Who can make a firingpin?

BillSmith · July 26, 2019, 06:21 PM

I have Savage Stevens 555, 12ga. O/U. They are made in Turkey and as far as I can tell Savage is the only one who imports parts for this gun. Savage won’t sell parts for it so the only way to get replacement parts is to send the gun to Savage, pay the shipping, pay them for parts and labor, and if you are lucky you will get the gun back in 10 weeks OR ... find a gunsmith who can make what you need.
In my case the breach plate started showing noticeable signs of deformation from primer push back after a couple thousand rounds. After about 5,000 rounds the breach plate had deformed enough that it was rubbing on, and broke, the firing pin. The breach plate is a very simple oval shaped piece of metal with 2 holes drilled at an angle to match the firing pin channels and a 3rd hole for the fastening screw. The tolerances are pretty forgiving. I can make that myself with a hacksaw, file, and drill. The firing pin however requires a lathe, a milling machine and an experienced machinist to produce the very close tolerances required.
Does anyone know of a gunsmith in the Chicago area you would trust to make a firing pin for your gun? I’m planning to take it to Carter’s in Shabana IL. because they have a very good reputation for quality work. Any other suggestions would be appreciated.

Pahoo · July 26, 2019, 07:24 PM

BillSmith
Bill, understand that I do not know the configuration of your firing pin but I have made some for single-shot Stevens and Savages. Just guessing but Sounds like they are basically round-stock material. If so, most gun smiths could make you one. Any chance of posting a picture? ….

Be Safe !!!

1MoreFord · July 26, 2019, 07:30 PM

Don't forget the usual suspect. AKA machine shops.

**Unclenick** · July 27, 2019, 10:41 AM

I'm not sure why Savage won't sell them. If I had to guess, they may use different breech plate thicknesses to tweak final headspace, then have to choose a firing pin length to match it.

I've made firing pins, too. If the shape is short and not complex (and unless Savage changed the pins since the model 550, they fit that description), using a drill as your lathe and files and a micrometer will get you the needed cylindrical profiles with practice. The files are used to make flats or other deviations from the cylindrical afterward. Use 0-1 oil-hardening drill rod purchased to match your biggest required diameter. If you've never done it, you will mess up a half-dozen on the way to success, but the drill rod comes in 36" lengths, so one piece gives you plenty of tries.

This could also be the excuse you need to get the small hobby lathe you always wanted.

The hard part (literally) is hardening and tempering the steel. You want to quench it dead hard and draw it back to about 800°F to get the approximate hardness of a good quality hammerhead; hard enough not dent or lose shape on impact, but not brittle and prone to chipping. Unless you have an oven that gets this hot, you will have to eyeball the tempering. I have a knife oven, so I haven't had to do that for some time, but it can be managed if you make some extra parts. The trick is to leave a little stem at one end of the work that leads to a short section you can chuck in your drill. Using a propane torch you can heat to bright orange to quench the steel dead hard in some 30 weight oil by spinning it in the drill while you play the flame on it. Keep spinning as you go into the oil to prevent distortion. Then you want to clean any oxide or scale off. Spinning the piece in oil and steel wool followed, if necessary, with polish will do it. You can also pickle it in citric acid or sulfuric acid solutions and vinegar may help. Avoid hydrochloric acid or phosphoric acid as chlorine can greatly weaken steel and phosphoric acid leaves a phosphate layer. Then you heat it again, stopping just short of being able to detect a dull red glow in a dark room. You'll then be in the right range. The part will have a black oxide coating at that point. You can leave it on if you want to.

Welcome to your new hobby.

T. O'Heir · July 27, 2019, 01:46 PM

"...not sure why Savage won't..." Probably a liability thing.
"...find a gunsmith who can make what you need..." Who quite likely won't be any faster than Savage and probably sends time consuming jobs like that out to a machine shop. See below. It applies to smithies too.
"...AKA machine shops..." Current rates are over $100 per hour plus set up time and you need to supply a machinist's drawing or a sample that said drawing can be made from at additional cost.
"...hard part (literally) is hardening and tempering..." Yep. And that has to be done right or the thing will bend or break.
Try these guys. They don't list any Savages(not that it is really a Savage), but they may know where you can get one.
https://www.firingpins.com/

dahermit · July 27, 2019, 03:15 PM

Quote:

...heat to bright orange...

The Ferrite must turn to Austenite in order for hardening to take place. A more precise way of knowing when that happens is that when the Ferrite Space Lattice turns to Austenite Space Lattice, it becomes nonmagnetic. The "bright orange" may mean something slightly different to different people.
Also of concern is that High Carbon Tool Steel (W-1, O-1 Drill Rod), has a property called, "hot short"...you get it too hot and things of small section like a firing pin, may fall apart.

