Check traps, please - Page 2

ripnbst · December 2, 2012, 08:41 PM

OP, thank you for your service.

MLeake · December 3, 2012, 02:32 AM

12gauge, thanks, she's healing up just fine. Hopefully she's learned something, but I can't count on that. Thankfully, the wife has learned something. That isn't a dig at the wife. She's very intelligent, President's list in both colleges she attended, two BS's, currently working as an RN. But... she grew up on a farm, in an area where the norm was for dogs to be allowed to run loose. Then again, she grew up on a 160 acre farm, surrounded by 160 acre farms, where the neighbors were friendly.

My point being, she isn't dumb by any stretch, but her life experience conditioned her to disregard my concerns.

To all those who understood from the outset that I accepted familial blame for the dog being loose in the first place, thanks.

To those who have thanked me for my service, I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm a retired guy who works these days as a contractor. You can thank me if you wish, but I'd prefer you thank the active, reserve, and guard guys who are over here because they have to be, as opposed to guys like me who are here voluntarily.

(A lot of contractors are military retirees. Some, because they meet requirements - security clearances, background skills, what have you - that allow for well-paying jobs. Some, because it keeps them young. Some, because they just can't quite adapt to fully civilian jobs.)

Anyway, sorry for the sidetrack, and I'm happy that some of you understood all along what I was saying.

To a couple of the others in here, I can only hope you show more compassion for animals in general, and more interpersonal skills, in your real lives than you do on the internet.

therealdeal · December 3, 2012, 02:39 AM

Quote:

That does not relieve the trapper of the moral obligation to check live traps much more frequently. In some states, that obligation is legal as well as moral - I am not sure about Missouri, because I don't trap. Friends from other states do, and have apprised me of some of their regs as an FYI.

in some states ones traps aren't even in the ballpark of being able to be checked everyday, and the trappers hope the animal is frozen to death because some animals are vicious

MLeake · December 3, 2012, 02:47 AM

therealdeal, in such conditions, I personally wouldn't trap.

It's weird to me how as hunters, we want clean, quick kills, and we are quick to excoriate and condemn hunters who take low-percentage shots and get bad results; yet people in a subset of our same group seem to think it's ok to leave a live critter in a trap for extended periods.

This is a dichotomy I don't quite understand.

therealdeal · December 3, 2012, 02:55 AM

Quote:

therealdeal, in such conditions, I personally wouldn't trap.

It's weird to me how as hunters, we want clean, quick kills, and we are quick to excoriate and condemn hunters who take low-percentage shots and get bad results; yet people in a subset of our same group seem to think it's ok to leave a live critter in a trap for extended periods.

This is a dichotomy I don't quite understand.

I certain parts of Alaska as one example, these traps are in more remote, harder to reach locations. As well, they rely on these traps to feed their families(whether with the meat or from the money the furs produce).

MLeake · December 3, 2012, 02:56 AM

therealdeal, that's different. Necessity can justify things that "sport" or supplemental income cannot.

BigRick · December 4, 2012, 03:58 AM

MLeake, I'm also here in the 'Ghan. I've had some personal family problems come up while here as well as missing both of my kid's birthdays while here in addition to the holidays coming up. Problems like this just make you feel so helpless because you can't be there for your family members in a crisis.

I for one definitely thank you as the contractors and civilians who work here make it possible for us Active, Guard, and Reserve guys to do our jobs.

Sure Shot Mc Gee · December 4, 2012, 06:38 AM

Op the one thing I would ask. How far away from your property was your dog when He got caught in the trap?

MLeake · December 4, 2012, 04:24 PM

Sure Shot, about half a mile. Normally the river is higher, and the dog would not have been able to cross over. (Edit: he's a she, by the way, named "Lola". Big baby, loves kids, particularly infants and toddlers. With the wife pregnant, we were really upset about that aspect.)

That said, as noted, the wife is now on board with not letting the dog run; my first project when I get home is installing invisible fence around the yard, and later extending it around the pastures.

markj · December 4, 2012, 05:52 PM

I wasnt saying the trapper was in the right, he should run the line every day as I did when I trapped. That dont make letting the dog run right either.

