New guy needs help.

GaryHarris · April 24, 2011, 04:16 PM

Howdy from Texas and please excuse my noobness.

I have checked in here off and on for awhile and just registered so I could use the search function to gather the info I require for being totally new, and I sorta came up empty. I also read the top "Sticky" and that has to be a ton of info if I knew a little more about BP.

About me. I'm looking for an old western or military type long barrel revolver to use for home protection and target shooting. My budget is about $500 and that needs to include cleaning kit, balls, powder, etc and whatever else Ill need. Like a starter kit of sorts.

If my starting budget seems to come up short, please lead me in the right direction. I have many other hobbies and understand the mentality of a noob thinking of getting by cheap for now and paying the price later.

I would like to make one order to get started, but I only know enough to be dangerous. I need yall's help.

Thanks.

Gary

Fingers McGee · April 24, 2011, 04:34 PM

First off, Welcome to the forum

Secondly, I am a dyed in the wool Colt Style revolver shooter. With that said, IMNSHO, for a complete Noob, you should start with a steel framed, 44 cal '58 Remington clone. That is probably the easiest C&B to get started with. The Colt style revolvers can be finicky; even for an experienced shooter.

You should be able to get a blued, steel framed revolver, holster, powder and powder flask, balls, wads, cleaning supplies, caps, set of gunsmith screwdrivers, and possibles bag to carry it all in for well under your target of $500.00. A CCH framed or all stainless '58 might push you a little over $500.

I am certain that there will be numerous others chiming in; and, there is boucoup knowledge amongst forum members. Have fun, and let us know how it goes.

FM

GaryHarris · April 24, 2011, 04:46 PM

Thanks FM.

I'm a cuttin-n-pastin now!

Bishop Creek · April 24, 2011, 05:40 PM

I second what Fingers said. The Colt style revolvers are nice (I have several, Fingers has hundreds), but a steel framed 1858 Remington from Cabelas would be the way to go for a person new to the sport. Plus, it is a replica of the military New Model Army issued to Union troops during the Civil War and used extensively on the Frontier of the Old West era by cowboys and scouts. It remained Buffalo Bill's favorite sidearm even after the introduction of cartridge revolvers.

I have three of them and all are fine shooters and easier to shoot and clean than a Colt. Order from Cabelas because the prices are the lowest for them and in the off chance you get a lemon you can exchange it with no problems. I know of no other place where they will do this.

Hawg · April 24, 2011, 05:43 PM

+1 on steel frame Remington from Cabela's.

Don't get the starter kit tho, buy everything individually.

GaryHarris · April 24, 2011, 05:49 PM

Thanks for the help and welcome guys. I could use some links though.

How's this one?

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Shoot...3Bcat104503680

Hawg · April 24, 2011, 05:55 PM

That will work if you just want stainless so I don't know how the action is on them. I never had a stainless but have had several blued ones. If you want a really smooth action and good looks take a look at this one.

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Shoot...3Bcat104503680

Bill Akins · April 24, 2011, 05:55 PM

Welcome to the forum Gary.

I second the advice to get a model 1858 (actually technically 1863) Remington first. Just don't expect to use it as a home defense gun as you posted in your first post you wanted to do. Yes it could act for that if that's all you had, but it isn't an optimal home defense gun in these modern times. I would suggest getting a stainless steel one. You can pick up a used but great shape stainless one on gunbroker.com firearms auctions or on Auction Arms auctions, or even sometimes here in the black powder buy sell trade section (at the very top of this forum) from anywhere between approx $225.00 to $275.00
The stainless are MUCH easier to clean, keep clean and not rust, plus they are shiny and look real nice

Also there is no cold blue touchup from holster wear needed on stainless ones. Nothing wrong with blue ones, I just find that stainless is easier to maintain.

.

Hawg · April 24, 2011, 05:57 PM

If cleaning got any easier than with my blued ones I couldn't stand it.

Bishop Creek · April 24, 2011, 06:02 PM

Quote:

If cleaning got any easier than with my blued ones I couldn't stand it.