BillSmith · July 27, 2019, 05:08 PM

Pahoo,
Thanks for the reply. This one is a little more than just turning down a piece of round stock. It has a groove cut through it at a compound angle and this gun has an aluminum alloy receiver. For that reason I think it needs to be made to very tight tolerances. I’m afraid that even small imperfections in the firing pin could result in wear of the aluminum alloy firing pin channel. Maybe I’m over thinking it and making it more complicated than it needs to be.

------------------------
It’s the land of the free BECAUSE of the brave.

BillSmith · July 27, 2019, 05:09 PM

Unclenick,
Savage says they will not sell any parts for this gun, not limited to just the firing pins and breach plate. Not sure why. The breach plate on this is maybe 3/4” long x 3/8” wide. It doesn’t cover the entire breach but instead is inset into a recess in the breach face so you really couldn’t adjust the thickness to tune headspace.
I do like the way you think and I appreciate both the suggestion and the details. I grew up on a farm and am quite accustom to making what I need when I can. I use my drill press as a makeshift lathe similar to what you are describing here. If this gun had a normal steel receiver instead of aluminum alloy I’d make it myself but I’m worried that even a small imperfection in the firing pin would cause the soft aluminum alloy of the firing pin channel to wear abnormally.
What are the odds that it would warp, even slightly, during heat treating? I understand that spinning it in a drill while heating and quenching will help reduce the odds but even a slight warp would cause it to run in the channel. I guess if it did warp slightly I could go back to the dirllpress-lathe and take just a little off so it didn’t rub as long as it wasn’t so much that it left the pin sloppy lose? Am I overthinking this? Do you think I’m worried about nothing?

------------------------
It’s the land of the free BECAUSE of the brave.

Bill DeShivs · July 27, 2019, 08:17 PM

Make it out of O-1 drill rod, and I'll heat treat it for you.You pay the postage.
And, you are overthinking it. How does the finish look on the old pin?

51cskipper · July 28, 2019, 02:59 PM

Bill, check with Bob's Gun Parts
[email protected]

Fax (501) 767-2750

tango1niner · July 29, 2019, 03:19 PM

How about for an alternate steel use pre-hardened 4140 or 4340 which when hardened to RC-35-38 or so is pretty tough yet still machinable. (Think of your mechanics wrenches) I believe it would be slightly harder than most centerfire receivers and barrels which are around RC-32 range. Or maybe an old 3/8" or 1/2" drive extension (think ratchet & sockets). I live in the boonies and sometimes need a piece of hardened steel in a hurry and this is my mind wandering...

tangolima · August 1, 2019, 12:42 AM

I retipped several broken firing pins with spring stock. I even made a firing pin from scratch for a client's Ruby pistol. I didn't have a lathe, so a cordless drill and files were the tools. Material is mild steel rod. The part was case hardened after final fitting.

If you can model the part on 3D modeling software, such as solidwork, you can send the file to places online for cnc machining. They are not cheap but are less than half what a machine shop would charge. It may be cheaper than hiring a gunsmith. PM me for those online companies.

-TL

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

Pahoo · August 1, 2019, 03:34 PM

BillSmith
I'm a bit confused. Isn't the 555 a current model or current enough to still get parts. …

Quote:

Savage says they will not sell any parts for this gun, not limited to just the firing pins and breach plate.

For you or anyone? Their better be a good reason why they are telling you this. Surely they would sell to a licensed Smith or perhaps you could bight the bullet and send it in for repairs. I have worked with Savage for a number of years and they are always very helpful. Ask them what they suggest you do to resolve the problem with "their" shotgun? ……

Be Safe !!!

**Unclenick** · August 2, 2019, 10:00 AM

I think he already said they want him to send it in. I don't know why, either.

BillSmith,

If you get a 36" length of 0-1 rod, you have enough to make a lot of mistakes before getting it right. Then take Bill DeShivs up on his offer to heat treat it for you.

hdbiker · August 2, 2019, 11:22 AM

I once made a firing pin for my Stevens single shot .410, out of a grade eight bolt and my Dremel tool. Still working fine today hdbiker

**Unclenick** · August 4, 2019, 04:56 PM

Hdbiker,

I am still failing to envisage why you had to cut up part of a Dremel tool to make the pin?

Alex Johnson · August 10, 2019, 09:53 PM

Sounds like a good time to get a small lathe. Look at the Taig lathes, I have one and with a milling attachment you can do some basic mill work. As an added bonus they are American made, high quality, and relatively inexpensive.

Pahoo · August 11, 2019, 11:00 AM

There is a video on You-Tub that describes how to make a firing pin. I believe he mention the use of Grade-8 threaded fastener. Back in my teens, I made mine out of cheap, used or broken screwdrivers. If you decide to make one, it's important that you put a small radius when the pin-tip meets the body of the pin. …..

Be Safe !!!

