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Old January 6, 2019, 03:51 PM   #51
Gas Bag
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If I was going to get a micro 9mm, I would probably get the Springfield XD-S. That is a WAG, but it looks like it would be the easiest to hold onto, with the deep checkered grip.

It costs about $400 right now, so I guess it is not the cheapest gun there is. But it looks like a pretty good one.
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Old January 7, 2019, 12:51 AM   #52
Carl the Floor Walker
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Mosin posted
"Both my Shield and G43 can be carried in a front pocket and both are reliable and very shootable. The only possibly superior piece is the P365, which I will probably get at some point. No rush, since the Shield and G43 are so good.

I have found the Kel-tecs to be poorly made and not good shooters, with excessive recoil and poor triggers (P11) and lots of muzzle flip (PF9).

I have never owned a Kahr that wasn’t finicky at best.

My two LC9s Rugers had nice triggers and were accurate and definitely pocketable, but have sharper recoil than the Shield, G43 and P365. My first LC9s wasn’t reliable (see Galloway Precision’s note regarding Ruger’s bad recoil system design), and I discovered my second one would pop its mag if fired left-handed. Gone."

The Nano shoots OK, but has a short grip and my impression is that it is too fat and heavy for the front pocket. Around 18 ounces unloaded is the limit, in my experience.

(Actually checking the stats Nano may not be too heavy. Still kind of thick though.)



I have no idea where you are getting your stats. The Nano and the LC9S have the same thickness of .90. The Shield is thicker at .095. The OAL of the Nano is 5.6 the Shield is 6.1".
I have ran so many rounds out of the LC9S practically wore the gun out. A very reliable gun. You mention that Gallaway talking about the recoil system design because of failures, well that was changed shortly after it cam out and Ruger changed the recoil spring to a captive design and they ran great. You say 18oz. is your limilt. Come on, the Shield is 20.8oz according to their website and the Nano is 19.8oz,The extra weight of the Nano is in the barrel and receiver and the trade off is a extremely soft recoil and less muzzle jump.

I do not carry any Micro 9mm in my pocket. Personally I will use a pocket gun for that. But the Nano will fit better than the Shield if that is something I am going to do.

The Sig 365 is a very nice gun. My club members ran a thousand rounds through the gun and compared it to others. While a nice gun, it is NOT PERFECT for every shooter. The Grip to receiver length was too small for a number of us. Riding the slide was something we had to watch out for. Might be perfect for someone with a small hand, but it is tight for others.

By the way, I have detailed pic of the different parts and weights on these guns. Too many too post here.
Folks need to try all guns and find the best gun for their individual needs. If the Sheild and the Glock fit you and you love the guns, then that is great. But just trying to help others get the stats right.

You say you can fit the Shield better in your pocket, even though the Shield is actually wider and longer and heavier? Well ok, if you say so.


Last edited by Carl the Floor Walker; January 7, 2019 at 04:25 AM.
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Old January 7, 2019, 02:01 AM   #53
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You asked for it: Downsizer WSP

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Old January 7, 2019, 07:32 AM   #54
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Slp82, that was a hellofa first post and a great review. Nice work and very useful for anyone looking for a pocket carry 9. I've bookmarked it for use when I get those kinds of questions. Thanx for the considerable work. Rod
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Old January 7, 2019, 08:13 AM   #55
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For my own use (and occasionally for my wife), we own both a Sig P290 in 9mm, and a S&W Bodyguard380. Of the two, only the S&W is truly a pocket gun. The P290 is just too heavy for anything short of a winter weight parka in my opinion.

The Sig P290, with tritium night sights sports a long revolver type trigger pull that will annoy some shooters without a grounding in revolver use. Both my wife and I are long time wheel gun shooters so this was no real detriment, however. Too, I find that with any handgun that short and compact, I don't really want a light trigger. The gun's an up-close, inside 10 yards, attack stopper in my book, and an overly light trigger has no place in that scenario. This Sig offering is a 9mm, and with good modern defensive ammunition, it makes a great carry gun for civilian use.

