Need a short range varmint rifle

redneck · August 12, 2002, 11:22 AM

I'm thinking of buying another gun, maybe making a project out of it. Anyhow, unless I find time to get a hunting license, the main use will pest control around the farm.
My first thought is that I've gotten by with my dad's old .22LR for this long, I should just get another one. Only I'll fix it up so that I can shoot it a lot better. (The sights on the old remington are kind of crude and won't adjust low enough)
But the latest problem has been coyotes. A big plot of farmland (close to a square mile with the adjoining creek and woods) about 3/4 mile away was just taken by eminent domain and turned into a park. No one hunts there anymore so critter populations are on the rise. We've seen several coyote and fox around the area, and have had a few coming up around the barn and the horses. So that got me to wondering about .22Mag and the new .17HRM.

The area is all 5 acre lots scattered among fields but its growing fast. All shots will be under 100 yards, more likely between 50 and 75. Its safe to shoot if your careful about the direction, but I don't want something thats going to carry a long ways and hit something that was out of sight. So what do you guys think would be the best choice? I want to go fairly inexpensive, maybe a marlin bolt action or a taurus pump, if I can't find a used gun to fix up.

I also thought about a shotgun, but haven't found a good source for anything but birdshot around here. Buckshots not legal for deer here so no one carries it.

Any ideas?
Thanks

labgrade · August 12, 2002, 01:21 PM

The .22 rimmfires are pretty notorious for bouncing off things & going in directions you'd not want or expect. No clue as to what that new .17 would do.

In a built-up area, I think I'd go for something with quite a bit more zip & a very frangible bullet - Blitz, TNT type of thing. You want that bullet to desinegrate upon first impact.

Sounds like a .223, or the .17 centerfire'd be just the ticket.

HankB · August 12, 2002, 01:46 PM

At 50 to 75 yards, a .22 rimfire will do the job, a .22 mag will be better. A .223 will extend your range to several hundred yards, but may be more cartridge than you're looking for.

For your limited application, a .22 Hornet would seem to fill the bill.

I'd advise against the new .17 rimfire cartridge. It reminds me too much of Remington's 5mm Magnum Rimfire. Introduced with a big splash, rifles were only made for a few years, ammo for only a few more. Unless someone laid in a BIG supply of ammo 20 years ago, the rifles are now good only for gathering dust. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the .17 rimfire goes the same way.

Al Thompson · August 12, 2002, 03:40 PM

I'd stay away from shotguns and buckshot. Getting good results at ranges in excess of 50 yards is tough.

If you reload, the Hornet is a good choice. Not a reloader, the .22 Mag.

What's your budget?

redneck · August 12, 2002, 05:08 PM

Its starting to sound like .22mag. I figured I'd see what was worth looking into and what was available before setting a real budget, I figure on trying to keep the gun under $250 if I can. And then seeing what else I want to do like a scope/different sights.
One thing about the .17HRM, its only loaded with Vmax bullets so they may fragment pretty well on first impact, and if it does go down the toilet I could probably buy a .22mag barrel for the same rifle.

.223 or .22hornet would be pretty cool as theres so many more things I could do with it later on, but I haven't got the money to get into something like that. I figure I can get a pretty good quality rimfire in my range vs. a pretty low end centerfire. And I don't reload.

I was sort of thinking of either refinishing an old gun or making a new stock for a new gun that comes with a cheap stock like marlin's model 25. Not really necessary, but it might be a fun project this winter.I don't think I'd want to screw with a higher priced gun on my first try. I make knives and do some woodworking and carving, for some reason working on a gun sounds fun now too

Art Eatman · August 12, 2002, 06:00 PM

Is it at all feasible to get your dad's rifle drilled and tapped for scope mounts? And then put a good used Weaver K4 on it? Certainly low cost, and wouldn't really interfere with refinishing that stock if you want...

Art

redneck · August 12, 2002, 06:44 PM

Good idea, but the gun is a Remington Model 121 Fieldmaster. They were in production from 1936-1954. I don't know how much collector's value it could have but I'd rather keep it as is. I just cleaned the action and rubbed the wood down with Tung Oil while it was all apart, polished things up a little. It looks surprisingly good now, I'd sort of like to see it put up somewhere.
It is tapped for a peep sight of some sort, I don't know if the screws would ever come out though after being in for this long, and I doubt I could find one, at least not cheap.

ojibweindian · August 12, 2002, 08:07 PM

Given the constraints that you listed, I would opt for the .22Mag

Ledbetter · August 13, 2002, 12:41 PM

Remington makes very accurate .22 Mag with core-lokt bullets. CCI loads Speer gold dot hollowpoints in their .22 mag V-Max.