July 26, 2019, 06:21 PM	#1
BillSmith Junior Member Join Date: August 25, 2017 Posts: 8	Who can make a firingpin? I have Savage Stevens 555, 12ga. O/U. They are made in Turkey and as far as I can tell Savage is the only one who imports parts for this gun. Savage won’t sell parts for it so the only way to get replacement parts is to send the gun to Savage, pay the shipping, pay them for parts and labor, and if you are lucky you will get the gun back in 10 weeks OR ... find a gunsmith who can make what you need. In my case the breach plate started showing noticeable signs of deformation from primer push back after a couple thousand rounds. After about 5,000 rounds the breach plate had deformed enough that it was rubbing on, and broke, the firing pin. The breach plate is a very simple oval shaped piece of metal with 2 holes drilled at an angle to match the firing pin channels and a 3rd hole for the fastening screw. The tolerances are pretty forgiving. I can make that myself with a hacksaw, file, and drill. The firing pin however requires a lathe, a milling machine and an experienced machinist to produce the very close tolerances required. Does anyone know of a gunsmith in the Chicago area you would trust to make a firing pin for your gun? I’m planning to take it to Carter’s in Shabana IL. because they have a very good reputation for quality work. Any other suggestions would be appreciated.

July 26, 2019, 07:24 PM	#2
Pahoo Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2006 Location: IOWA Posts: 8,783	Can you provide a picture or link BillSmith Bill, understand that I do not know the configuration of your firing pin but I have made some for single-shot Stevens and Savages. Just guessing but Sounds like they are basically round-stock material. If so, most gun smiths could make you one. Any chance of posting a picture? …. Be Safe !!! __________________ 'Fundamental truths' are easy to recognize because they are verified daily through simple observation and thus, require no testing.

July 27, 2019, 10:41 AM	#4
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,061	I'm not sure why Savage won't sell them. If I had to guess, they may use different breech plate thicknesses to tweak final headspace, then have to choose a firing pin length to match it. I've made firing pins, too. If the shape is short and not complex (and unless Savage changed the pins since the model 550, they fit that description), using a drill as your lathe and files and a micrometer will get you the needed cylindrical profiles with practice. The files are used to make flats or other deviations from the cylindrical afterward. Use 0-1 oil-hardening drill rod purchased to match your biggest required diameter. If you've never done it, you will mess up a half-dozen on the way to success, but the drill rod comes in 36" lengths, so one piece gives you plenty of tries. This could also be the excuse you need to get the small hobby lathe you always wanted. The hard part (literally) is hardening and tempering the steel. You want to quench it dead hard and draw it back to about 800°F to get the approximate hardness of a good quality hammerhead; hard enough not dent or lose shape on impact, but not brittle and prone to chipping. Unless you have an oven that gets this hot, you will have to eyeball the tempering. I have a knife oven, so I haven't had to do that for some time, but it can be managed if you make some extra parts. The trick is to leave a little stem at one end of the work that leads to a short section you can chuck in your drill. Using a propane torch you can heat to bright orange to quench the steel dead hard in some 30 weight oil by spinning it in the drill while you play the flame on it. Keep spinning as you go into the oil to prevent distortion. Then you want to clean any oxide or scale off. Spinning the piece in oil and steel wool followed, if necessary, with polish will do it. You can also pickle it in citric acid or sulfuric acid solutions and vinegar may help. Avoid hydrochloric acid or phosphoric acid as chlorine can greatly weaken steel and phosphoric acid leaves a phosphate layer. Then you heat it again, stopping just short of being able to detect a dull red glow in a dark room. You'll then be in the right range. The part will have a black oxide coating at that point. You can leave it on if you want to. Welcome to your new hobby. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

July 27, 2019, 01:46 PM	#5
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...not sure why Savage won't..." Probably a liability thing. "...find a gunsmith who can make what you need..." Who quite likely won't be any faster than Savage and probably sends time consuming jobs like that out to a machine shop. See below. It applies to smithies too. "...AKA machine shops..." Current rates are over $100 per hour plus set up time and you need to supply a machinist's drawing or a sample that said drawing can be made from at additional cost. "...hard part (literally) is hardening and tempering..." Yep. And that has to be done right or the thing will bend or break. Try these guys. They don't list any Savages(not that it is really a Savage), but they may know where you can get one. https://www.firingpins.com/ __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

July 27, 2019, 08:17 PM	#9
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 10,981	Make it out of O-1 drill rod, and I'll heat treat it for you.You pay the postage. And, you are overthinking it. How does the finish look on the old pin? __________________ Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler www.billdeshivs.com

July 26, 2019, 07:30 PM	#3
1MoreFord Senior Member Join Date: July 30, 2014 Location: Arkansas Posts: 244	Don't forget the usual suspect. AKA machine shops.