Reliability: good after I got Sig to correct the gun's FTF due to light firing pin falls...and BTW, I did not get them to install the 2nd strike trigger when the work was done (on their dime I might add). For any stoppage, I've been trained to immediately go to the stoppage malfunction drill appropriate to the circumstances. Wasting time on a 2nd trigger pull is not part of the process. YMMV however.

Accuracy: once one gets used to the long trigger, has been excellent...I get less than 2" groups from the ten yard line with any ammunition that I've used. Weight is another matter...while it's really a big help controlling a full house 9mm with 124 gr. SD ammunition, it makes this finely built pistol a holster only proposition for me.

For day to day carry, I don't like IWB holsters for all the usual reasons, but do find that an appropriately sized OWB works quite well and is virtually undetectable when worn behind the hip bone (4 o'clock position). With six rounds in the magazine, one up the pipe, and another 8 rounder in a pocket, I'm pretty well-armed for close in encounters.

The S&W Bodyguard380, (in .380 ACP!) is truly a pocket carry gun. Both my wife, and DIL carry one in their purse, but rarely on the belt or in a pocket. Both use Galco (I think) pocket protector type holsters for purse carry. The gun's integral laser is virtually useless, but does help with new-shooter training in trigger control. Its location, forward of the trigger guard makes it all but impossible to use at any realistic speed.

While the weight is down where it needs to be, for a pocket/purse carry gun, and recoil recovery is not a problem, the caliber leaves something to be desired, even with boutique SD ammunition. My wife and DIL will carry it, usually without objections, excuses, the usual BS, where they won't tote the heavier Sig, or any other more substantial caliber. To be truthful, the recoil of a full house 9mm puts them off somewhat from a truly pocket weight pistol.

The trigger pull on our S&W, was fine right out of the box, and has remained so and I've not had a single malfunction that I can recall with roughly 1000 rounds through the gun. Accuracy is around 2" at 7-10 yds. Plenty accurate for defensive use...and that's from a Weaver Stance...not rested. All in all, it's a good gun for the use intended & method of carry.

HTH's Rod
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Old January 7, 2019, 08:43 AM   #56
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the caliber leaves something to be desired, even with boutique SD ammunition.
Look at this stuff, 'Xtreme Defender'(not Penetrator)..yes 'boutique' but tests very well(I know, 'tests') compared to many 9mm JHP in terms of penetration/wound channel type stuff...380 isn't the .380 John Browning invented over 110 years ago. What I carry everyday in G42..

Lehigh/Underwood/Blackhills all make it.
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Old January 7, 2019, 08:50 AM   #57
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Keltec

I like the Keltec's for what they are. High quality materials, amazing designs, and not quite "finished" I don't mind doing a fluff and buff, given the outstanding price.

I thought I would like the P11, was looking to downsize from my G19. The P11 was 100% after a good fluff and buff session.

I found it no easier to carry than my G19, so it left.

I've been pocket carrying an LCP, and I am pleased with it. I do find it prints when I wear what my wife likes to call my skinny jeans. I'm a very thin guy and snug jeans make the LCP print pretty badly.
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Old January 7, 2019, 10:16 AM   #58
Carl the Floor Walker
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I saw some of the recommendations and I will have to disagree. First of all it is ok to recommend a gun you personnal like, but that is going to be so bias. Why would I recommend a LC9S Pro? I would not. And NO not every one agrees that such a light trigger is safe especially for a Rookie. And why not recommend a double action, or a Da/SA? Some great guns out there and many feel much safer than a light crisp striker fired trigger. And on the List provided some of the weights are wrong
And what about recoil. sights, how well the grip fits the individual hand.
Genitron is a better source. They do give a general idea what the recoil is calculated at, and they will show the size comparison of the pistols. Plug in your own numbers and go from there. But for sure, take the time to find OUT WHAT IS RIGHT FOR YOU, DO NOT GO BY A LIST THAT SOME INTERNET GUY SAYS ARE THE BEST. Take your time, rent guns, shoot the guns of friends, and join a club where members can share guns etc.