Pink Misters. All they leave is a pink mist.

redneck · August 13, 2002, 01:12 PM

That sounds good, I didn't know you could get .22mag loaded with varmint type bullets. I'll have to look into one. Marlin is supposed to have some pretty good bolt actions in .22mag.

Thanks everybody.

SquirrelNuts · August 15, 2002, 11:35 PM

I own the Marlin 882SS in .22 Mag, and it is a WONDERFUL rifle. I tested 12 different brands/loads in it and found that the Remington Premier pointed soft points (40 grain I think) were the most accurate. I put a harris bipod on it and a 4X scope, and I love it. I paid $180 for it at Wally World, but they now sell it for $210.

I also have the Marlin 880SQ in .22 LR with a NICE Bushnell Elite scope on it. I would buy both of them again if I had to.

-SquirrelNuts

redneck · August 16, 2002, 10:59 AM

Thats good to hear
The 882SS is one I was interested in. Also considering the 882L, or 883SS .

Zorro · August 16, 2002, 08:28 PM

"50 to 75 Yards"

At that range I would suggest a different weapon.

10 Gauge Magnum shotgun, Full choke and lead #2 or BB shot.

Max carry range of the shot will be about 200 yards when fired at things on the ground.

Plenty of punch too.

redneck · August 16, 2002, 09:50 PM

That would definitely have the power, but I haven't found a real reliable source of heavy shot yet. Anything heavier than #4 Bird, was specialty waterfowl type stuff. $30 a box for the only BB load in the store and it was steel, not lead.
LOTS of slugs, but thats expensive and has similar range to the .22mag.
Thanks though. I need to find some different stores and if theres a good deal on a shotgun I might get one. All the ones I've been to so far are inside Columbus corp. limits and require a Columbus Firearms permit. I don't live in columbus and I refuse to pay the fee, and really refuse to put my name in their database with the number of guns I own.

TBAUS · August 16, 2002, 10:57 PM

With your constraint of neighbors being not too far away, I would be worried about .22 rimfires. I think a shotgun of some sort would be your best bet. How about a slug shot out of a rifled barrel or a rifled choke. If you can't find a good source for slugs, you could mold your own. Lee sells slug molds, but you would have to reload shotgun shells. A sabot with a good jacketed .44 hollow point, shot out of a black powder rifle would be good too. But , that option would give you only one shot.

Mark C. Kimmell · August 17, 2002, 12:53 AM

I just ordered a Marlin 1894C 357mag. lever gun for my short range varmint gun. I also carry a handgun. I do a lot of calling in coyotes and the fun of it all is to get them in close.

H&H,hunter · August 17, 2002, 02:52 PM

Redneck,
I've got a ruger 77/22 in .22WMR. I put a teague sear and spring kit in it and an old lyman all American 4X scope on it. The ole girl prints inside of an inch at 100 yds. And with Maxi Mag + V ammo it drives a wicked little 34gr hollow point at 2300 fps. I've killed two coyotes with it one at over a hundred yards. I'm really quite fond of the little devil. It's absolute hell on Prarie dogs and jack rabbits out to about 150 yards.

redneck · August 17, 2002, 06:30 PM

Thats about what I'd like to have only I'm gong to have to hold off on the trigger, and will go with a cheaper rifle. The marlins look great, and I just read about the CZ452. It was mighty good looking also, but the one they had at the store (in .22LR) cost too much. They were asking MSRP, everyone on here says they got theirs for a lot less. I normally don't use a scope, but I have a BSA .22 Special (4X32) that I'll probably put on and see how I like it.

Its not really that hard to find a safe lane of fire around here. I just don't want something that has the capability of going a LONG ways when its aimed fairly level at something.
If I found a nice shotgun for a good price I'd probably buy it, but I'd still rather get the rifle. I feel safe shooting a .22LR around here, and quite a few people still hunt deer. So a .22mag should be safe. Especially with a Vmax or Speer TNT load.

