First post, DEFECTIVE brand-new Palmetto State Armory AR 15

[Cheaperrooter]

If the trigger group that came in your new AR pistol is crap take to Facebook , emails etc... and slam PSA mercilessly. Replace it with a new trigger group, maybe treat your self to an upgraded trigger group for one of your AR rifles? Check with your AR owning buddies maybe someone held onto a stock group when upgrading

Rotflmao! Agreed. Already have a LONG list of areas to slam, bam, persecute and wham.

[Cheaperrooter]

I have a "start up sequence" that I use for every new AR or every time the FCG is tinkered with. The OP didn't follow any of the normal check procedures meant to assure proper FCG function.

Start up sequence? Well I don't know if you call cleaning a start up sequence but, as with all new weapons, as I indicated earlier, I take them out of the box and thoroughly clean them as they are always shipped with gunk. Cycle it a couple times and pull the trigger to make sure it has a basic function and is operative and than I load up and shoot! But I would hardly call cleaning the weapon "tinkering" with it.

Of course, I don't buy junk and I only buy quality weapons. I have 20+ firearms and they're all solid, well-known names, Smith and Wesson heavy frames for all my revolvers, Colt and CZ for all my semi auto pistols, Colt, Smith and Bushmaster (early good Bushy), and PSA is the first time I have ever deviated because it was the only thing I could find in a ready-made pistol.... and look what the heck happened??? Never again!

But any AR 15 that malfunctions due to dust bunnies or any other debris is something I wouldn't want to own anyway to be honest. You can dump a box of sand inside of a colt AR and they won't malfunction!

But I'm not sure what you were trying to say to be honest, because whether or not I did a sequence start up that you would've done, it would not have alleviated the fact that I had a problem. Whether I found out through sequence or firing the first round, I would be in the exact same boat as I am now.

You're making it sound as if the start up sequence that I did not do somehow screwed up a brand-new firing control group. That is not the case.

Bottom line it looks like I should proceed and install one of the many extra firing groups I have laying around and go from there as I said earlier, if that is the only problem with the weapon I will be tickled pink smiling from ear to ear that it didn't cost me anything out-of-pocket and I was able to fix it without having to deal with PSA.

Then I get to spend the next month dragging their name through the mud to make up for my lost time and irritation and frustration because of their nonexistent quality control and completely absent customer service!

[DubC-Hicks]

I think it's absolutely ridiculous that you are actually wanting to fix it yourself for the sole reason of being able to slander PSA's name. You're actually stating that you can't wait to talk crap, even though you're not letting them even know there's a problem. Give the company a chance to actually fix it. I'd be willing to bet that PSA is probably THE BUSIEST AR company right now. Yes, being on hold sucks. But once they actually speak with you, they WILL take care of the problem.

I've used their customer service twice. Once for a missing disconnector in a trigger group, and once for getting a blem on an upper that wasn't listed as a blem. Both times, I was on hold over 20 minutes and both times it was during busy holiday or election seasons. But guess what? Once I got a customer service rep on the line, they were more than happy to help.

Companies put out lemons and make mistakes. Especially when they're putting out as much product as PSA does. Quality control doesn't catch every single thing. And that's what customer service is for. Let them do their job and stop wanting to trash their reputation without giving them a chance.

[Cheaperrooter]

. I think it's absolutely ridiculous that you are actually wanting to fix it yourself for the sole reason of being able to slander PSA's name. You're actually stating that you can't wait to talk crap, even though you're not letting them even know there's a problem. Give the company a chance to actually fix it. I'd be willing to bet that PSA is probably THE BUSIEST AR company right now. Yes, being on hold sucks. But once they actually speak with you, they WILL take care of the problem.

I think its absolutely ridiculous you haven't read this thread from the beginning and as such, are making RUDE remarks based upon lack of AND incorrect information based upon YOUR lack of willingness to read my remarks before jumping me with YOUR rude remarks...

Absolutely no excuse for such behavior, especially when your conclusions are silly wrong.

And being BUSY is the WORSE excuse for BAD CUSTOMER SERVICE AND A CRAPPY PRODUCT. And FYI? It's not XMAS

[DubC-Hicks]

I did read the entire thread, and I refrained from posting until now. Your comment about wanting to spend the next month dragging their name through the mud is what made me post. It's ridiculous. Along with all the comments about how PSA is worthless and you can't wait to tell everyone how bad they are.