Same here.

GaryHarris · April 24, 2011, 06:35 PM

Thanks guys!

Thank you very much for the warm welcome and the expert advise. I hope one day to learn as much as yall know and return the favor in order to help other noobs and further promote the sport.

I'm definitely leaning towards the stainless steel '58 and I also had picked the one that Hawg Hagen pointed out before the suggestion of SS was introduced. I didn't like the diamond grip though. No biggy... That's a sweet rig!

I'm about to place my order, is it cool if I ask many more questions?

Wads? Grain?, other stuff a noob needs to get started?

Thanks!

Doc Hoy · April 24, 2011, 06:43 PM

I guess you can tell that you came to the right place.

Bishop Creek · April 24, 2011, 07:15 PM

That pistol is a good choice. I shoot only real black powder so I'll recommend about 28 grains of Goex fffg (ffg works too) in each chamber with a lubed Wonder Wad on top of the powder and a .451 or .454 round ball rammed on top and (this is a BIG "and") No. 10 Remington percussion caps.

Hawg · April 24, 2011, 07:56 PM

.454 ball works best and I prefer CCI caps. I get a lot of Remingtons that lose the priming compound. Wonder wads or vegetable based lube over the balls. Wads are less messy. You need a good nipple wrench. Cappers don't work well with the Remington design. Real black if you can get it, loose Pyrodex if you cant. Cleanup is with hot soapy water. Do not use any petroleum based lubes (ie gun oil) in the bore or chambers. It's fine in the action. A good gunsmiths screwdriver set is a good idea. Next!

T. O'Heir · April 24, 2011, 08:48 PM

Hi. Kind of surprised a Texan would think of anything but a .44 calibre, Walker Dragoon. 9" barrel and nearly 4.5 pounds. Buffalo Arms sells the Uberti copy at $381.09.
However, like Bill Akins says, BP revolvers aren't the best thing for HD.

starbuck125 · April 24, 2011, 09:17 PM

welcome,
as far as asking questions, i'm thinkin everybody likes to chime in on what to use, whats best to clean up with. theres a ton of knowledge on this site... have a qustion?? ask. if ya come across a problem...ask. always glad to see somebody new to bp join the ranks. but be carefull....ya'll get to like it

as far as home defense goes, later on when funds become available you could get a conversion kit for the 58 rem (63 rem, sorry bill) to fire cowboy rds.
i do keep my remmie beside my bed, but i also got a 12 gauge pump in the closet a few feet away

.

Fingers McGee · April 24, 2011, 10:55 PM

See, I told ya that you'd get lots of advice. I did forget to mention about the '58 Remington being a good platform for an R&D or Kirst cartridge conversion cylinder in .45 Colt. Thanks for bringing that up Starbuck. I've had a couple and they're as much fun to shoot as the C&B cylinder is; with BP cartridges of course.

arcticap · April 24, 2011, 11:36 PM

It's easier to load the powder and ram the projectile with the cylinder off the frame using a loading press. Some folks make their own.

http://www.biglube.com/

http://www.blackdawgecartridge.com/c...R_ID=451257070

http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product...a4293822c912b9

Even without a loading press, a loading stand to hold the gun upright while loading is a helpful item. Many folks make their own.

http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product...a4293822c912b9

Hawg · April 24, 2011, 11:58 PM

Quote:

It's easier to load the powder and ram the projectile with the cylinder off the frame using a loading press. Some folks make their own.

Even without a loading press, a loading stand to hold the gun upright while loading is a helpful item. Many folks make their own.

I use neither.

ClemBert · April 25, 2011, 09:22 AM

Welcome to the forum! Another one converted to the Church of the Holy Black.

You could even keep it under $200 with the plain jane 1858.

I own the shorty version of the Pietta SS 1858. It's the only BP revolver I own where the timing is such that the bolt drops into the cylinder slot EXACTLY as the hammer locks into firing position. Usually the bolt drops a little earlier.

wogpotter · April 25, 2011, 01:51 PM

Whatever you get, if you're thinking of a percussion revolver for H/D or S/D make 100% certain you have tested every component of the gun, the load, & the shooter till there is the lowest imaginable failure rate on loading & firing!