A neighbor just moved in the rental bout 3 years ago. I was in and out doing stuff and heard a dog barking, well after 3 hours I went into a building I have and found the neighbors dog, had my cat backed up in the corner. I swept the dog with a broom shooing it out the door. Darn thing turned and growled baring its teeth at me. I told it best leave now or Im gonna kill you. Neighbor was 1/4 mile down the road in hios front yard heard me and started cussing at me was gonna whup me. I had a 45 on me, didnt want to roll on the ground with a drunk idiot so I went inside. Saw him next pancake feed, offered to let him gtry his hand right there, they moved but I sure coulda shot the dog right there. Next time I just might, hate to do that to an animal wasnt taught right by its owner.....

Had 2 dogs run off when the fencer died, never to be seen again and shorthairsa like mine are not cheap. Last 2 are out of Dual Champ parents, cost a lot but perform like no other. Have 7 on my place and do my best to keep them there, cause I sure would hate to lose one to something silly or someone thats angry at em. I spent the money wired my place with the pet safes stubborn dog fenceing system. Keeps them in, no worries.

MLeake · December 5, 2012, 02:09 AM

markj, thanks for the strawman argument. You are arguing against a point I never made; in fact, I've said from the outset that the dog should not have been running loose.

What size club do you use on your dead horses, exactly?

Thanks, though, for the pet safe stubborn dog fencing system. I'll check out that brand.

therealdeal · December 5, 2012, 02:27 AM

MLeake, thank you for your response. I just wanted to bring up that fact, and you seem to be on board with what I was getting at. Nobody wants an animal to suffer, but sometimes in life this can't be avoided when trying to provide for one's family in the wilderness.

hogdogs · December 5, 2012, 02:46 AM

Loose pets may get trapped in gear meant for game, varmints and fur bearers... Check

We pet owners should all try to prevent this... Check

We hope the trapper is of the ilk to spare the pet from suffering... Check

We hope he tries to do this by frequently checking his gear... Check

We can hope he relieves the suffering by freeing the pet and getting it back to the owner rather than killing the pet by what ever means he dispatches his intended quarry... Check

I think the point of the OP was well made and this has just been a merry-go-round with greased handlebars since shortly after it got going really...
I guess Art has been feeling gracious this time of year as he would have usually addressed the criminal issue of assault on deceased equine resulting in blunt force trauma much sooner me thinks...

Brent

December 5, 2012, 02:27 AM	#37
therealdeal Senior Member Join Date: September 15, 2010 Posts: 627	MLeake, thank you for your response. I just wanted to bring up that fact, and you seem to be on board with what I was getting at. Nobody wants an animal to suffer, but sometimes in life this can't be avoided when trying to provide for one's family in the wilderness. __________________ NRA Distinguished Life Member "Abraham Lincoln freed all men, but Sam Colt made them all equal." (post Civil War slogan)

December 5, 2012, 02:46 AM	#38
hogdogs Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 31, 2007 Location: Western Florida panhandle Posts: 11,069	Loose pets may get trapped in gear meant for game, varmints and fur bearers... Check We pet owners should all try to prevent this... Check We hope the trapper is of the ilk to spare the pet from suffering... Check We hope he tries to do this by frequently checking his gear... Check We can hope he relieves the suffering by freeing the pet and getting it back to the owner rather than killing the pet by what ever means he dispatches his intended quarry... Check I think the point of the OP was well made and this has just been a merry-go-round with greased handlebars since shortly after it got going really... I guess Art has been feeling gracious this time of year as he would have usually addressed the criminal issue of assault on deceased equine resulting in blunt force trauma much sooner me thinks... Brent Last edited by hogdogs; December 5, 2012 at 02:51 AM.

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December 2, 2012, 08:41 PM	#26
ripnbst Senior Member Join Date: November 24, 2010 Location: Spring, TX Posts: 1,552	OP, thank you for your service.