Size is NOT the only Criteria. All of these guns have their own individual uniqueness and individual traits. They ALL have their Pros and Cons, and only the individual can give that answer.

And for Gosh sake, break down the gun and look at the rails, the sub chassis etc. Is it steel or is it aluminum. COMPARE side by side. If you are going to shoot often and a lot of lead down range, these are things you need to know. I would not want a aluminum chassis gun for any reason, simply because I shoot my EDC often I want steel. And I want a gun to hold up. I have had too many aluminum chassis, simply fold like a weak lawn chair when any substantial ammo is fired down range.
Break your final choices down and compare.

Last edited by Carl the Floor Walker; January 7, 2019 at 10:33 AM.
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Old January 7, 2019, 05:07 PM   #59
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I don't know if it's the smallest on the market, but the smallest 9x19mm pistol I own is the Kahr CM9.
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Old January 7, 2019, 09:44 PM   #60
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Carl,

I got the Shield weight from the poster above. If it’s actually 21 ounces, then that’s my new limit because I can definitely carry it in the front pocket, in fact I’ve been doing it for months with no issues, in a De Santis Nemesis holster. I can feel it’s there, and wouldn’t go for a long walk with it in that carry mode, but it definitely works for just bopping around Town.

The G43 and P 365 are clearly smaller and lighter, and because of this maybe preferable overall since they also shoot well. I already sold my Shield once to a buddy and then bought it back. Keeping it this time.

As for the LC9s, my first one WAS unreliable, with symptoms as described by Galloway. Wish I had learned of their fix before ditching it, it was very accurate. If Ruger has fixed the design flaw, great, it still has sharp recoil and a vulnerable mag release as I described.

You certainly are a fan of the little Berettas, I wouldn’t be surprised if their marketing department didn’t contact you at some point. Since you say the Nano is smaller than I remember it might be worth another look. I do remember the grip seemed too short and note you have added a finger extension to yours.
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Old January 9, 2019, 11:24 AM   #61
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I was searching through Google for information comparing all the smallest 9mm's currently available and I didn't find a "list" like I was wanting, just mainly people talking about a few different guns here and there. So I spent many hours compiling a list of all the smallest 9mm's I could find. Here is what I came up with:

Springfield XDs 3.3- 6.3"x4.4"x0.9"; 23oz; 7+1rnd; 7# trigger; $349

Ruger LC9s Pro- 6"x4.5"x0.9"; 17.2oz; 7+1rnd; 5# trigger; $229

Sig P365- 5.8"x4.3"x1"; 17.8oz;10+1rnd; 5.5# trigger; $499

Bond BullPup9- 5.1"x4.2"x0.96"; 17.5oz; 7+1rnd; 7# trigger; $891

Diamondback DB9- 5.6"×4"x0.8"; 11oz; 6+1rnd; 5.5# trigger; $156

Kimber Micro 9- 6.1"x4.1"x1.1"; 15.6oz; 7+1rnd; 5.75# trigger; $515

Kahr CM9- 5.42"x4"x0.9"; 14oz; 6+1rnd; 6.5# trigger; $285

S&W Shield- 6.1"x4.5"x1"; 18.3oz; 7+1 rnd; 5.5# trigger; $339

Sig P938 BRG- 5.9"x3.9"x1.1"; 16oz;7+1 rnd; 7.5# trigger; $510

Glock 43- 6.26"x4.25"x1.06"; 16.2oz; 6+1 rnd; 5.4# trigger; $419

Kel-Tec P-11- 5.6"x4.3"x1"; 14oz; 12+1 rnd; 9# trigger; $204

Kel-Tec PF-9- 5.85"x4.3"x0.88"; 12.7oz; 7+1 rnd; 5# trigger; $161
This is good information - information that I personally find rather helpful, since I like small 9mm's. I wish the poster started a new thread on this, as this one might get closed for resurrecting an old 2017 thread.
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Old January 10, 2019, 09:42 PM   #62
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An old thread started before I joined last year... but as long as they keep it going, had to add my 2 cents... this little Sig P938 gets my vote. Doesn't kick as much as some of the other 9mm mouse guns I've shot, thus I hit the target at 15 and 25 yards better with it.
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Old January 11, 2019, 01:08 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by M88
An old thread started before I joined last year... but as long as they keep it going, had to add my 2 cents... this little Sig P938 gets my vote. Doesn't kick as much as some of the other 9mm mouse guns I've shot, thus I hit the target at 15 and 25 yards better with it.
I own a few single-stack 9mm's. While my CM9 is slightly smaller than my P938, the Sig is by far the softest shooter. I like the P290RS as well despite being a little heavier and a long-DA trigger pull...both have excellent sights and accuracy.



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Old January 11, 2019, 07:34 AM   #64
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After posting 3 pictures with my LCP and my DB9, will someone please acknowledge that the DB9 is the smallest 9mm in production.

PLEASE
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Old January 11, 2019, 08:01 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by ROCK6 View Post
I own a few single-stack 9mm's. While my CM9 is slightly smaller than my P938, the Sig is by far the softest shooter. I like the P290RS as well despite being a little heavier and a long-DA trigger pull...both have excellent sights and accuracy.



ROCK6
HA! So I'm not the only guy with a pink pocket gun..
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Old January 11, 2019, 01:17 PM   #66
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Old January 12, 2019, 12:18 AM   #67
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I have to admit, I have considered buying a DB9 just to see if it would work.
I've got one. Don't carry it much any more, since I got my Sig P-365. Can be a little finicky with ammo, but two of the three mags feed Federal 124-gr HSTs fine, and the third feeds Hornady 115-gr Critical Defense without fail. Have had occasional jams with other types, and with WWB 115-gr ball. Don't much like the trigger pull, but it just disappears into my back pocket in a Kydex wallet holster.
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Old January 12, 2019, 12:25 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by USNRet93
HA! So I'm not the only guy with a pink pocket gun..
I should have added the caveat that the "raspberry" Ruger is my wife's gun I was just home over the holidays and we did a little range shooting. It's been a while since she's used it and she's moved beyond the long DAO trigger pull. She likes my Kahr CM9, so she plans to sell the Ruger and I'll give her my CM9 (which gives me an excuse to get the PM9 with some night sights).

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Old January 12, 2019, 08:15 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by ROCK6 View Post
I should have added the caveat that the "raspberry" Ruger is my wife's gun I was just home over the holidays and we did a little range shooting. It's been a while since she's used it and she's moved beyond the long DAO trigger pull.
ROCK6
Sure it is(wink, wink)..when I bought it for just about nuthing$, the gent that sold it said that it'll be easier to shoot the bad guy cuz he'll be laughing so hard..yup, it's 'rasberry'...

Shot it yesterday and it sux to shoot(recoil, but never had any failures) but fills the square of wee pocket pistol when I can't carry anything else.
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Old January 12, 2019, 08:23 AM   #70
Carl the Floor Walker
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Originally Posted by ROCK6 View Post
I own a few single-stack 9mm's. While my CM9 is slightly smaller than my P938, the Sig is by far the softest shooter. I like the P290RS as well despite being a little heavier and a long-DA trigger pull...both have excellent sights and accuracy.



ROCK6
Really nice collection you have. I am familiar with all of them (and all nice guns) and the two I like best from your collection is the Sig 938 and the Sig 290. I think the 290 would be a excellent buy and a very underrated gun. . Since you like collecting these Micro, may I suggest the Beretta Nano. For myself, it has become my personal favorite in every way. I found it to be the softest recoiling Micro 9mm out there.

Thanks for posting Brother. You and I share a common love of shooting the Smaller guns.
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