I say this because the 1860's technology was definitely not as standardized, or consistent as 20th & 21st Century is. Little things like caps mis-matched to the individual nipples of your exact pistol can cause misfires or FTF & in a self defense mode that can be a HUGE problem. Actually test fire every single component multiple times so you don't have a false sense of security.

Doc Hoy · April 25, 2011, 02:11 PM

......Hearing protection and eye protection.

GaryHarris · April 26, 2011, 11:04 PM

Thanks for the help guys.

I ordered the 1858 New Army Stainless Steel .44 Caliber Revolver last night and we will see how it goes.

EDIT: I have been studying the rules and all the safety precautions at my local shooting range.

Doc Hoy · April 27, 2011, 05:36 AM

Depending upon how the range is run, it may be to your advantage to train as a rangemaster.

It may give you the opportunity to shoot on your own.

April 24, 2011, 04:16 PM	#1
GaryHarris Junior Member Join Date: April 24, 2011 Posts: 6	New guy needs help. Howdy from Texas and please excuse my noobness. I have checked in here off and on for awhile and just registered so I could use the search function to gather the info I require for being totally new, and I sorta came up empty. I also read the top "Sticky" and that has to be a ton of info if I knew a little more about BP. About me. I'm looking for an old western or military type long barrel revolver to use for home protection and target shooting. My budget is about $500 and that needs to include cleaning kit, balls, powder, etc and whatever else Ill need. Like a starter kit of sorts. If my starting budget seems to come up short, please lead me in the right direction. I have many other hobbies and understand the mentality of a noob thinking of getting by cheap for now and paying the price later. I would like to make one order to get started, but I only know enough to be dangerous. I need yall's help. Thanks. Gary

April 24, 2011, 04:34 PM	#2
Fingers McGee Senior Member Join Date: March 19, 2008 Location: High & Dry in Missouri Ozarks Posts: 2,113	First off, Welcome to the forum Secondly, I am a dyed in the wool Colt Style revolver shooter. With that said, IMNSHO, for a complete Noob, you should start with a steel framed, 44 cal '58 Remington clone. That is probably the easiest C&B to get started with. The Colt style revolvers can be finicky; even for an experienced shooter. You should be able to get a blued, steel framed revolver, holster, powder and powder flask, balls, wads, cleaning supplies, caps, set of gunsmith screwdrivers, and possibles bag to carry it all in for well under your target of $500.00. A CCH framed or all stainless '58 might push you a little over $500. I am certain that there will be numerous others chiming in; and, there is boucoup knowledge amongst forum members. Have fun, and let us know how it goes. FM __________________ Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee - AKA Man of Many Colts - Alter ego of Diabolical Ken; SASS Regulator 28564-L-TG; Rangemaster and stage writer extraordinaire; Frontiersman, Pistoleer, NRA Endowment Life, NMLRA, SAF, CCRKBA, STORM 327, SV115; Charter member, Central Ozarks Western Shooters Cynic: A blackguard whose faulty vision see things as they are, not as they should be. Ambrose Bierce Last edited by Fingers McGee; April 24, 2011 at 10:52 PM.

April 24, 2011, 05:55 PM	#8
Bill Akins Senior Member Join Date: August 28, 2007 Location: Hudson, Florida Posts: 1,135	Welcome to the forum Gary. I second the advice to get a model 1858 (actually technically 1863) Remington first. Just don't expect to use it as a home defense gun as you posted in your first post you wanted to do. Yes it could act for that if that's all you had, but it isn't an optimal home defense gun in these modern times. I would suggest getting a stainless steel one. You can pick up a used but great shape stainless one on gunbroker.com firearms auctions or on Auction Arms auctions, or even sometimes here in the black powder buy sell trade section (at the very top of this forum) from anywhere between approx $225.00 to $275.00 The stainless are MUCH easier to clean, keep clean and not rust, plus they are shiny and look real nice Also there is no cold blue touchup from holster wear needed on stainless ones. Nothing wrong with blue ones, I just find that stainless is easier to maintain. . __________________ "This is my Remy and this is my Colt. Remy loads easy and topstrap strong, Colt balances better and never feels wrong. A repro black powder revolver gun, they smoke and shoot lead and give me much fun. I can't figure out which one I like better, they're both fine revolvers that fit in my leather". "To be sure of hitting the target, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target". Last edited by Bill Akins; April 24, 2011 at 06:12 PM.