I actually considered a muzzle loader for awhile

I've been wanting to build one of the Hawkin kits that cabelas sells. Figured a reduced load with a heavy sabot would put a big hole in things up close and still not carry too far. But I'd rather not have that as my primary gun, and I'd be the only one that could/would try to use it. If I get a bolt gun, my dad and brother could/would get it out should the need arise when I'm not around.

TBAUS · August 18, 2002, 03:18 PM

Redneck, .22lr seems to me to be a round that doesn't take much to make it ricochet. I remember shooting a lot of it when I was a kid with a lot shots making that telltale buzz as they went who knows where. I understand you wanting something your other family members would shoot, but there has to be something better than a .22 rimfire,that will keep bullets on your property and still kill a varmit. Someone earlier suggested a lever gun in pistol caliber. Maybe one of the .357 rifles with weak 38 bullets. Rossi model 92 copies used to go for less than $300. I shot at a varmit on my property with a CCI 38 special that missed the varmit about 40 yards out, hit the top of a board, made a groove about 3 inches long on the top of the board, with the bullet coming to a rest. That was shot out of a 4" barreled pistol, but it seems you want something akin to that kind of safety.

August 12, 2002, 11:22 AM	#1
redneck Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2001 Location: Ohio Posts: 364	Need a short range varmint rifle I'm thinking of buying another gun, maybe making a project out of it. Anyhow, unless I find time to get a hunting license, the main use will pest control around the farm. My first thought is that I've gotten by with my dad's old .22LR for this long, I should just get another one. Only I'll fix it up so that I can shoot it a lot better. (The sights on the old remington are kind of crude and won't adjust low enough) But the latest problem has been coyotes. A big plot of farmland (close to a square mile with the adjoining creek and woods) about 3/4 mile away was just taken by eminent domain and turned into a park. No one hunts there anymore so critter populations are on the rise. We've seen several coyote and fox around the area, and have had a few coming up around the barn and the horses. So that got me to wondering about .22Mag and the new .17HRM. The area is all 5 acre lots scattered among fields but its growing fast. All shots will be under 100 yards, more likely between 50 and 75. Its safe to shoot if your careful about the direction, but I don't want something thats going to carry a long ways and hit something that was out of sight. So what do you guys think would be the best choice? I want to go fairly inexpensive, maybe a marlin bolt action or a taurus pump, if I can't find a used gun to fix up. I also thought about a shotgun, but haven't found a good source for anything but birdshot around here. Buckshots not legal for deer here so no one carries it. Any ideas? Thanks __________________ Fix it right the first time... Use Baling Wire !

August 12, 2002, 01:46 PM	#3
HankB Senior Member Join Date: March 30, 2000 Location: Central Texas, outside of Austin Posts: 1,698	At 50 to 75 yards, a .22 rimfire will do the job, a .22 mag will be better. A .223 will extend your range to several hundred yards, but may be more cartridge than you're looking for. For your limited application, a .22 Hornet would seem to fill the bill. I'd advise against the new .17 rimfire cartridge. It reminds me too much of Remington's 5mm Magnum Rimfire. Introduced with a big splash, rifles were only made for a few years, ammo for only a few more. Unless someone laid in a BIG supply of ammo 20 years ago, the rifles are now good only for gathering dust. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the .17 rimfire goes the same way. __________________ To be kind to your enemy is to be cruel to yourself - Sun Tzu

August 12, 2002, 05:08 PM	#5
redneck Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2001 Location: Ohio Posts: 364	Its starting to sound like .22mag. I figured I'd see what was worth looking into and what was available before setting a real budget, I figure on trying to keep the gun under $250 if I can. And then seeing what else I want to do like a scope/different sights. One thing about the .17HRM, its only loaded with Vmax bullets so they may fragment pretty well on first impact, and if it does go down the toilet I could probably buy a .22mag barrel for the same rifle. .223 or .22hornet would be pretty cool as theres so many more things I could do with it later on, but I haven't got the money to get into something like that. I figure I can get a pretty good quality rimfire in my range vs. a pretty low end centerfire. And I don't reload. I was sort of thinking of either refinishing an old gun or making a new stock for a new gun that comes with a cheap stock like marlin's model 25. Not really necessary, but it might be a fun project this winter.I don't think I'd want to screw with a higher priced gun on my first try. I make knives and do some woodworking and carving, for some reason working on a gun sounds fun now too __________________ Fix it right the first time... Use Baling Wire !