I respect the wanting to fix it yourself. I would too. But doing it just so you can trash a company is low. Fix it yourself if you can with a new trigger group. Then call them and ask them to replace the faulty one. Let them make it right before slandering them.

And if you've done any research on PSA, you'd see that they are getting better as time goes on. They started out small, then became boomingly popular and busy, seemingly overnight a couple years ago. Too big for their britches. They're starting to build more brick and mortar shops and they're upgrading all areas of the business.

Most gun people actually want companies to succeed. Variety is nice.

[Cheaperrooter]

I still find it hard to swallow that you read the entire thread, I really do. But since you're being more kind this time and not as rude, I'll respond equally as well.

Nowhere did I ever post, and if you claim I did, then present it here now as evidence as such, that the only reason I was fixing it was to trash their name.

Not at anytime did I say that I am PURPOSEFULLY and SOLELY fixing it myself for no other reason so I can slander them. If you can present such a statement then I'll concede, but I already know you won't be able to.

It honestly sounds to me like you read my last post, proceeded to made a very broad and general and all encompassing conclusion based upon my last statement. That's the only conclusion that I can come up with, because I'm very perplexed as to where you would've gathered that I was fixing that for that reason.

I was very clear, presented over several and many posts as to my mindset concerning the trip back to the factory.

Next, are you serious? Are you really trying to tell everybody that you would go through the trouble of getting a return and sending this weapon all the way back to the factory if it was a simple trigger control group defective AND you had several of them laying at your house ready for immediate install?

Well, more power to you for wanting to exert so much energy for something simple, but I personally think I would be executing a foolish endeavor on myself to do so.

I will never accept that the reason for a companies horrible customer service is because they are busy. And that fact scares the heck out of me and it's all more the reason that I would stay clear of such a company.

If you have truly read this thread, then you would have seen that i made a post saying the exact same thing you just said, that I had read very good things about this company and obviously they have grown faster than they can handle and as such, they are starting to have issues.

That is NOT a reason, especially in the firearms business where reputation is absolutely everything, to produce a failed product and then have failed customer service to back it up. That is a reason to STOP using the company...

If you had truly read the entire thread, you would have seen where I specifically said that producing a product that has a problem can be turned a blind eye to, but when they lack customer service as well to back it up, that's a double whammy and you can no longer ignore it as being anything more than lose lose.

I have placed a total of three phone calls, it's not Christmas, and I don't know what the heck elections has to do with anything, but it's not election season either. My first two calls I held for over 45 minutes and hung up. I tried again this morning for 32 minutes and hung up.

If you had truly read the thread, you would have seen when I posted that an employee has also told me he has seen more and more of these issues (not less and less) and he is not happy with what's taking place.

If you had truly you read this thread, you would have seen where I said I had googled and seen multiple complaints concerning the exact same issue, going back to 2012. So this is not a temporary problem now is it?

In fact out of all of the posts I have made, I only made ONE that I was going to trash their name for the next month and that was in reference to another poster telling me that's what I should do, and I was agreeing with him. And those were two of my most recent posts.

So I stand firm that I do not think you truly read the whole thread, jumped in at the very end and made an all encompassing conclusion based on reading that post alone. It's something that happens way too frequently on all forums across America and they just shouldn't take place.

Now it's anabsolute given that absolutely nobody wants to sit down and read three pages of posts, I don't have a problem with that, I do it myself. But prior to making a post at the very end of a thread without having made any posts prior on that same thread, before making any accusations, I will either go back and read it all or I will decide not to say what I wanted to say

Growth is a good thing but fast growth has crippled and broke down more companies that I can even count. Controlled growth is extremely important but greed prevents companies from slowing down sales to maintain a quality product.

Many companies have folded and went out of business because of this exact same issue, they grew too fast, they couldn't keep up, but what really put them out of business was because of this, their quality control suffered because they were making stuff too fast, and their focus became on sales and distribution and not on the worrying more about what it was they were selling and they started putting out a crappy product.

That is a story that has been told more times and more businesses that you think somewhere along the line they would've learned. Being busy is not my problem it is their problem.

I'm not in business with them, why should I suffer the growing pains along with them? You're putting out a $9.99 table cloth great. You're producing an $800 AR 15, that is one product that you better not mess up on. Gun owners are very finicky that way..

