Reproduction Stgw 44

**4V50 Gary** · September 14, 2000, 08:34 PM

It appears that an enterprising fellow has developed the tooling to make a semi-auto version of the Stgw 44 (MP-44 or MP-43). As most of you know, it is one of the earliest "assault rifles" adopted by the German Army during WW II (we've all seen the Battle of the Bulge picture of the panzer-grenadiers riding atop of the King Tiger, one of whom was armed with the Stgw 44). It will be a mixture of old parts and new with the barrel being produced domestically. Right now the prototype is awaiting BATF approval.

Once BATF approval is received, they will attempt to get 250 buyers to fund tooling up for production. Mind you, it won't be cheap and the asking price is $2k - $2.5k! I'll email him for more information later. The contact is Karl Brockfeld at:
[email protected]

In a society growing ever more restrictive on gun ownership and enjoyment, I can't see this as a viable business venture.

fal308 · September 15, 2000, 08:05 AM

You never know though Gary. This is how Special Weapons LLC started out. They took a lot of heat on the various boards as they fell behind in their production schedule. But now they're up and running, producing very good quality HK clones, from what I've heard. Let's hope this outfit can pull it off also.

Kenneth L. Walters · September 16, 2000, 08:07 PM

Any way to stay informed as to what's going on here?

Correia · September 17, 2000, 09:27 PM

Price seems high, but if there is sufficient demand I hope it works out for him.

A few questions though, would he chamber it in the original German Kurz round, or in something modern? (7.62x39 perhaps).

If folks are going to start reserecting old German designs, I want somebody to make a FG 42 para rifle! I have always thought that was the coolest looking gun.

**4V50 Gary** · September 17, 2000, 11:27 PM

Received an email response from Karl Brockfeld.

"Gary,

Yes, we are working on a prototype to send to BATF as soon as it is finished. If the Fed. Govt. accepts it for production, we are in business. I don't have a website up yet, we are waiting for the go-ahead before we publicize it too much. The message that was circulating from me was just to test the interest level. The plan is to have completed rifles for sale within 18-24 months if everything goes right.

Thank you fo ryour interest, Karl."
[email protected]
There you have it from the man himself. I like the suggestion of the FG42, the later model of course. What a blast that would be.

wako · September 19, 2000, 03:03 PM

A reproduction Sturmgewehr44 would be nice, but does anyone know if you can still buy original SG/MP44s from anyone? I assume they would be very expensive. What about MG42s?

wako

------------------
"This is why you won. I don't know how or why, but there's more amazing stuff in this dome than in my whole country. The Communists just could never do it like Mr. Walt Disney." - Anonymous Ukrainian inside SpaceShip Earth at Walt Disney World's EPCOT Center

fal308 · September 20, 2000, 08:13 AM

Yes the originals can still be found. Look in SGN or Gun List, check out some of the FA boards (Bowers, Big Jim's etc). Or if you're anywhere near Louisville KY, the Knob Creek Machinegun Show and Shoot is in a couple of weeks. If it's not at Knob Creek chances are none exist!

Kenneth L. Walters · September 23, 2000, 03:31 PM

I e-mailed these folks and got no response. How did you manage to get a response from them?

I'd certainly buy at least one even if it was in the original caliber. Know if that is to be the case?

**4V50 Gary** · September 27, 2000, 12:38 AM

Just received this email from Karl Brockfeld:

---------------------------------------

Gentlemen,

This is where I am going to be posting updates (my note: email to folks on his mailing list) on the semi-auto MP-44 project. If you know of anyone else who would be interested in owning one of these rifles have them contact me at:

Karl Brockfeld
email: [email protected]

So far, this is where we are at. The prototype is on its way to completion, but nothing has been sent to BATF for approval yet. We are looking at applying for our own manufacturer's license and taking care of the final fitting and assembly ourselves, while still farming out much of the parts fabrication to ensure timely delivery. We are also looking at using an investment cast aluminum lower receiver in the manner of the AR-15. I know that this is unrealistic when compared to the original rifle, but it will hopefully clear up some of the problems that others have had in getting these types of guns cleared for production. The full-auto capability of the MP-44 rifle is incorporated into the trigger group, thus merely removing the applicable parts makes the rifle incapable of full auto fire, but this also makes it extremely easy to re-convert the rifle to full-auto (especially in the eyes of the BATF). Using a completely new lower receiver would alleviate some of these worries. The investment casting would, of course, incorporate all of the external contours, etc, of the original sheet metal pressing.