August 12, 2002, 06:44 PM	#7
redneck Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2001 Location: Ohio Posts: 364	Good idea, but the gun is a Remington Model 121 Fieldmaster. They were in production from 1936-1954. I don't know how much collector's value it could have but I'd rather keep it as is. I just cleaned the action and rubbed the wood down with Tung Oil while it was all apart, polished things up a little. It looks surprisingly good now, I'd sort of like to see it put up somewhere. It is tapped for a peep sight of some sort, I don't know if the screws would ever come out though after being in for this long, and I doubt I could find one, at least not cheap. __________________ Fix it right the first time... Use Baling Wire !

August 13, 2002, 12:41 PM	#9
Ledbetter Senior Member Join Date: February 23, 2000 Location: California USA Posts: 4,533	.22 Mag Remington makes very accurate .22 Mag with core-lokt bullets. CCI loads Speer gold dot hollowpoints in their .22 mag V-Max. Pink Misters. All they leave is a pink mist.

August 12, 2002, 01:21 PM	#2
labgrade Member In Memoriam Join Date: November 29, 1999 Location: west of a small town, CO Posts: 4,346	The .22 rimmfires are pretty notorious for bouncing off things & going in directions you'd not want or expect. No clue as to what that new .17 would do. In a built-up area, I think I'd go for something with quite a bit more zip & a very frangible bullet - Blitz, TNT type of thing. You want that bullet to desinegrate upon first impact. Sounds like a .223, or the .17 centerfire'd be just the ticket.

August 12, 2002, 03:40 PM	#4
Al Thompson Staff Alumnus Join Date: May 2, 1999 Location: South Carolina Posts: 3,611	.22 Hornet - the reloading man's .22 Magnum I'd stay away from shotguns and buckshot. Getting good results at ranges in excess of 50 yards is tough. If you reload, the Hornet is a good choice. Not a reloader, the .22 Mag. What's your budget? __________________ http://www.scfirearms.org/

August 12, 2002, 06:00 PM	#6
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	Is it at all feasible to get your dad's rifle drilled and tapped for scope mounts? And then put a good used Weaver K4 on it? Certainly low cost, and wouldn't really interfere with refinishing that stock if you want... Art

August 12, 2002, 08:07 PM	#8
ojibweindian Senior Member Join Date: April 20, 2000 Location: Huntsville, Alabama Posts: 1,198	Given the constraints that you listed, I would opt for the .22Mag

August 13, 2002, 01:12 PM	#10
redneck Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2001 Location: Ohio Posts: 364	That sounds good, I didn't know you could get .22mag loaded with varmint type bullets. I'll have to look into one. Marlin is supposed to have some pretty good bolt actions in .22mag. Thanks everybody. __________________ Fix it right the first time... Use Baling Wire !

August 15, 2002, 11:35 PM	#11
SquirrelNuts Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2002 Location: Marietta, GA-home of the Big Chicken Posts: 247	I own the Marlin 882SS in .22 Mag, and it is a WONDERFUL rifle. I tested 12 different brands/loads in it and found that the Remington Premier pointed soft points (40 grain I think) were the most accurate. I put a harris bipod on it and a 4X scope, and I love it. I paid $180 for it at Wally World, but they now sell it for $210. I also have the Marlin 880SQ in .22 LR with a NICE Bushnell Elite scope on it. I would buy both of them again if I had to. -SquirrelNuts

August 16, 2002, 10:59 AM	#12
redneck Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2001 Location: Ohio Posts: 364	Thats good to hear The 882SS is one I was interested in. Also considering the 882L, or 883SS . __________________ Fix it right the first time... Use Baling Wire !

August 16, 2002, 08:28 PM	#13
Zorro Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2000 Posts: 1,072	"50 to 75 Yards" At that range I would suggest a different weapon. 10 Gauge Magnum shotgun, Full choke and lead #2 or BB shot. Max carry range of the shot will be about 200 yards when fired at things on the ground. Plenty of punch too.