So it was not just ONE thing, a defective rifle. It was a defective rifle, combined with three long calls that were never answered, combined with an employee telling me he is seeing this company go DOWN, combined with Google research with multiple similar complaints about hold times and defective rifles, going back several years, which is more than enough time for a company to get it together.

So I don't know about your case, but all I can tell you is that in my specific case? Yes, I definitely plan on writing trash about them and that's all I can say!

But I do appreciate your responding to my remarks that you were being rude, your indirect apology was accepted

[Metal god]

My maybe 2nd post ever on any forum was titled PSA sucks or something close to that . I was so mad it took 5 weeks for them to ship me items that were not uppers or lowers . I believe it was ammo , targets and some other doodad . All were listed as instock . They charged my credit card and did not ship for over a month .

If they had not charged my card I think I would not have been as upset . How ever IMHO if you exchange money for a product . That product becomes your property . For them to hold MY property for a month really got under my skin . I went on to trash them every chance I could .

Upon further thought (a few months later) I realized although what they did was not cool . I blew it way out of proportion . I realized the reason I was upset was not so much that they lagged on shipping but I had a shooting vacation planned and those items were for the trip . I ended up having to drive to a few different stores to get what I needed at a much higher price . I ordered them 3+ weeks before we left and they came the day after I got back .

Anyways I actually started a new thread months later apologizing to them because I had done more business with them and they were good . They still ship slow at times and there computer system and account info/updates suck . One of my order status continued to say processing 6 months after I received my items lol .

I think there great for what they are . There prices are good now but 3 years ago they were untouchable for the quality you got . At that time I was willing to except some inconvenience to get a very good product at a great price . I still buy from them several times a year and have learned to click it and forget it until it gets delivered . I NEVER buy anything from them I need ASAP it's just not likely going to happen .

I called once because they forgot to put a part in a lower build kit . If memory serves . It took a couple try's but I did talk to some one and they sent the part right out . OK not "right" out , it took two weeks to get the part but I did get it with out asking again .

So now I'm thinking why was I writing all this I guess to show and say I've dealt with them many times and in this case I believe you should at least give them a chance to make it right .

I'm not sure how many forums you are a member at but this is by far one of the best out there if not the best . I recommend you keep it cool and don't go crazy on a company you've not allowed to make it right for you . As I'm sure you know . There are many here willing to take the time and answer your questions and stick with you until you get the issue worked out . There are some crazy smart , knowledgeable gun guys here and you don't want to burn that bridge by going off on a company before it's deserved . Try not to work your self up into a frenzy like I did to where you're not making sound choices .

PSA had a dedicated thread over on Calguns for these types of things where they actually will respond to your post and help you through the forum . I'll go see if it's still there , If it is I'll link it here .

You'll need to join the forum but post a tread in here and they will answer you . Not sure how long it will take but if you read the threads you'll see they answer them .
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/f...play.php?f=252

[DubC-Hicks]

When they fail in both categories it's time to move on and never make that mistake again, as well as leave the company as many bad reviews as one can muster so that nobody else makes the same mistake.

Would be fine if you let the company check out your problem and they didn't fix it. Not OK if you don't give them the chance.

Yes they are getting away with a defective weapon, but posts like these come to the attention of others and hopefully that's the price they will pay!

Yes, posts like these are good. As long as there's a part in there where you give them the defective weapon and give them a chance to fix it, but they don't.

Rotflmao! Agreed. Already have a LONG list of areas to slam, bam, persecute and wham.

Again, fine. If they don't hold up their end by fixing it.

You can dump a box of sand inside of a colt AR and they won't malfunction!

Just adding because it's ridiculously funny.

I will be tickled pink smiling from ear to ear that it didn't cost me anything out-of-pocket and I was able to fix it without having to deal with PSA.

Then I get to spend the next month dragging their name through the mud to make up for my lost time and irritation and frustration because of their nonexistent quality control and completely absent customer service!

Again, you sound giddy and excited to trash them. When you're purposely fixing it yourself, you're not giving them the real chance to fix it. Customer service is non-existent if you don't use it.

Are you really trying to tell everybody that you would go through the trouble of getting a return and sending this weapon all the way back to the factory if it was a simple trigger control group defective AND you had several of them laying at your house ready for immediate install?

