The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Handguns: The Semi-automatic Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old January 4, 2020, 04:50 PM   #1
USMCFO
Junior Member
 
Join Date: August 27, 2016
Posts: 14
AR Pistol Question

So after being totally without anything that resembles an AR since departing the USMC in 1974, I find myself becoming interested in the AR pistols currently being offered by various manufacturers, specifically the Springfield Armory Saint Edge pistol, and have a question for the forum members that are fans of the AR.

Since the brace looks something like a stock, and the barrel length is only 10 inches, can this be purchased as any other pistol, or does it fall into the category of a Short Barrel Rifle and need the ATF Form 4 ?
USMCFO is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 05:01 PM   #2
American Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 21, 2018
Posts: 218
It is considered a handgun. No ATF hassle to go through.

Just don't put a 90 degree vertical foregrip on it unless it has an overall length of at least 26 inches. If less than 26 inches you can put the Magpul AFG 45 degree grip on it. I'll try to attach a pic.

Here is the legal foregrip, if you even need it. But putting on the 90 degree vertical foregrip is a no go ... I believe it is considered an AOW.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg AR Pistol 45 degree foregrip.jpg (33.2 KB, 86 views)

Last edited by American Man; January 4, 2020 at 05:55 PM.
American Man is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 05:51 PM   #3
USMCFO
Junior Member
 
Join Date: August 27, 2016
Posts: 14
Thanks for the info. How do you like your AR pistol? Looks like you have the flip up sights, how do you like those?
USMCFO is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 05:59 PM   #4
JohnKSa
Staff
 
Join Date: February 12, 2001
Location: DFW Area
Posts: 22,949
Quote:
It is considered a handgun.
It is currently considered a handgun. At first it wasn't, then SIG got the BATF to say it was, then the BATF changed their mind and said it wasn't (well it sort of wasn't), now it is again. Maybe it will always be considered a pistol from now on, maybe the BATF will change its mind again.

I've seen enough BATF opinion changes that I have no appetite for playing that particular game since the BATF holds all the cards. If I want an SBR, I'm going to go the NFA route. Plus then I can put a vertical foregrip on it if I want.
__________________
Do you know about the TEXAS State Rifle Association?
JohnKSa is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 06:13 PM   #5
American Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 21, 2018
Posts: 218
Here is a link to some more info. I added some info above in my post, but this link is probably better:

https://americanmilitarynews.com/201...-short-rifles/

I love my AR pistol. I have a Spikes Tactical 8.1 inch barrel. Even before I had the brace I put it up to my shoulder with just the tube and it fires just fine. The brace is a little more comfortable. Out to 250 yards, it is the same as shooting a 16 inch AR... I didn't set up targets past that but I'm sure it would do fine at 300.

The flip up sights are ok... I prefer the more sturdy standard front sight post for reflexive fire only cause that is what I am used to, but the difference is minimal.

I use the Lower 1/3 Cowitness with my red dot. I find it more comfortable than the Absolute Cowitness.

The model you are looking at getting is a great model. You'll be mad at yourself for taking so long to get one. lol
American Man is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 07:11 PM   #6
scorpion_tyr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 10, 2008
Location: East Texas
Posts: 1,326
Warning: they are addictive. I never liked the M-16 when I was in the military, and never intended on having an AR. I happened to come across a good deal on an AR pistol that actually looked good to me and felt great. It’s a 10.5” barrel .300 Blackout and absolutely beautiful to shoot.

Since then I’ve built five more, all pistols with braces on them and I’m in the process of planning my next one.
__________________
“Nature intended me for the tranquil pursuits of science, by rendering them my supreme delight.” - Thomas Jefferson
scorpion_tyr is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 08:20 PM   #7
9x19
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 15, 1998
Location: Sherman, TX USA
Posts: 3,565
Addictive?!

.22LR - 7.5"


9mm - 8"


.22LR - 9"


10mm - 10.5"


FYI: braces aren't just for AR pistols...

.22LR - 10"


9mm - 10"
__________________
Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!
9x19 is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 08:31 PM   #8
USMCFO
Junior Member
 
Join Date: August 27, 2016
Posts: 14
Thanls American Man for the helpful info. I seem to be reverting to my younger days with regards to taste in firearms. Through most of my career was involved primarily with revolvers and then SA/DA semi-auto pistols.