August 16, 2002, 09:50 PM	#14
redneck Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2001 Location: Ohio Posts: 364	That would definitely have the power, but I haven't found a real reliable source of heavy shot yet. Anything heavier than #4 Bird, was specialty waterfowl type stuff. $30 a box for the only BB load in the store and it was steel, not lead. LOTS of slugs, but thats expensive and has similar range to the .22mag. Thanks though. I need to find some different stores and if theres a good deal on a shotgun I might get one. All the ones I've been to so far are inside Columbus corp. limits and require a Columbus Firearms permit. I don't live in columbus and I refuse to pay the fee, and really refuse to put my name in their database with the number of guns I own. __________________ Fix it right the first time... Use Baling Wire !

August 16, 2002, 10:57 PM	#15
TBAUS Senior Member Join Date: August 15, 2002 Location: Central Texas Posts: 111	With your constraint of neighbors being not too far away, I would be worried about .22 rimfires. I think a shotgun of some sort would be your best bet. How about a slug shot out of a rifled barrel or a rifled choke. If you can't find a good source for slugs, you could mold your own. Lee sells slug molds, but you would have to reload shotgun shells. A sabot with a good jacketed .44 hollow point, shot out of a black powder rifle would be good too. But , that option would give you only one shot.

August 17, 2002, 12:53 AM	#16
Mark C. Kimmell Member Join Date: June 2, 2001 Location: Kennewick,Wa. Posts: 17	Short range varmint round I just ordered a Marlin 1894C 357mag. lever gun for my short range varmint gun. I also carry a handgun. I do a lot of calling in coyotes and the fun of it all is to get them in close.

August 17, 2002, 02:52 PM	#17
H&H,hunter Senior Member Join Date: July 25, 2001 Location: Colorado Posts: 504	Redneck, I've got a ruger 77/22 in .22WMR. I put a teague sear and spring kit in it and an old lyman all American 4X scope on it. The ole girl prints inside of an inch at 100 yds. And with Maxi Mag + V ammo it drives a wicked little 34gr hollow point at 2300 fps. I've killed two coyotes with it one at over a hundred yards. I'm really quite fond of the little devil. It's absolute hell on Prarie dogs and jack rabbits out to about 150 yards. __________________ Velocity is thrilling, But diameter does the real killing.

August 17, 2002, 06:30 PM	#18
redneck Senior Member Join Date: December 20, 2001 Location: Ohio Posts: 364	Sounds SWEET Thats about what I'd like to have only I'm gong to have to hold off on the trigger, and will go with a cheaper rifle. The marlins look great, and I just read about the CZ452. It was mighty good looking also, but the one they had at the store (in .22LR) cost too much. They were asking MSRP, everyone on here says they got theirs for a lot less. I normally don't use a scope, but I have a BSA .22 Special (4X32) that I'll probably put on and see how I like it. Its not really that hard to find a safe lane of fire around here. I just don't want something that has the capability of going a LONG ways when its aimed fairly level at something. If I found a nice shotgun for a good price I'd probably buy it, but I'd still rather get the rifle. I feel safe shooting a .22LR around here, and quite a few people still hunt deer. So a .22mag should be safe. Especially with a Vmax or Speer TNT load. I actually considered a muzzle loader for awhile I've been wanting to build one of the Hawkin kits that cabelas sells. Figured a reduced load with a heavy sabot would put a big hole in things up close and still not carry too far. But I'd rather not have that as my primary gun, and I'd be the only one that could/would try to use it. If I get a bolt gun, my dad and brother could/would get it out should the need arise when I'm not around. __________________ Fix it right the first time... Use Baling Wire !

August 18, 2002, 03:18 PM	#19
TBAUS Senior Member Join Date: August 15, 2002 Location: Central Texas Posts: 111	Redneck, .22lr seems to me to be a round that doesn't take much to make it ricochet. I remember shooting a lot of it when I was a kid with a lot shots making that telltale buzz as they went who knows where. I understand you wanting something your other family members would shoot, but there has to be something better than a .22 rimfire,that will keep bullets on your property and still kill a varmit. Someone earlier suggested a lever gun in pistol caliber. Maybe one of the .357 rifles with weak 38 bullets. Rossi model 92 copies used to go for less than $300. I shot at a varmit on my property with a CCI 38 special that missed the varmit about 40 yards out, hit the top of a board, made a groove about 3 inches long on the top of the board, with the bullet coming to a rest. That was shot out of a 4" barreled pistol, but it seems you want something akin to that kind of safety.