "lead in" for a 1960's gun rag hack writer. I have a Vanguard in 257 Wby with a 24" barrel. It's little more than a louder, harder recoiling 25/06. A 257 Wby with less than 26" barrel is a big waste.

Not sure if that was a derogatory comment or not. I happen to have both a Mark V Deluxe and Vanguard First Lite in .257 Wby Mag (aka .257 Roy). Both shoot identically accurate (sub moa) after break in and will punch a hole through 1/4" AR500 at 100 yards. I also have a Mark V Deluxe in 6.5-300 that I bought just because I thought I had to have one. It shoots very well also but after a couple of times at the range, it left me wondering why I bought it when I already had faster and flatter shooting rifles.

The OP mentioned hunting which is why I offered my thoughts on Weatherby. I'm not a fan of medium to large game hunting with the AR-15 platform and the AR-10 platform is just too heavy and cumbersome. I have had an Alexander Arms 6.5 Grendel that I though I might use for hunting but ended up not liking it for anything but the range. Same goes for my .308 AR-10.

As for the carbon fiber barrels, I don't have one but I have looked into them and other then dampening, I really don't see a big enough advantage to make me want to re-barrel. I typically go with JP Rifles match grade barrels on my AR's but I do have one Noveske 5.56 that shoots pretty well also.

[Mobuck]

"I'm looking for the best potential for longer range capabilities which is -from what I've read- where the grendel shines a bit brighter with 20"+ barrel length."

IMHO, "looking for longer range capabilities" within the limitations of the AR15 magazine length is counterproductive. There's a finite limit to the improvements. For range use where all the distances are marked and you have all day to figure distance and drop, maybe there's something the longer slow moving bullets of the 6.5G can do for you.
For field use, the 6.8 is more user friendly but still a moderate range cartridge.

[Mobuck]

".257 Wby Mag (aka .257 Roy)"
or maybe 257 Roberts (aka 257 Bob)

I thought that jargon went away 50 years ago.

[LineStretcher]

Originally Posted by Mobuck

".257 Wby Mag (aka .257 Roy)"
or maybe 257 Roberts (aka 257 Bob)

I thought that jargon went away 50 years ago.

Nope, those of us that love our B's still use the term "Roy" to distinguish the B's from the rest of wanna B's.

[stagpanther]

grendel vs 6.8 is another one of the all-time leaders on the beaten dead-horse list. Grendel can fire slightly higher BC bullets; so it will have better long range performance. Within the "ethical kill range" neither one has much of an edge over the other. If I was going for medium game my personal preference would lean to the 6.8--but the job can certainly be done by a Grendel as well.

[ed308]

Grendel vs 6.8 is another one of the all-time leaders on the beaten dead-horse list. Grendel can fire slightly higher BC bullets; so it will have better long range performance. Within the "ethical kill range" neither one has much of an edge over the other. If I was going for medium game my personal preference would lean to the 6.8--but the job can certainly be done by a Grendel as well.

Exactly my thoughts. Both are great cartridges for the AR15 that have their advantages and disadvantages. I've have more 6.8 since that's what I started with back in 2011 and before the Grendel was a SAAMI cartridge.

[9x19]

Since fire bombs seem to be popular in this thread... 6.5 G vs 6.8 SPCII?

Go Grendel or go home!

Because, the 6.5 has the cooler name!

[stagpanther]

Since fire bombs seem to be popular in this thread... 6.5 G vs 6.8 SPCII?

Go Grendel or go home!

Because, the 6.5 has the cooler name!

I've heard the 6.8 spec called the "pizzanator"--does that make it any better?