New to me 1911. (caution: Bubba content)

[Hungary Bill]

Greetings everyone. I've recently taken a 1911 on trade for some old engine parts I wasn't going to use and I thought I'd show it here and just ask a few questions. This is my second 1911. My first was a Colt 1991A1 that just needed food. I'm hoping to play a bit more with this one, so here goes.

So the trade involved this 1911, and a few spare parts:

















(I seem to be having trouble posting pictures. The links should work for you though)

What you're looking at is a 1943 Colt Gov model. Basic stuff that's been molested by a father and son duo a bit and honestly, I'm not sure to what extent.

As I understand, the stippling kind of kills any collector value, and I really didn't know if what I was looking at was a REALLY worn parkerized finish, or a re-blued and then really worn blued finish. I understand the pictures aren't the best, if needed I can take better ones.

The sights look raised but are otherwise an "unknown" to me. Please remind me to take better pictures of the front sight. I'd like your opinions on that one.

The marking near the hammer on the right side is too faded for me to really see, does someone here know what that might be? There is also a "GHD" near the slide release and a "P" near the mag release. Otherwise just your basic "US Property" stuff. (no markings on the barrel that I can see)

The trigger has the adjustment screw. Is this an aftermarket adition?

I haven't shot this yet, but lockup is good. No barrel to bushing movement and there doesn't seem to be any takeup before the hammer drops (I might try to adjust that).

I guess, what I was hoping to get from this post is just reassurance that I can go ahead and play with this thing and not ruin anything special. My hope was to make a smooth accurate shooter, while retaining practicality, and keeping an old military look to the pistol.

Aside from new springs (16lb Wolff kit ordered from midway) what would you recommend?

Thanks for reading!



TLDR: I bought a bubba'd military pistol and want to change parts with aftermarket parts to take it to the range and possibly carry.

[Jim Watson]

I see a USGI 1911A1 with modifications including front strap stippled, high profile fixed sights, an aftermarket trigger, and walnut grips instead of 1943 plastic.

GHD = Guy H. Drewry, chief inspector
P= Proof tested
The mark on the right side is a US Ordnance stamp, they seem to be more often unevenly stamped than hit squarely.

I can't read the serial number but if it is under 1,139,000, look under the firing pin stop to see if that is the original matching slide. They quit bothering to number them after that.

If it were mine, I would clean it but without steel wool or wire brush, just oil or solvent and rag and old tooth brush. Give it a fresh recoil spring and a buffer and it should do for moderate shooting.
And don't store it in the holster which can hold moisture and cause rust.

[lamarw]

I would keep it as original as possible. Here is a site you can go to for research and comparison of what you have and what might be correct: http://coolgunsite.com/

You may want to look on eBay or GunBroker for original grips. The pictures you posted are blurry, but you may want to try to ID the wood grips and see if they are the correct ones off an M1911. If so, you may want to sell them and on one of the auction sites for good money and to help another pistol owner. Generally, it depends upon the number of checkers between the large diamonds on the grips. I seem to recall the Colt M1911 had 13 checkers. Others manufacturers may of only had 12. Do not trust my memory. Look at Coolsite.

As Jim stated, you will want the correct plastic grips. Then you may want a correct era magazine if the one you have is not.

Hope you research is fruitful and have fun. Post better pictures if you get a chance.

CMP maybe selling some of the old M911A1s in the future.

Even in less than originally or great condition, these pistols are still desirable by some.

[Hungary Bill]

Really? I gotta be honest, that was probably the most positive response I've seen to a stippled/modified 1911 yet Interesting.

My google-fu so far has revealed nothing but doom and gloom when someone presented a similarly aged 1911 in similar condition. Cool!

The serial number is 1115###. I'll check my slide tonight and let you know if it's matching or not.

As far as the sights go. It looks like there might be some sort of tack welding done? I understand the pictured are still blurry, I swear they looked much crisper before I uploaded them on the computer. My concern here is if I try to go back to the original sights, I may uncover damage to the slide.

As to the finish, it's definitely not parkerization. I had my garand taken apart last night and looked at the finish on the high wear areas and the 1911 has definitely been blued.

Thanks guys.

I guess since it's not as bad as I thought, does anyone have an estimation as to what its value might be as it sits? Like I said, I was under the impression it was all but worthless as anything other than a shooter before.

[Hungary Bill]

Here are some spare parts I got with the pistol:

HS stamped barrel with no lug, slide, various extractors, recoil springs, firing pin, barrel lug, triggers, iron sights, magazine with no spring or follower, screws, etc.



No markings on the right side of the slide



The prancing horse is in the middle of the left side, the patent dates go through 1913.



No ordinance mark on the back right side by the hammer



Slightly lower sights than the complete 1911 has, but they still look aftermarket to me?



I was trying to show the HS markings on this one... fail



These were all taken on day 1. I think it's time I tried another camera.

The plan I had going in my head was to snag a random blued 1911 frame and make a sister shooter out of it, but I'd like to hear what you guys think.

Cheers!

(cool gun site places the patent dates at 1914-1945 84,000 to end, and the prancing cold placement at 285,000 to end. That really IS a cool gun site)

[James K]

The sights on both slides are after market, put on as one step toward making a "target pistol". Restoring the originals may be difficult as the sights are about impossible to find and the slide usually has been modified somewhat (usually the rear sight dovetail and/or the front sight slot have been modified to accommodate the new sights.

Many thousands of GI pistols were "enhanced" (spelled ruined) by such half-way work. The owner or gunsmith did just enough to destroy the collector value of the gun, while not doing enough to really make it a decent target pistol. Such a shame.

I would treat both guns as shooters, and enjoy them without spending any time or money trying to "restore" them.

Jim

[Hungary Bill]

Thanks James. That's about what I'd been reading from similar examples.

You know, it really is a bummer but that's what makes a "classic" a "classic" right? At one time it was just "common" or even just "last years model". The ones that survived are special because they survived.

It'll be a great shooter, and a great range conversation piece. And that's really what I was looking for in the trade Once I get some food for her, I'll let you know how it looks on paper.

Thanks everyone!

[dahermit]

The owner or gunsmith did just enough to destroy the collector value of the gun, while not doing enough to really make it a decent target pistol.

Not everyone is interested in making a "target pistol". Some just want a shooter for other purposes (self defense, house gun, plinking, etc.), with decent sights...and G.I. sights are really poor for any use except for a collector to keep as original.

[Jim Watson]

This gun might have been sold by the DCM through NRA for $17 when a new Colt was $81.
The gunzines were full of articles on how to improve your army surplus guns.

That is one reason that you can now expect to pay $2000 for a nice Army surplus 1911 and five to fifty times that for one with no other difference than a trademark.

[Hungary Bill]

a $17 1911?

Maaaaaaan, if I could go back in time...

[James K]

"Maaaaaaan, if I could go back in time..."

"Since you are closing your factory here in Paterson, Mr. Colt, I will happily take all that old junk off your hands..."

"I'd like to change this old paper money for gold; of course the paper is good, don't worry about those small bills with funny colors and big pictures..."

Jim

[Hungary Bill]

I ordered some goodies to start making that extra slide into a pistol. Firing pin, firing pin spring, firing pin stop, and extractor mostly. I also picked up a Wolff spring to turn that empty extra magazine frame and follower into something useful.

Next on the list is the barrel lug for the HS barrel (and pin) recoil spring, guide and plug. It'll have to wait till after the holidays though, I'm supposed to be shopping for goodies for OTHER people this time of year.

One piece at a time

[SIGSHR]

Yes, I wince at that stippling. A spare GI slide should be fairly easy to find, keep that other for more "serious" range use.