More to come as things are passed along to me. All the best,

Karl
minister of propaganda & chief water-boy

p.s. if you somehow got on this list by mistake and have no interest in reproduction German military rifles, email me and I will remove you.

---------------------------------
Gary's note: I would also suspect that the new lower should be made such that certain full auto parts cannot be installed (ala: Colt Sporter Sear Block).

**4V50 Gary** · October 18, 2000, 05:55 PM

I wrote Karl Brockfeld and asked about the receiver block (whether they would be using the old ones or investment casting new ones). Here is his response:

That remains to be seen, we haven't made it all through the machining on the new style lower (we kind of changed horses mid-stream with this). As of right now, we haven't teted the design to see how well it is going to work with the existing receiver and bolt components.

Another writer asked, "Are you going to chamber it in the original round? If so, where do you plan to get the brass?" Karl responds:

[P]lans are to chamber it in the original round; I live about 30 minutes from Starline Brass Co. and I know they have done custom runs of brass before. I am going to see if it will be cost effective to have them make 10-20k cases. The shape of the case is very similar to a standard 7.9 x 57mm Mauser round, so hopefully this will not be a problem.

On the subject of alternate chamberings, we have run up against a wall. No other common round will fit into an MP-44 Mag because of the length. If we change mags, we have to change the contour of the magwell in the lower receiver. Since the lower receiver will either be a casting or a steel metal pressing, this would require two sets of tooling to produce the two different receivers. All of this equals big money that I don't have and won't be generated by this project, so at the present time, we are sticking to the original caliber. Plans are in the works to either provide, or find someone who will provide both empty cases and reloading dies.

Kenneth L. Walters · November 2, 2000, 05:00 PM

I see that someone is having these cartridge cases formed from 308. Don't know if that is anything more than just a simple run through a set of case forming dies or not. RCBS sells such dies. Anyone know the details here?

The formed brass is a it over $1 each.

**4V50 Gary** · April 16, 2001, 10:11 AM

Ask and you shall receive.

April 16, 2001, 10:11 AM	#12
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,829	BTT Ask and you shall receive.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

September 14, 2000, 08:34 PM	#1
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,829	It appears that an enterprising fellow has developed the tooling to make a semi-auto version of the Stgw 44 (MP-44 or MP-43). As most of you know, it is one of the earliest "assault rifles" adopted by the German Army during WW II (we've all seen the Battle of the Bulge picture of the panzer-grenadiers riding atop of the King Tiger, one of whom was armed with the Stgw 44). It will be a mixture of old parts and new with the barrel being produced domestically. Right now the prototype is awaiting BATF approval. Once BATF approval is received, they will attempt to get 250 buyers to fund tooling up for production. Mind you, it won't be cheap and the asking price is $2k - $2.5k! I'll email him for more information later. The contact is Karl Brockfeld at: [email protected] In a society growing ever more restrictive on gun ownership and enjoyment, I can't see this as a viable business venture.

September 15, 2000, 08:05 AM	#2
fal308 Staff Alumnus Join Date: October 12, 1998 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,992	You never know though Gary. This is how Special Weapons LLC started out. They took a lot of heat on the various boards as they fell behind in their production schedule. But now they're up and running, producing very good quality HK clones, from what I've heard. Let's hope this outfit can pull it off also.

September 16, 2000, 08:07 PM	#3
Kenneth L. Walters Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 1999 Location: flagstaff, arizona Posts: 477	Any way to stay informed as to what's going on here?

September 17, 2000, 09:27 PM	#4
Correia Senior Member Join Date: December 3, 1998 Location: SLC Utah Posts: 3,740	Price seems high, but if there is sufficient demand I hope it works out for him. A few questions though, would he chamber it in the original German Kurz round, or in something modern? (7.62x39 perhaps). If folks are going to start reserecting old German designs, I want somebody to make a FG 42 para rifle! I have always thought that was the coolest looking gun.

September 17, 2000, 11:27 PM	#5
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,829	Received an email response from Karl Brockfeld. "Gary, Yes, we are working on a prototype to send to BATF as soon as it is finished. If the Fed. Govt. accepts it for production, we are in business. I don't have a website up yet, we are waiting for the go-ahead before we publicize it too much. The message that was circulating from me was just to test the interest level. The plan is to have completed rifles for sale within 18-24 months if everything goes right. Thank you fo ryour interest, Karl." [email protected] There you have it from the man himself. I like the suggestion of the FG42, the later model of course. What a blast that would be.