Last year I went back to a 1911 style with the purchase of a Springfield Armory EMP4 9mm which I like and now started looking at the Saint Edge pistol. Like scorpion_tyr I was never a big fan of the M-16 when I was in the military as I was issued an early one before the forward assist and chrome lining mods; all through my tour in Vietnam found myself repeatedly wishing I had the M-14 that I trained with.
USMCFO is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 08:35 PM   #9
USMCFO
Junior Member
 
Join Date: August 27, 2016
Posts: 14
9X19, that is quite a collection you have, which one was your first that got you more interested in them ?
USMCFO is offline  
Old January 4, 2020, 09:20 PM   #10
American Man
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 21, 2018
Posts: 218
Quote:
Originally Posted by USMCFO View Post
Thanls American Man for the helpful info. I seem to be reverting to my younger days with regards to taste in firearms. Through most of my career was involved primarily with revolvers and then SA/DA semi-auto pistols.

Last year I went back to a 1911 style with the purchase of a Springfield Armory EMP4 9mm which I like and now started looking at the Saint Edge pistol. Like scorpion_tyr I was never a big fan of the M-16 when I was in the military as I was issued an early one before the forward assist and chrome lining mods; all through my tour in Vietnam found myself repeatedly wishing I had the M-14 that I trained with.
One of my platoon sergeants early on was a Vietnam Veteran and he told us about how many friendlies had jammed M16s next to them when their bodies were recovered. That always stuck with me... and I have even seen it mentioned in documentaries. For most of my time in 88-08, army, if you kept the top of your magazines from getting banged up, smashed and bent, they were very reliable.

I hope you enjoy it. It is a great SD option as well... if you live in the deep woods that is. lol I keep a set of electronic ear muffs next to mine.
American Man is offline  
Old January 5, 2020, 01:06 AM   #11
9x19
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 15, 1998
Location: Sherman, TX USA
Posts: 3,565
USMC,

Thanks. My short AR journey actually started with registered SBRs (I have four). The pistols were next. I enjoy them all but for hunting I use an SBR as I still shoot a scoped gun better with a regular stock vs the brace.
__________________
Make mine lean, mean, and 9x19!
9x19 is offline  
Old January 5, 2020, 01:23 AM   #12
JERRYS.
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 23, 2013
Location: Alabama
Posts: 2,712
I've since added a blade brace and changed out the trigger guard to one more open/rounded.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg PSA Pistol.jpg (49.1 KB, 41 views)
JERRYS. is offline  
Old January 14, 2020, 10:14 PM   #13
Ibmikey
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 1, 2013
Location: Now relocated to Texas
Posts: 2,905
I have built pistols in 5.56, 300 BO and 9 mm all are fun shooters, I stamped each lower receiver inside “PISTOL” not that it is required but makes me feel a little better.
Ibmikey is offline  
Old January 14, 2020, 11:27 PM   #14
Cheapshooter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 2, 2007
Location: Missouri
Posts: 8,188
Quote:
Warning: they are addictive.
Then there's the real addiction ~ Building them!
So many calibers, so many options!!!
__________________
Cheapshooter's rules of gun ownership #1: NEVER SELL OR TRADE ANYTHING!
Cheapshooter is offline  
Old January 14, 2020, 11:36 PM   #15
JERRYS.
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 23, 2013
Location: Alabama
Posts: 2,712
speaking of which.... what's anyone's suggestion for a low cost laser?
JERRYS. is offline  
Old January 16, 2020, 09:03 AM   #16
zeke
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 17, 1999
Location: NW Wi
Posts: 1,068
Quote:
It is currently considered a handgun. At first it wasn't, then SIG got the BATF to say it was, then the BATF changed their mind and said it wasn't (well it sort of wasn't), now it is again. Maybe it will always be considered a pistol from now on, maybe the BATF will change its mind again.
Agree this can change instantly, and something that needs consideration. With advancing age, am trying to accommodate decreasing skill with a pistol. The short ar style in pistol calibers with braces have appeal, reliability, economy and are easy to shoot accurately. Since they are pistols, they meet they can be legally concealed where the law allows. And they come in 45 acp.

Also have registered sbr in 223 with more power and range, but loud, longer and more expensive to practice with than pistol caliber.

If the interpretation changes, will go to effort to put a "stock" on the pistol and stamp it.

Last edited by zeke; January 16, 2020 at 10:54 AM.
zeke is offline  
Old January 16, 2020, 10:24 AM   #17
gnystrom
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 30, 2006
Posts: 243
Nice info guys. I learned a lot by reading all your posts. That may be the ultimate home defense gun.
gnystrom is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2018 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.07370 seconds with 11 queries