April 24, 2011, 06:43 PM	#12
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Welcome, Gary I guess you can tell that you came to the right place. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

April 24, 2011, 08:48 PM	#15
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	Hi. Kind of surprised a Texan would think of anything but a .44 calibre, Walker Dragoon. 9" barrel and nearly 4.5 pounds. Buffalo Arms sells the Uberti copy at $381.09. However, like Bill Akins says, BP revolvers aren't the best thing for HD. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

April 24, 2011, 04:46 PM	#3
GaryHarris Junior Member Join Date: April 24, 2011 Posts: 6	Thanks FM. I'm a cuttin-n-pastin now!

April 24, 2011, 05:40 PM	#4
Bishop Creek Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2011 Posts: 566	I second what Fingers said. The Colt style revolvers are nice (I have several, Fingers has hundreds), but a steel framed 1858 Remington from Cabelas would be the way to go for a person new to the sport. Plus, it is a replica of the military New Model Army issued to Union troops during the Civil War and used extensively on the Frontier of the Old West era by cowboys and scouts. It remained Buffalo Bill's favorite sidearm even after the introduction of cartridge revolvers. I have three of them and all are fine shooters and easier to shoot and clean than a Colt. Order from Cabelas because the prices are the lowest for them and in the off chance you get a lemon you can exchange it with no problems. I know of no other place where they will do this.

April 24, 2011, 05:43 PM	#5
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,189	+1 on steel frame Remington from Cabela's. Don't get the starter kit tho, buy everything individually.

April 24, 2011, 05:49 PM	#6
GaryHarris Junior Member Join Date: April 24, 2011 Posts: 6	Thanks for the help and welcome guys. I could use some links though. How's this one? http://www.cabelas.com/product/Shoot...3Bcat104503680

April 24, 2011, 05:57 PM	#9
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,189	If cleaning got any easier than with my blued ones I couldn't stand it.

April 24, 2011, 06:35 PM	#11
GaryHarris Junior Member Join Date: April 24, 2011 Posts: 6	Thanks guys! Thank you very much for the warm welcome and the expert advise. I hope one day to learn as much as yall know and return the favor in order to help other noobs and further promote the sport. I'm definitely leaning towards the stainless steel '58 and I also had picked the one that Hawg Hagen pointed out before the suggestion of SS was introduced. I didn't like the diamond grip though. No biggy... That's a sweet rig! I'm about to place my order, is it cool if I ask many more questions? Wads? Grain?, other stuff a noob needs to get started? Thanks!

April 24, 2011, 07:15 PM	#13
Bishop Creek Senior Member Join Date: March 20, 2011 Posts: 566	That pistol is a good choice. I shoot only real black powder so I'll recommend about 28 grains of Goex fffg (ffg works too) in each chamber with a lubed Wonder Wad on top of the powder and a .451 or .454 round ball rammed on top and (this is a BIG "and") No. 10 Remington percussion caps.

April 24, 2011, 07:56 PM	#14
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,189	.454 ball works best and I prefer CCI caps. I get a lot of Remingtons that lose the priming compound. Wonder wads or vegetable based lube over the balls. Wads are less messy. You need a good nipple wrench. Cappers don't work well with the Remington design. Real black if you can get it, loose Pyrodex if you cant. Cleanup is with hot soapy water. Do not use any petroleum based lubes (ie gun oil) in the bore or chambers. It's fine in the action. A good gunsmiths screwdriver set is a good idea. Next!