December 3, 2012, 02:32 AM	#27
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	12gauge, thanks, she's healing up just fine. Hopefully she's learned something, but I can't count on that. Thankfully, the wife has learned something. That isn't a dig at the wife. She's very intelligent, President's list in both colleges she attended, two BS's, currently working as an RN. But... she grew up on a farm, in an area where the norm was for dogs to be allowed to run loose. Then again, she grew up on a 160 acre farm, surrounded by 160 acre farms, where the neighbors were friendly. My point being, she isn't dumb by any stretch, but her life experience conditioned her to disregard my concerns. To all those who understood from the outset that I accepted familial blame for the dog being loose in the first place, thanks. To those who have thanked me for my service, I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm a retired guy who works these days as a contractor. You can thank me if you wish, but I'd prefer you thank the active, reserve, and guard guys who are over here because they have to be, as opposed to guys like me who are here voluntarily. (A lot of contractors are military retirees. Some, because they meet requirements - security clearances, background skills, what have you - that allow for well-paying jobs. Some, because it keeps them young. Some, because they just can't quite adapt to fully civilian jobs.) Anyway, sorry for the sidetrack, and I'm happy that some of you understood all along what I was saying. To a couple of the others in here, I can only hope you show more compassion for animals in general, and more interpersonal skills, in your real lives than you do on the internet.

December 3, 2012, 02:47 AM	#29
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	therealdeal, in such conditions, I personally wouldn't trap. It's weird to me how as hunters, we want clean, quick kills, and we are quick to excoriate and condemn hunters who take low-percentage shots and get bad results; yet people in a subset of our same group seem to think it's ok to leave a live critter in a trap for extended periods. This is a dichotomy I don't quite understand.

December 3, 2012, 02:56 AM	#31
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	therealdeal, that's different. Necessity can justify things that "sport" or supplemental income cannot.

December 4, 2012, 03:58 AM	#32
BigRick Member Join Date: November 27, 2012 Posts: 22	MLeake, I'm also here in the 'Ghan. I've had some personal family problems come up while here as well as missing both of my kid's birthdays while here in addition to the holidays coming up. Problems like this just make you feel so helpless because you can't be there for your family members in a crisis. I for one definitely thank you as the contractors and civilians who work here make it possible for us Active, Guard, and Reserve guys to do our jobs.

December 4, 2012, 06:38 AM	#33
Sure Shot Mc Gee Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2012 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,876	Op the one thing I would ask. How far away from your property was your dog when He got caught in the trap?

December 4, 2012, 04:24 PM	#34
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	Sure Shot, about half a mile. Normally the river is higher, and the dog would not have been able to cross over. (Edit: he's a she, by the way, named "Lola". Big baby, loves kids, particularly infants and toddlers. With the wife pregnant, we were really upset about that aspect.) That said, as noted, the wife is now on board with not letting the dog run; my first project when I get home is installing invisible fence around the yard, and later extending it around the pastures.

December 4, 2012, 05:52 PM	#35
markj Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2005 Location: Crescent Iowa Posts: 2,971	I wasnt saying the trapper was in the right, he should run the line every day as I did when I trapped. That dont make letting the dog run right either. A neighbor just moved in the rental bout 3 years ago. I was in and out doing stuff and heard a dog barking, well after 3 hours I went into a building I have and found the neighbors dog, had my cat backed up in the corner. I swept the dog with a broom shooing it out the door. Darn thing turned and growled baring its teeth at me. I told it best leave now or Im gonna kill you. Neighbor was 1/4 mile down the road in hios front yard heard me and started cussing at me was gonna whup me. I had a 45 on me, didnt want to roll on the ground with a drunk idiot so I went inside. Saw him next pancake feed, offered to let him gtry his hand right there, they moved but I sure coulda shot the dog right there. Next time I just might, hate to do that to an animal wasnt taught right by its owner..... Had 2 dogs run off when the fencer died, never to be seen again and shorthairsa like mine are not cheap. Last 2 are out of Dual Champ parents, cost a lot but perform like no other. Have 7 on my place and do my best to keep them there, cause I sure would hate to lose one to something silly or someone thats angry at em. I spent the money wired my place with the pet safes stubborn dog fenceing system. Keeps them in, no worries.

December 5, 2012, 02:09 AM	#36
MLeake Senior Member Join Date: November 15, 2007 Location: Outside KC, MO Posts: 10,128	markj, thanks for the strawman argument. You are arguing against a point I never made; in fact, I've said from the outset that the dog should not have been running loose. What size club do you use on your dead horses, exactly? Thanks, though, for the pet safe stubborn dog fencing system. I'll check out that brand.