July 27, 2019, 05:08 PM	#7
BillSmith Junior Member Join Date: August 25, 2017 Posts: 8	Pahoo, Thanks for the reply. This one is a little more than just turning down a piece of round stock. It has a groove cut through it at a compound angle and this gun has an aluminum alloy receiver. For that reason I think it needs to be made to very tight tolerances. I’m afraid that even small imperfections in the firing pin could result in wear of the aluminum alloy firing pin channel. Maybe I’m over thinking it and making it more complicated than it needs to be. ------------------------ It’s the land of the free BECAUSE of the brave.

July 27, 2019, 05:09 PM	#8
BillSmith Junior Member Join Date: August 25, 2017 Posts: 8	Unclenick, Savage says they will not sell any parts for this gun, not limited to just the firing pins and breach plate. Not sure why. The breach plate on this is maybe 3/4” long x 3/8” wide. It doesn’t cover the entire breach but instead is inset into a recess in the breach face so you really couldn’t adjust the thickness to tune headspace. I do like the way you think and I appreciate both the suggestion and the details. I grew up on a farm and am quite accustom to making what I need when I can. I use my drill press as a makeshift lathe similar to what you are describing here. If this gun had a normal steel receiver instead of aluminum alloy I’d make it myself but I’m worried that even a small imperfection in the firing pin would cause the soft aluminum alloy of the firing pin channel to wear abnormally. What are the odds that it would warp, even slightly, during heat treating? I understand that spinning it in a drill while heating and quenching will help reduce the odds but even a slight warp would cause it to run in the channel. I guess if it did warp slightly I could go back to the dirllpress-lathe and take just a little off so it didn’t rub as long as it wasn’t so much that it left the pin sloppy lose? Am I overthinking this? Do you think I’m worried about nothing? ------------------------ It’s the land of the free BECAUSE of the brave.

July 28, 2019, 02:59 PM	#10
51cskipper Member Join Date: March 7, 2019 Location: California Posts: 60	Bill, check with Bob's Gun Parts [email protected] Fax (501) 767-2750 __________________ The strongest reason for the people to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against the tyranny of government. -- Thomas Jefferson

July 29, 2019, 03:19 PM	#11
tango1niner Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2009 Location: NY Posts: 317	How about for an alternate steel use pre-hardened 4140 or 4340 which when hardened to RC-35-38 or so is pretty tough yet still machinable. (Think of your mechanics wrenches) I believe it would be slightly harder than most centerfire receivers and barrels which are around RC-32 range. Or maybe an old 3/8" or 1/2" drive extension (think ratchet & sockets). I live in the boonies and sometimes need a piece of hardened steel in a hurry and this is my mind wandering...

August 1, 2019, 12:42 AM	#12
tangolima Senior Member Join Date: September 28, 2013 Posts: 3,816	I retipped several broken firing pins with spring stock. I even made a firing pin from scratch for a client's Ruby pistol. I didn't have a lathe, so a cordless drill and files were the tools. Material is mild steel rod. The part was case hardened after final fitting. If you can model the part on 3D modeling software, such as solidwork, you can send the file to places online for cnc machining. They are not cheap but are less than half what a machine shop would charge. It may be cheaper than hiring a gunsmith. PM me for those online companies. -TL Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

August 2, 2019, 10:00 AM	#14
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,061	I think he already said they want him to send it in. I don't know why, either. BillSmith, If you get a 36" length of 0-1 rod, you have enough to make a lot of mistakes before getting it right. Then take Bill DeShivs up on his offer to heat treat it for you. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

August 2, 2019, 11:22 AM	#15
hdbiker Senior Member Join Date: December 19, 2012 Posts: 297	I once made a firing pin for my Stevens single shot .410, out of a grade eight bolt and my Dremel tool. Still working fine today hdbiker

August 4, 2019, 04:56 PM	#16
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,061	Hdbiker, I am still failing to envisage why you had to cut up part of a Dremel tool to make the pin? __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

August 10, 2019, 09:53 PM	#17
Alex Johnson Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2000 Location: Grand Forks, ND Posts: 812	Sounds like a good time to get a small lathe. Look at the Taig lathes, I have one and with a milling attachment you can do some basic mill work. As an added bonus they are American made, high quality, and relatively inexpensive. __________________ I thoroughly disapprove of duels. I consider them unwise and I know they are dangerous. Also, sinful. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet retired spot and kill him. - Mark Twain

August 11, 2019, 11:00 AM	#18
Pahoo Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2006 Location: IOWA Posts: 8,783	Rolling your own There is a video on You-Tub that describes how to make a firing pin. I believe he mention the use of Grade-8 threaded fastener. Back in my teens, I made mine out of cheap, used or broken screwdrivers. If you decide to make one, it's important that you put a small radius when the pin-tip meets the body of the pin. ….. Be Safe !!! __________________ 'Fundamental truths' are easy to recognize because they are verified daily through simple observation and thus, require no testing.