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Old August 30, 2000, 07:49 PM   #1
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Join Date: July 20, 2000
Location: pasadena,california,America
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This real situation keeps occuring over and over again all over this nation and I haven't come up with a good course of action yet for myself should this happen when I'm there...I'm still thinking of all the options...

McDonald's/Burger King/Wendy's, any fast food place...You're there BG comes in the door and starts firing at the employees first..Bugout? move to cover then try to take him out?
Now, here's the're not usually there by yourself. Your kid is with what?
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Old August 30, 2000, 08:35 PM   #2
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Join Date: April 11, 1999
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Your responsibility is you and your dependents. Even if your kid is not present, he's still your kid and he needs his parent for years to come. You must save your neck. You must save your dependents' necks. You must also save yourself so you can continue to provide for your dependents.

If you can save the burger-flippers, great; plugging the perp can save a lot of people a lot of grief. If you hide or escape and survive while the burger-flippers get shot, congrats on saving your own skin, and remember that the counter crew chose a high-risk job and chose to not exercise their defensive rights - tragic, but it's not your problem.

M'lady insists that I outlive her. When survival priorities clash, loyalty to her overrides defense of complete strangers who chose to be unarmed.

There are a lot of strong views on this scenario; both sides are valid. My take is (a) that if I'm dead, I'm no good to anybody, and (b) I'm not responsible for a stranger's lack of preparendess.

What do YOU think the answer is?
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Old August 30, 2000, 09:41 PM   #3
Zach Vonler
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Join Date: June 29, 1999
Posts: 126
My whole reason for getting a CHL was that exact scenario. The shooting at the church in Fort Worth convinced me that it really can happen anywhere, anytime, and that one trained person could save themselves and others. I realized that I feel I can keep my cool and would be able to stop someone in that scenario, and so would hate myself forever if I didn't go through the relatively small amount of trouble it takes to be prepared for such a situation and then had to watch people die just because of it. Since there are few particulars, it's hard to give details, but I would seek an advantageous spot and do my best to stop him as quick as possible. I think that "seeking an advantageous spot" includes not only taking any cover possible, but moving away from the family members, since if you don't drop the guy instantly it's likely he's going to return fire in your direction. Get the family members to hit the deck and tell them to stay there, then move to where errant shots by the bg at you won't hit them.
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Old August 31, 2000, 07:24 AM   #4
David Scott
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Join Date: February 11, 2000
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Here in Florida, you have no legal obligation to stop the bad guy from shooting the Mickey Dee staff, but the law will cover you if you do so -- it cites "stopping a violent felony in progress" as justified use of force. If it's one assailant, and I could get a clear shot, I would engage him with no warnings (he's already started shooting so he's fair game). If he's shooting the staff he's probably not looking in your direction. I have no problem with the idea of doing a Mozambique on such an aggressor's back.

Multiple BGs is another story. I'd have to make a quick assessment of whether I could get them all before the element of surprise wore off. If so, one bullet in each from right to left (I'm right handed), then one bullet each from left to right, then assess for follow up (this is why I love hi-cap mags).

Any loved ones with me would probably already be on the floor or out the door (if it was close enough). If you carry, it's important to tell those who are usually with you how to act. Of course, once Thelma's permit comes through, she'll probably be at Ready and covering my flank in case Mister BG has friends.
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