Nope, not at all. I'd fix it myself. But I wouldn't go around talking trash before seeing what their customer service would do. Sure, I'd be upset. Just like I was about not getting a disconnector in my trigger group I ordered. But I called them, waited. And waited. Talked to a rep, and had a disconnector within a week. I gave them the opportunity to fix it and they did.

If you had truly you read this thread, you would have seen where I said I had googled and seen multiple complaints concerning the exact same issue, going back to 2012. So this is not a temporary problem now is it?

Sounds like you should've done your research before buying. To decide if it was worth the risk. It's a well known problem, and a very possible risk.

Yes, I definitely plan on writing trash about them and that's all I can say!

And there's one more.

But I do appreciate your responding to my remarks that you were being rude, your indirect apology was accepted

I don't believe I was being rude in my first reply, and there was nothing resembling an indirect apology in my 2nd.

Now I'm done being rude, and my rant is over. That was actually my first rant in the 8 years I've been on here. Sorry to everyone else for derailing the troubleshooting.

[Cheaperrooter]

Well, I'm really tired and don't want to get into a he said she said, especially when it's in writing for all to see what WAS said, but in short, your point was still not validated.

You did not prove your point nor show I said as you claimed, even after all that distractional footwork. No one claims I don't WANT to leave them a bad review, that's a given. You claimed that the ONLY reason I fixed it was to leave them a bad review. That was the entire purpose of your post. You didn't find it ridiculous that I was going to, only that I purposely fixed so I could do. And nothing you just wrote proves that.

So the things you posted did not achieve that. Some of them, were exactly like I said, my recent couple posts, so they don't count.

Other things that you posted didn't make sense and were taken WAY out of context, like I googled it and saw multiple complaints. You said I should've researched.

You took that out of context because if you HAD read and looked back earlier, I said that while I was in the store I googled them and saw GOOD reviews, but AFTER experiencing problems I did a deeper research and then found those issues.

Sounds like you just now went back for the first time and only focused your eyes looking for anything negative I had to say, but you can't take them out of context with the rest of the statements I made because they all form to create a certain flow and mindset which would have only been achieved if you had been following the thread from the beginning.

And/or had read the entire thread for the beginning...

The general flow of my mindset which I think everyone else perfectly understood because they were following the thread from the beginning, was that I am not going to send the product back to a company that will involve massive delays when I cannot even get a hold of them presently to even get a return label, cuz I am currently experiencing massive delays.

I made it abundantly clear from the very beginning that I was willing to pay for this no matter what the cost was because I didn't want to get involved in the weapon sitting around for two months at the factory and then spend hours on the phone trying to check on the status of it, which is obvious will take place because I am currently spending hours on the phone and can't even a hold of them, to get a return label.

So stop saying WITHOUT GIVING THEM A CHANCE, as calling 3 times WAS giving them a chance. But for a trigger issue, no, sorry, not going to waste hours on the phone, months in repair, for a $40 part I have 2 of collecting dust.

Nowhere does that equate to fixing it for the SOLE purpose, as you said, so I can trash them, and everything you just wrote does not prove it still!

But really, no need to apologize, sticking to your unproven point, just keep going on about how your statements were justified...

And yes, you were very rude, that's just the way it is! You weren't participating in this thread, you weren't offering help and assistance in finding a solution as every one was doing.

Everyone else was wasting their own personal time they could have spent elsewhere, trying to assist a new member and those are the individuals that I would maybe listen to because they earned the right to say something negative because they were the ones involved.

But you just bounced on at the very end and started saying derogatory things to me and that my friend is considered rude.

Anywho, sorry, I am not going to say good things about them. But NOT because of the weapon being defective, but that I absolutely despise ANY company that makes you hold for 45 long minutes, several times in a row. Because that shows right there that the company doesn't care about their customers, because if they did, they wouldn't keep them on hold...

OK that's it for me on my and I'd rather not discuss this any further. I would like to get back to focusing on the solution and I have not put in the trigger control group yet but I will tomorrow and update.

[Spats McGee]

Too much heat and too little light in this thread.

Accordingly, closed.

[Spats McGee]

The thread is closed, but Cheaperrooter asked that I add the following:

Update: The firing control group has been installed and it definitely solved the problem!

I very much appreciate everybody's interest, help, tests and ideas to identify what the issue is I was having to get to the bottom of the malfunction. I would've never thought it was a trigger / hammer issue.

A newbie says thanks to all!!!!