September 19, 2000, 03:03 PM	#6
wako Junior Member Join Date: September 18, 2000 Posts: 1	A reproduction Sturmgewehr44 would be nice, but does anyone know if you can still buy original SG/MP44s from anyone? I assume they would be very expensive. What about MG42s? wako ------------------ "This is why you won. I don't know how or why, but there's more amazing stuff in this dome than in my whole country. The Communists just could never do it like Mr. Walt Disney." - Anonymous Ukrainian inside SpaceShip Earth at Walt Disney World's EPCOT Center

September 20, 2000, 08:13 AM	#7
fal308 Staff Alumnus Join Date: October 12, 1998 Location: Missouri Posts: 1,992	Yes the originals can still be found. Look in SGN or Gun List, check out some of the FA boards (Bowers, Big Jim's etc). Or if you're anywhere near Louisville KY, the Knob Creek Machinegun Show and Shoot is in a couple of weeks. If it's not at Knob Creek chances are none exist!

September 23, 2000, 03:31 PM	#8
Kenneth L. Walters Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 1999 Location: flagstaff, arizona Posts: 477	I e-mailed these folks and got no response. How did you manage to get a response from them? I'd certainly buy at least one even if it was in the original caliber. Know if that is to be the case?

September 27, 2000, 12:38 AM	#9
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,829	Just received this email from Karl Brockfeld: --------------------------------------- Gentlemen, This is where I am going to be posting updates (my note: email to folks on his mailing list) on the semi-auto MP-44 project. If you know of anyone else who would be interested in owning one of these rifles have them contact me at: Karl Brockfeld email: [email protected] So far, this is where we are at. The prototype is on its way to completion, but nothing has been sent to BATF for approval yet. We are looking at applying for our own manufacturer's license and taking care of the final fitting and assembly ourselves, while still farming out much of the parts fabrication to ensure timely delivery. We are also looking at using an investment cast aluminum lower receiver in the manner of the AR-15. I know that this is unrealistic when compared to the original rifle, but it will hopefully clear up some of the problems that others have had in getting these types of guns cleared for production. The full-auto capability of the MP-44 rifle is incorporated into the trigger group, thus merely removing the applicable parts makes the rifle incapable of full auto fire, but this also makes it extremely easy to re-convert the rifle to full-auto (especially in the eyes of the BATF). Using a completely new lower receiver would alleviate some of these worries. The investment casting would, of course, incorporate all of the external contours, etc, of the original sheet metal pressing. More to come as things are passed along to me. All the best, Karl minister of propaganda & chief water-boy p.s. if you somehow got on this list by mistake and have no interest in reproduction German military rifles, email me and I will remove you. --------------------------------- Gary's note: I would also suspect that the new lower should be made such that certain full auto parts cannot be installed (ala: Colt Sporter Sear Block).

October 18, 2000, 05:55 PM	#10
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,829	I wrote Karl Brockfeld and asked about the receiver block (whether they would be using the old ones or investment casting new ones). Here is his response: That remains to be seen, we haven't made it all through the machining on the new style lower (we kind of changed horses mid-stream with this). As of right now, we haven't teted the design to see how well it is going to work with the existing receiver and bolt components. Another writer asked, "Are you going to chamber it in the original round? If so, where do you plan to get the brass?" Karl responds: [P]lans are to chamber it in the original round; I live about 30 minutes from Starline Brass Co. and I know they have done custom runs of brass before. I am going to see if it will be cost effective to have them make 10-20k cases. The shape of the case is very similar to a standard 7.9 x 57mm Mauser round, so hopefully this will not be a problem. On the subject of alternate chamberings, we have run up against a wall. No other common round will fit into an MP-44 Mag because of the length. If we change mags, we have to change the contour of the magwell in the lower receiver. Since the lower receiver will either be a casting or a steel metal pressing, this would require two sets of tooling to produce the two different receivers. All of this equals big money that I don't have and won't be generated by this project, so at the present time, we are sticking to the original caliber. Plans are in the works to either provide, or find someone who will provide both empty cases and reloading dies.

November 2, 2000, 05:00 PM	#11
Kenneth L. Walters Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 1999 Location: flagstaff, arizona Posts: 477	I see that someone is having these cartridge cases formed from 308. Don't know if that is anything more than just a simple run through a set of case forming dies or not. RCBS sells such dies. Anyone know the details here? The formed brass is a it over $1 each.