April 24, 2011, 09:17 PM	#16
starbuck125 Senior Member Join Date: October 11, 2009 Location: kentucky Posts: 140	welcome, as far as asking questions, i'm thinkin everybody likes to chime in on what to use, whats best to clean up with. theres a ton of knowledge on this site... have a qustion?? ask. if ya come across a problem...ask. always glad to see somebody new to bp join the ranks. but be carefull....ya'll get to like it as far as home defense goes, later on when funds become available you could get a conversion kit for the 58 rem (63 rem, sorry bill) to fire cowboy rds. i do keep my remmie beside my bed, but i also got a 12 gauge pump in the closet a few feet away.

April 24, 2011, 10:55 PM	#17
Fingers McGee Senior Member Join Date: March 19, 2008 Location: High & Dry in Missouri Ozarks Posts: 2,113	See, I told ya that you'd get lots of advice. I did forget to mention about the '58 Remington being a good platform for an R&D or Kirst cartridge conversion cylinder in .45 Colt. Thanks for bringing that up Starbuck. I've had a couple and they're as much fun to shoot as the C&B cylinder is; with BP cartridges of course. __________________ Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee - AKA Man of Many Colts - Alter ego of Diabolical Ken; SASS Regulator 28564-L-TG; Rangemaster and stage writer extraordinaire; Frontiersman, Pistoleer, NRA Endowment Life, NMLRA, SAF, CCRKBA, STORM 327, SV115; Charter member, Central Ozarks Western Shooters Cynic: A blackguard whose faulty vision see things as they are, not as they should be. Ambrose Bierce

April 24, 2011, 11:36 PM	#18
arcticap Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2005 Location: Central Connecticut Posts: 3,166	It's easier to load the powder and ram the projectile with the cylinder off the frame using a loading press. Some folks make their own. http://www.biglube.com/ http://www.blackdawgecartridge.com/c...R_ID=451257070 http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product...a4293822c912b9 Even without a loading press, a loading stand to hold the gun upright while loading is a helpful item. Many folks make their own. http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product...a4293822c912b9 Last edited by arcticap; April 27, 2011 at 12:38 AM.

April 25, 2011, 09:22 AM	#20
ClemBert Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2009 Location: Orlando Posts: 936	Welcome to the forum! Another one converted to the Church of the Holy Black. You could even keep it under $200 with the plain jane 1858. I own the shorty version of the Pietta SS 1858. It's the only BP revolver I own where the timing is such that the bolt drops into the cylinder slot EXACTLY as the hammer locks into firing position. Usually the bolt drops a little earlier.

April 25, 2011, 01:51 PM	#21
wogpotter Senior Member Join Date: September 27, 2004 Posts: 4,811	Whatever you get, if you're thinking of a percussion revolver for H/D or S/D make 100% certain you have tested every component of the gun, the load, & the shooter till there is the lowest imaginable failure rate on loading & firing! I say this because the 1860's technology was definitely not as standardized, or consistent as 20th & 21st Century is. Little things like caps mis-matched to the individual nipples of your exact pistol can cause misfires or FTF & in a self defense mode that can be a HUGE problem. Actually test fire every single component multiple times so you don't have a false sense of security. __________________ Allan Quatermain: “Automatic rifles. Who in God's name has automatic rifles”? Elderly Hunter: “That's dashed unsporting. Probably Belgium.”

April 25, 2011, 02:11 PM	#22
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	And don't forget..... ......Hearing protection and eye protection. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

April 26, 2011, 11:04 PM	#23
GaryHarris Junior Member Join Date: April 24, 2011 Posts: 6	Thanks for the help guys. I ordered the 1858 New Army Stainless Steel .44 Caliber Revolver last night and we will see how it goes. EDIT: I have been studying the rules and all the safety precautions at my local shooting range.

April 27, 2011, 05:36 AM	#24
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Gary Depending upon how the range is run, it may be to your advantage to train as a rangemaster. It may give you the opportunity to shoot on your own. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.